JazzG I think he makes too many mistakes for a top keeper. He’s had some superb performances but apart from his first 6 or so months his form has been very patchy. Too many times giving away cheap goals. I’m glad Arteta has noticed this, for a top side simply hasn’t shown he is good enough imo.

Maybe this is the kick up the arse he needs.

To be honest, I think the most parsimonious explanation for his performance levels is that the overall variance in his performance is just what you ought to normally expect from a slightly above average starting PL keeper. He's still kinda young but it's worrying if we're really aiming for the very top.

      Wild….that’s a bold signal. Not sure I’m supportive as I think Ramsdale is solid, and a big part of our identity.

        MistaT

        I love it myself. Arteta's relentless. He wants every single player on their toes, fighting tooth and nail for their place in the team.

        At this point, it's probably only Ødegaard, who's club captain, and Saka, who's our best player, who are guaranteed starters. Maybe Saliba and Gabriel Jesus at a push, too.

            Ricky1985 Saliba and Gabriel is certainly undroppable. Arteta has never dropped them.

            Just curious that you think Ramsdale is absolutely top class and one of the best out there but feel he's not one of Arteta's guaranteed starter?

                We need a new keeper. Ramsdale has been bad for a while now and this pre season he went a lvl bellow that to shit. But Raya is not the answer. 183 tall, no, never. Don't care how good he kicks the ball, he is a midget for keepers, no go for me

                Clrnc
                Raamdale has been one Arteta's guaranteed starters to this point, but if he signs Raya then he'll have a fight on his hands because Raya is very good and also well suited to the style of football we try to play.

                I think Ramsdale is the better goalkeeper, and will go onto become one of the very best goalkeepers around as soon as next season, but having two quality, hand-picked options vying for the position is what elite clubs should do.

                It's also a good opportunity to take advantage of with Raya only having 12 months left on his contract, and Nottingham Forest perhaps being willing to offer us decent money for Turner. I can't imagine Raya would ask for crazy money, he's a good age, could become a top class keeper, years of PL experience, and we could perhaps get him for a net £15-20m. It's a no brainer.

                I'm sure Arteta would do the same at right wing with Saka if a similar opportunity was there.

                    He's certainly a much better shot-stopper than Ramsdale, only bettered by Leno and Alisson.

                    Emi hasn't been more than decent in the last couple of years, no reason going back for him now (even in the WC he was underwhelming other than PKs and that one huge save - there aren't that many shootouts while playing for your club).

                    Ricky1985 Brentford reportedly refused to barge from their 40m pound valuation of Raya which is why Spuds were to sign the Italian goalie after their approaches got rebuffed.

                        Meatwad and if we aren't careful our identity will be that of bottlers.

                        This likely won't mean Raya either arrives at Arsenal, or that he displaces Ramsdale. But it's a stick to instill a bit of holy fear, not just in Ramsdale, but any player who imagines last season's fade is acceptable.

                        The members of our squad receive loyalty and encouragement at the moment, we need this flip side.

                          Clrnc

                          So, maybe they drop to £30m + £5m or something - or risk losing him for free - and we get £10m-15m from Forest for Turner. Hence the £15-20m net cost of signing Raya.

                          Raya would no doubt push very hard for this to happen too (we're Arsenal, we're in the Champions League, and he worked really well with our GK coach at Brentford), which would strengthen our hand considerably compared to Tottenham - who wants to join that shit show right now?

                              I love this rumor. We're looking for excellent competition in a position we're already strong. Now do the same for right wing and center forward. This shows we mean business. It also gives me hope we're going to do the same for other light positions. Opportunistic signings

                              Imagine Rams gets injured or slumps or anything, you got a top top player to come in without a drop in quality or vice versa. This should be the case across the whole team.

                              Ricky1985 Make sense.

                              I think this further confirms we are extremely cash rich if we can even manage to improve our backup goalie with a 30m+ signing (not withstanding the fee we might receive for Turner). That would mean we have 2 of the best goalkeeping duo in the entire world. Not even Bayern, Barca, Madrid etc has a 2nd choice as good as Raya.

                              Ramsdale averageness in shot stopping means Raya definitely have a chance to be number 1 here.

                                  Pepe LeFrits stats like this don't make sense to put much thought into. GKs for lesser teams will obviously have more saves.

                                  Shot-stopping is fairly well measured by the difference between post-shot xG (taking quality of the shot into consideration, i.e. shots off target will have an xG of zero) and goals. Raya saved 5 more than he should statistically be expected to. Alisson 10. Ramsdale should've saved 2 more. There are slight differences in calculations, just like in xG for teams. As you see in Clrnc's post above, Orbinho has Alisson as 8.5 instead of 10, which is from Fbref.

                                  The thinking behind Ramsdale is clearly that what he does with the ball compensates for his below average shot-stopping, and probably that his shot-stopping will improve. Maybe they've become unsure of the latter. Unicorns like Alisson who excels at both things don't grow on trees, but Raya seems very capable.

                                    Clrnc

                                    Everyone in the PL is very rich. United are paying a fortune for a 20 year old kid with basically no pedigree. Aston Villa spend like it's going out of fashion - they all do!

                                    Having quality players competing with each other is what you've got to do if you want to be the best. And, whether it becomes reality or not, that is very much what Arteta and the guys running Arsenal are trying to do.

                                      DiabyKungFu I agree, he isn't a top drawer keeper but is solid. Like you said we have a manager who is aspiring for the very top and this guy isn't it. Then again I'm not sure if Raya is either but I think he would be an improvement.

                                      Clrnc When he first broke into our team after 6 months everyone was calling for him to be England's starting keeper. Over time though I think it is clear why he is third choice and the keepers who are ahead of him aren't exactly top drawer either.

                                      Personally I think Ramsdale is very overrated by Arsenal fans. Even the top keepers make mistakes but not as many as him. Also some of the goals he lets in I always think a better keeper saves them.

                                          Clrnc That would mean we have 2 of the best goalkeeping duo in the entire world. Not even Bayern, Barca, Madrid etc has a 2nd choice as good as Raya.

                                          On the other hand, we won't have a first choice close to as good as theirs.