Kaepernick: Page 3 - The Arsenal discussion community: One More in the Tolly

Kaepernick

Burnwinter

Savz wrote:
Still gotta assume.. I know nothing about this man.

He could have made a couple bad choices as a teenager only to realise his mistakes later on in life. He may look at the tattoo and hate it. Nobody knows, but we got a couple guys in here talking amongst themselves insinuating that he's definitely a Nazi, he should know a bit more before saying he's definitely one, right?

You need to follow some of these trains of thought to their logical conclusion.

Exactly one thread over from this one, you're advocating for young Muslim men who've committed no crime to be put in administrative detention and re-educated on suspicion of "susceptibility to radicalisation".

Savz

Stop saying that, I'm not advocating for innocent people to be put into a detention center. If they have reason to believe somebody is being radicalised or is a certified fanatic, to which they have solid proof, then I am for that person being placed in a detention center and re-educated, hopefully it'll bring that person back to fucking reality.

Burnwinter

Your first and second sentences seem to directly contradict each other to my eyes.

You're advocating for ordinary people who've committed no recognised offence (beyond perhaps a newly invented "susceptibility to radicalisation") to be placed in a special facility. Meanwhile every extenuating circumstance should be considered in the case of a working police officer covered in white supremacist tattoos.

This is honestly not antagonistic, but you tell me, because that's what I'm reading.

Rex

Meatwad wrote:
Rex wrote:
Because he has a dog named Rommel and a tattoo which says 'Fatherland' on his forearm? May want to google both those before you reply.

so because a nazi got fed up in '44 or '45 and was supportive of a plot to kill hitler means he was a good one? nothing significant happened before he got fed up? he's scum whether he's viewed as a hero in germany or not. and he had jewish slaves or unpaid servants if that's more delicate when he was in north africa.

I was definitely not disagreeing with you.

Qwiss

Burnwinter wrote:
Your first and second sentences seem to directly contradict each other to my eyes.

You're advocating for ordinary people who've committed no recognised offence (beyond perhaps a newly invented "susceptibility to radicalisation") to be placed in a special facility. Meanwhile every extenuating circumstance should be considered in the case of a working police officer covered in white supremacist tattoos.

This is honestly not antagonistic, but you tell me, because that's what I'm reading.

Lets keep the discussion of France to its own thread please.

Burnwinter

Aye aye, no prob, it was a compare and contrast exercise.

Meatwad

Rex wrote:
Meatwad wrote:
so because a nazi got fed up in '44 or '45 and was supportive of a plot to kill hitler means he was a good one? nothing significant happened before he got fed up? he's scum whether he's viewed as a hero in germany or not. and he had jewish slaves or unpaid servants if that's more delicate when he was in north africa.

I was definitely not disagreeing with you.

oh ok my bad. it's just that when this was making the rounds last week people were making excuses for this copper talking about how rommel was admired by the allies and how he was involved in a plot to kill hitler and he's one of the few people from that time that's still respected in germany. a bunch of plea copping.

Jens

The picture of the cop is a disgrace and judging by his tats his motive as to naming his dog Rommel seems pretty clear.

Rommel was not a Nazi however, but a member of the German officer core and a veteran from WW1, and those jewish slaves you're talking about Hitler had ordered killed, but Rommel refused to obey the order, which could have gotten him killed if Hitler found out.

Again I'm not defending the copper in the least, there are other parts of Rommels story that put him in a less favorable light and I could discuss that in depth but this has come a long way from the 49'ers back up QB.

jones

Rommel wasn't a staunch Nazi but he was a dedicated follower of Hitler (possibly not even as admiring of him as the other way round), a committed man of war. Saying he's "respected" in Germany however is completely wrong, outside of extreme far right circles nobody in their right mind would ever have anything positive to say about him, not even here, and rightly so.

Meatwad

my only knowledge him came from the history channel and according to them:

http://www.history.com/news/8-things-you-may-not-know-about-erwin-rommel

Unlike other prominent World War II-era Germans, Rommel has escaped mass vilification. In fact, his name still graces two military bases and several streets in Germany, and a monument in his hometown praises him as “chivalrous,” “brave” and a “victim of tyranny.”

jones

His hometown is a village in the middle of nowhere. Local glorification of tyrants happens everywhere, it's usually not exactly relevant to their overall assessment in society, even if that itself is more often than not grossly distorted. In Rommel's case it's not, he's not listed in the same category of Nazis as Göring, Goebbels or Heß but for what it's worth I don't think most Germans even know that he wasn't a "real" Nazi.

Fuck him anyways, he was a war criminal regardless of his personal ideology

Bold Tone

Burnwinter

jones wrote:
Fuck him anyways, he was a war criminal regardless of his personal ideology

Agreed, fuck him and all "noble Nazis", and Churchill too to be quite honest.

Kel Varnsen

Jens

Burnwinter wrote:
jones wrote:
Fuck him anyways, he was a war criminal regardless of his personal ideology

Agreed, fuck him and all "noble Nazis", and Churchill too to be quite honest.

That's quite a black and white way to view the world. You are fine with putting Stauffenberg in with Himmler and Göring?

Burnwinter

I'm not saying everyone's the same, but I am saying one shouldn't erase the complicity of a violent system's senior officials in that system's violence.

At some stage we'll all have to start giving people a social and material penalty for extracting value from that sort of role in our own time—doing so with respect to the historical record is a preparatory discipline.

Meatwad

Kel Varnsen wrote:

figures you would post that. that's why i got my own guns. i've never called the racist pigs asking for help and never will.

Bold Tone

You do have a point as the police are your fellow Americans.

BTW, i thought Kel posted that for an entirely different reason ...

jones

Jens wrote:
Burnwinter wrote:
Agreed, fuck him and all "noble Nazis", and Churchill too to be quite honest.

That's quite a black and white way to view the world. You are fine with putting Stauffenberg in with Himmler and Göring?

Stauffenberg was a staunch national socialist, racist and fascist for most of his career in the NSDAP and probably wouldn't have turned against Hitler if it weren't for him losing the war - fuck him indeed, even if he wasn't as bad as Himmler and Göring. If there's any prominent ex-Nazi I'd class differently it'd be the real mastermind behind Operation Valkyrie, Henning von Tresckow, but even his motives weren't exactly pure

Meatwad

Bold Tone wrote:
You do have a point as the police are your fellow Americans.

BTW, i thought Kel posted that for an entirely different reason ...

so it wasn't the typical beta libertarian (real libertarians can protect themselves and their property) bullshit you get from trey and matt and all these other ayn rand fanboys?

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