General Mirth wrote:

This literally makes no sense, you don't get 'lucky' for 20 odd years because Wenger reinvented himself during that period, just like any other coach would have done and worked well until 2008.

You don't understand the meaning of the word 'luck' do you? Circumstances are always going for and against you but no more or less than any other manager around at the time, and the success that we got was merited and deliberate in thought and execution.

What are you talking about 20 years? Wenger did fuck all in world football unless you count the Emperors cup (oh the irony ), then he was extremely successful for the period 98-05 then nothing.
For me luck is the confluence of many events leading to a favourable/unfavourable outcome.
He was right for us and we were right for him at the time but the time and circumstances changed.

General Mirth wrote:

But clubs that aren't Man City, Real Madrid or Chelsea don't work like that.

Trophies are of paramount importance to any Champions league team but not the only target they set themselves, if you don't see that then you're not the 'realist' you claim to be.

I don't care about those clubs we should look at ourselves first.

General Mirth wrote:

And just to stay on topic: van Persie is predominately left footed.

Indeed, and he hits the posts a lot.

Biggus wrote:

General Mirth wrote:

This literally makes no sense, you don't get 'lucky' for 20 odd years because Wenger reinvented himself during that period, just like any other coach would have done and worked well until 2008.

You don't understand the meaning of the word 'luck' do you? Circumstances are always going for and against you but no more or less than any other manager around at the time, and the success that we got was merited and deliberate in thought and execution.

What are you talking about 20 years? Wenger did fuck all in world football unless you count the Emperors cup (oh the irony ), then he was extremely successful for the period 98-05 then nothing.
For me luck is the confluence of many events leading to a favourable/unfavourable outcome.
He was right for us and we were right for him at the time but the time and circumstances changed.

Didn't he finish second with Monaco for three years straight when Marseille were judged to be corrupt and subsequently relegated to the second division in a similar fashion to Juventus? He also did win that league once and got to a uefa final while bring through a host of players that played a part in the WC win of 98 + a WPOTY winner. The modern day equivalent of that coach would be talked of quite highly because of the internet and 24 coverage. I know he was eventually sacked but that was after Bayern Munch allegedly tried to sign him and he turned him down to commit to his contract, so he wasn't a nobody either.

And that's not luck at all because there's no element of chance or randomness. I don't know about you, but I find implications of being lucky quite derogatory as if the necessary effort was not put in and, despite that, things worked out against all the odds.

Besides, it's impossible to apply over a career. In one football game there are half a dozen incidents that could go for and against you which makes all the difference in the world, apply that 50 odd times over 15 years and not counting external randomness like the rise of Chelsea and Man City or injuries or the fact that Bergkamp refused to fly away in Europe and summer transfer windows etc. You can't even begin to say if a person is lucky or not.

Biggus wrote:

General Mirth wrote:

But clubs that aren't Man City, Real Madrid or Chelsea don't work like that.

Trophies are of paramount importance to any Champions league team but not the only target they set themselves, if you don't see that then you're not the 'realist' you claim to be.

I don't care about those clubs we should look at ourselves first.

Would you care to in the interests of perspective?

League success is very closely correlated with wage spend. We don't spend the most on wages.

Our issue is that the board, our owners, our executives, and Wenger - and plenty of posters on this forum for that matter - can't see that fact for what it is.

The only strategic approach to winning football competions is spending. The rest is a combination of serendipity and ideological delusion, resting briefly on the shoulders of real quality that doesn't yet know its own price.

Wenger is one of the best at creating the conditions in which transient moments of that serendipity flourish, but no less subject to the final strategic limitation.

Van Persie. Wonder what's going through his head right now. The presence of Thierry would have done a bit to help lift his spirits and encourage him. Now he knows he has to fight basically singlehandedly for the next 3 months or so, just to try to get the team a fourth place finish. He can't be happy with the notion.

He looks to me to be feeling the effects of playing every single game.
Kind of leggy and slightly off the pace.

I don't get the feeling he's leggy and off the pace. I feel more like he's not getting any service whatsoever.

Claudius wrote:

I don't get the feeling he's leggy and off the pace. I feel more like he's not getting any service whatsoever.

That compounds the problem.
Earlier on in the season both Theo and Gervinho were finding him regularly, as were Song and Ramsey plus he himself dropped deeper to greater effect than he has being doing recently.
I may be seeing it incorrectly but to me he's just slightly slower and a touch more laboured - having said that it could easily have been attributable to the atrocious pitches in the Stadium of Light and San Siro.

most teams now know to mark him tighter, however you still see him make those runs into increasingly tinier pockets of space. Only problem is our midfield lacks the quality required to find him with that final perfect pass. Only person who can pick him out, with any irregularity is Song- and now even Dools wants him gone.

Song gets a bad rep. He's been forced to fill in for our absentee playmakers. That's why he gets forward and tries to be Black Fabregas.
Nobody has explained to me what exactly Arteta and Ramsey are supposed to be doing. I know Arteta gets a lot of passes, but I'm not sure if that's just to retain possession or if this is productive, incisive passing

Claudius wrote:

Song gets a bad rep. He's been forced to fill in for our absentee playmakers. That's why he gets forward and tries to be Black Fabregas.
Nobody has explained to me what exactly Arteta and Ramsey are supposed to be doing. I know Arteta gets a lot of passes, but I'm not sure if that's just to retain possession or if this is productive, incisive passing

Apparently his job is to run around like a headless chicken, pressing opponents.

Ron Burgundy wrote:

Claudius wrote:

Song gets a bad rep. He's been forced to fill in for our absentee playmakers. That's why he gets forward and tries to be Black Fabregas.
Nobody has explained to me what exactly Arteta and Ramsey are supposed to be doing. I know Arteta gets a lot of passes, but I'm not sure if that's just to retain possession or if this is productive, incisive passing

Apparently his job is to run around like a headless chicken, pressing opponents.

If thats the case then coquelin would do a much better job, he hunts down the ball aggressively.

Not sure, I think there's a difference between your form dropping and things not quite going your way from the scraps you're having to feed on. I dont see much difference in what RVP is doing now when compared to earlier in the season.

supply is worse. no one is getting to the goalline to cut it back, things like that.

Indeed, RvP has had next to nothing as regards chances recently, so its a nonsense to say his form is dropping off.
I'm more worried about his legs dropping off.

Van Persie had 2 chances in milan and only a wonder save prevented him scoring and should have had a penalty at the san siro and yesterday.

rvp is a miracle worker. can't fathom how he's outscored the likes of rooney and aguero despite the shower of shit supplying him. top class player, and i hope people don't get on his back if he hits a dry spell.

I don't think anyone should get on his back if his performance levels drop anyway, he must be exhausted at this stage.

Have to be honest though, I'm considering dropping him from my fantasy football team.

you don't expect players to be the business for the whole season. When it comes, ala Henry in his prime, you gotta be thankful.