Mykhaylo Mudryk, Ukrainian Wizard: Page 33 - The Arsenal discussion community: One More in the Tolly

Mykhaylo Mudryk, Ukrainian Wizard

Bring Back Kerrea Gilbert

RocktheCasbah if we're signing him from Chelsea he'll definitely be 32.

Clrnc

Shakthar CEO interview about Mudryk. Summarised here so you might not need to watch it.

We offered exactly the same amount as Chelsea, 100m.
The difference came from the structure of the add-ons which he says ours was very complicated, he calls our proposal "very hard to close deal"
Chelsea came in the and closed the deal within a day after spending an entire day together with them.
Confirms Mudryk seems like he wanted to come here instead and we got into his head after talking to him so many times. "Arteta, Edu, Zinchenko" he mentioned.
Then said Chelsea asked him for permission to contact the player late in december and he agreed
Even though we "tapped" his player up without his permission, he doesn't blame us and calls us good and professional in negotiations
They actually agreed to sell to Brentford for much lower right after the war began in 2022, but deal fell through due to agent demands.

Don Pacifico

Clrnc They actually agreed to sell to Brentford for much lower right after the war began in 2022, but deal fell through due to agent demands.

I always felt like this aspect of the deal want scrutinised sufficiently. We were interested last summer, so why did we wait until now?

QuincyAbeyie

I'm guessing we weren't planning on becoming title challengers. By all accounts we didn't buy Pedro Neto/a winger because Elneny got injured and we switched our attention to Douglas Luiz.

More money has probably been made available now.

MistaT

We’ve probably become assured we’ll be in the CL next year which opens up our finances. With more incoming cash we can spend more in wages/transfers and still be FFP compliant.

Don Pacifico

But I'm not convinced that his purchase was dependent on our current trajectory given we were already interested; I guess my point is, he was c. £25m then and in the time that we waited, his price went to by 3-4 times that amount so we lost any competitive advantage we could have had on the market.

For me, it reminds me of all the stories about how Cagigao was fundamental to our big signings yet in many cases (eg. Partey) had recommended then years before we pulled the trigger, meaning we could have saved money and reinvested it elsewhere in the squad (etc.). I know recruitment isn't that straightforward and the risk you have paying big fees is offset usually by greater certainty that the player is ready/quality but I do feel in the case of Mudryk (even before Chelsea swooped in) that we operated sub-optimally.

Clrnc

Don Pacifico We probably didn't plan that ahead and like what many said we probably didn't think of being title challengers.

That said I do agree with you in the sense that if we wanted him this badly we could have gotten him for 30-40m euros in the summer. But yeah we did switch focus in the very last min when Elneny got injured and then got nobody.

One more reasonable reason would be that we ain't that sure about his trajectory and wanted to use the upcoming UCL to judge him further and he did excel greatly in all 6 matches tbf.

goon

Worth bearing in mind too that he's played 35% of his career games since the summer too, including that game against Madrid. In the summer he would have been an early catch, some of that cloud of uncertainty has been lifted since then so he'd naturally cost more and be more appealing. He wasn't even second choice in the summer, we had our eyes fixed on Raphinha and then Neto.

If we're honest the reason we were willing to go so high is out of desperation. Mudryk should not really be costing much more than £50-60m all in and that's including a premium.

Claudius

This is exactly the challenge with young talent. I don’t think it would’ve been unreasonable for Arteta and Edu to say in August “this kid basically only has limited experience in a third tier domestic league. Let’s give him another half season and see him in Champions League.” When the player was being negotiated around £30-40m last summer, that doesn’t seem an absurd stance. I don’t think anybody expected the cost to triple in 4 months. So I can see how they could’ve gambler and paid a massive price.
Edit: basically per @goon

Clrnc

More details about the difference with Chelsea bid emerging from Shakthar side. Basically speed of the add ons payments faster from Chelsea and some of the add ons more realistic. Basically they think Chelsea was more sincere since the speed of paymebt was faster even though he said everything was almost exactly the same in value.

We probably put in things like winning the UCL etc...

Don Pacifico

I suspect (hope) we put in some very reasonable clauses to cover our backs. It's the sustainable way to manage these crazy fees that clubs expect from the PL teams.

Burnwinter

Claudius It’s interesting that now journalists and ITKs are automatically saying the selling club is demanding €100m for many of the players we are after right now, including Diani, Raphinha and Rice

Lot of wishful thinking going on. Mudryk's price was set based on his chance of having huge upside. An established player might be better value now but doesn't have that potential value growth.

Don Pacifico I suspect (hope) we put in some very reasonable clauses to cover our backs. It's the sustainable way to manage these crazy fees that clubs expect from the PL teams.

Adjustments aside, if a selling club's saying "this player is worth £20m more because they'll win you the Champions League", it's hardly too rude to say "we'll pay you £20m more for this player if we win the Champions League"

Not to get into the battle of "is versus ought" with football transfers of all the things, but any club insisting £100m is the "new benchmark" for any player that either is CL quality, or might be in the future is talking shit …

Here's a (potentially dodgy) 2023 estimate of total squad values in the PL

https://www.planetfootball.com/quick-reads/premier-league-squad-cost-each-transfer-window-net-spend-liverpool-man-united-city/

Total estimated value of all 20 PL squads is just shy of €8bn, there are 500 registered players so €16m is now the average for a PL player.

Take just the top four squads by value and the average is €34m.

Take just the first XIs and it rises, but …

lorddulaarsenal

Hype train for Mudryk is massive now. He’ll instantly be targetted

Claudius

It’s interesting that now journalists and ITKs are automatically saying the selling club is demanding €100m for many of the players we are after right now, including Diani, Raphinha and Rice. Chelsea and United are legitimising bubble behaviour with their irrational purchases. Trossard probably makes sense for now, with the team keeping its powder dry for a massive frontline purchase in the summer like Kvaratskhelia or Leao

Claudius

Btw, for those upset that we didn’t lean in with Mudryk. We have a few projects on the go right now from outside the academy, bought at different prices. Lokonga, Marquinhos, Tavares, Trusty and Vieira etc.

We are making gambles and acquiring players before they might explode. Let’s see how many of these pan out. Most of these bets look more like Martinelli. Pay low for an emerging talent and take the risk of his development. The pricing on both the Felix and Mudryk deals didn’t make sense

Gunner89

Regarding Mudryk's pricing skyrocketing- His statistics before this season were very poor for goals/assists but obviously, the scouts who watch him and the analysts crunching their data saw potential.

Come this season- He exploded to scoring and assisting at nearly a goal a league game and scoring 3 in the CL Group stage.

I'm unsure of what Mudryk's real value is but there was obvious scope for it to grow significantly due to his performances in 4 months.

IMO - We should have made a move for him last summer when we were looking at Neto and then once our CM's got injured we tried for that Luiz chap.

Ideally, we need a top class CM and a Winger to compete on 2 fronts.

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