Noni Madueke: Page 58 - The Arsenal discussion forum and community: One more in the Tolly

Noni Madueke

MistaT

I was going to make a post about fining Odegaard for passing to Madueke on that break, but then Ode tracked back and won the ball back.

Gurgen

JazzG you have hope for Madueke? Have you heard him speak? There is absolutely nothing going on upstairs.

JazzG

Gurgen He isn't going to be a first team player for us but I think he will be useful as a sub and rotation option for Saka. One thing which has surprised me though is he can't seem to get as many shots away as he did before. I think @DiabyKungFu touched on this a few weeks ago, his shot output is massively down. I don't know if that is down to him finding it harder as he plays against more compact sides or an issue with how we play, I suspect it is the former.

daredevil

Gunner89

People are going way too overboard with this. His biggest problem is that there's no end product but the discourse is as if he's a complete liability - which he's not.

Gunner89

daredevil

A player who adds nothing offensively, creatively and defensively is a liability

Nelson injuries aside is a better player

Nwaneri is on another level

Burnwinter

daredevil People are going way too overboard with this. His biggest problem is that there's no end product but the discourse is as if he's a complete liability - which he's not.

It's a bit out of hand. People discuss Madueke as if it's not a datum that Arteta uses him, or Tuchel takes him to the World Cup. The reality gap in the discourse is impressive. If you mention it the response is don't be ridiculous: Mikel Arteta doesn't know anything about football.

CPM

He is low on confidence right now. Not sure how high his ceiling is, but think we need to give a bit more time before we make a final judgment.

lorddulaarsenal

That video above is a hit piece - cut out that drag back pass to release Bruno.

I’ve got a lot of time for Noni. Big giant bloke with tremendous athleticism. He needs to play to his strengths more. Use that clipped ball post a cut in from the flank more

awooga83

Burnwinter I mean they can also be wrong and to be fair we've seen that a little with Arteta and some of the players he's brought in. No manager is faultless, same for tuchel who very much showed his limitations as well.

Madueke just isn't a good player because he has no end product that is a fatal failing fire ant forwards playing fire a top team. It's not because he's at Arsenal everything he is and his limitations were obvious at Chelsea. We got it wrong it happens the idea became Arteta picks him out cannot possibly be the case is crazy.

Meatwad

england took him because they can't do any better. we should be able to do better.

Claudius

Meatwad England took him to the World Cup because he isn’t the lead weight that people are trying to outcompete each other to describe. Bowen, Palmer, Foden all stayed home. This thread is hilarious.

--

He’s a back up. He was bought to be a back up. While he has zero productivity, his pace and ability to carry the ball into the final third and dangerous areas is critical to how we want to play. He can get it out there, and pass it on to the more creative players. I’m good with him until Saka/Max is ready. He plays his placeholder role well.

He is also defensively tuned in and can compete physically

TambourineMan

-- £50m is a lot to pay for what you've described, especially to Chelsea for a player they didn't want. I bet Chelsea could not believe their luck when we showed up at their door with £50m for this guy. It was an insane signing 12 months ago and nothing that has happened between then and now that has changed my mind on this. This was, is and forever will be an abysmal signing, made worse by the fact that he was a Chelsea reject that we helped them turn a large profit on. Just insane.

--

TambourineMan I disagree. What do you base that assertion on? 50m is just about the going price for players at his level. The squad was key for us last season. Two of the best managers in the game think he approximates adequately what a top player provides to get featured as back up at both club and international level.

Anyway I'm not really here to defend him - his shortcomings are clear. I think he's at about the same level as Gyokeres, but at least with him we know there's a genuinely world class player in rotation ahead of him in Saka, and possibly one coming up behind him. He's not a blocker and his minutes ideally are extremely limited (hopefully last season was the exception when it comes to Saka's availability).

RowJimmy

£50M is the current standard for a backup in an attacking position.

TambourineMan

RowJimmy would we be able to sell him for £50m today?

RowJimmy

TambourineMan
Probably not, because he's not been particularly successful. But we'd pay at least as much for a similar player (age, PL experience, perceived talent). Garnacho went for a similar amount. We paid a bit more for Gyokeres (also a backup, also essential as a backup to our having had enough depth to win the title).
I'd love to be able to move him on but fixating on what we spent in the past is pointless.

TambourineMan

RowJimmy but that's the point, it was obvious to everyone on this forum last summer (bar 3 or 4 folks) that he'd be a bad signing, and we're just a bunch of randoms on the internet. you'd expect the club to know better than us, and so, it's frustrating that they'd do something so obviously stupid.

I have no problem paying £50m for back-up players, but I do have a problem paying £50m for shit back-up players which is what Madueke is (and was last summer when we signed him).

Burnwinter

TambourineMan but that's the point, it was obvious to everyone on this forum last summer (bar 3 or 4 folks) that he'd be a bad signing, and we're just a bunch of randoms on the internet.

Well, split the difference. If the claim is it's possible to make a mistake when assessing a player, we all agree. If the point is that the technical leadership at Arsenal is likely to make this kind of mistake while the fans aren't, we should probably think it through. Just because some fans picked it right once doesn't rule out the many, many, many times that hasn't been the case.

That's what's being claimed: that by transfer-listing Nwaneri, the technical leadership at Arsenal is making a big mistake. I don't really buy this claim. Firstly, assessing a player the club hasn't worked with is one thing, but if the club has worked with him daily in training, that's another. Secondly, if there were doubts about it, there's no enormous pressure to sell him. Thirdly, I suspect it's Nwaneri and his people pushing to leave as much as anything.

awooga83

Burnwinter I think the main focus of this thread is Madueke was a bad signing, the impact it has on Nwaneri or other sales absolutely is speculative but we didn't need to put outlay on a forward who has no end product and despite my stance even if you thought at the club we should go for him we shouldn't have paid Chelsea's demand. He was a player they actively wanted to leave and they needed to sell to help their financial circumstances. That's exactly where you low ball and offer.

On the one hand we are talking about not wanting to follow the market trends and value for other players we've been interested and crediting that will doesn't matter what the markets say. Buy then with a player like Madueke if well that's just what it costs on the market is a total inconsistent approach to recruitment. Chelsea paid £38m and he hadn't got better with them. This does raise questions about the clubs approach because this isn't a sudden suprise in terms of the player we got he was like this at Chelsea so how the hell did we not see it.

Gazza M

he is who we thought he was, and we let him off the hook

RC8

Arteta clearly has a weakness for the type (Willian)

awooga83

Claudius he played quite alot at the world cup lot for a player who is not intended to be the main player and was pretty bad across the the tournament. The idea because he went shows he's a good player is a crazy way to approach assessing it. Tuchel totally screwed up with his decision in the tournament particularly the semi so he absolutely is capable of being wrong. No Saka in the semi but full match in the playoff an example of that stupidity. The idea that because a manager makes a decision that can never be wrong it's a very flawed position to take.

Meatwad

Claudius
and that list proves my point. bowen is now a championship player and the other two aren't wingers and definitely not better than him as wingers. england don't have many options.

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