Claudius this is it. We have Ode, Rice, Merino, Partey, Jorginho, Nwaneri for 3 midfield spots. Plus Trossard, Kai and Timber who can play there if needed. Loads of options.

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    Claudius Partey can't cover what Ode does though, can he? I'm really struggling to figure out what the contingency plan is for an Ode injury (heaven forbid) and the only thing I come up with is Trossard, which isn't all that inspiring.

        Don Pacifico In reality if Odegaard gets injured we'll have to change the way we set up in midfield because you're barely going to find a good like for like replacement for Odegaard in the league never mind in our own squad and Vieira staying wouldn't have changed that equation.

            Mirth Yeah I view an Odegaard injury as the same as a KDB injury. You can't replace them so you have to completely restructure the midfield to accommodate their absence. But I think the crux of it is that if Odegaard were to get injured, we'd be screwed regardless so might as well not spend a ton of time making plans for that worst case scenario.

              You cannot really plan a like-for-like replacement for the very best players in the league. What’s often hard to see is that the best players like Ode and KDB at the 99th percentile, are often 50% or more productive on important metrics (eg deep completions, progressive passes, etc) than players at the 90th percentile. They are miles better than excellent players. So you’ll always have a massive gap when they’re out. You just have to hope for the best.

              It reminds me of when we lost Saliba 2 seasons back (and even when we have played without Saliba in preseason this year). His absence has in both periods completely ruined our shape, and it’s hard to make like-for-like adjustments

              So essentially Odegaard is irreplaceable? Hes not Zidane ffs. Yes it’s hard to get a like for like but it’s about mitigating risk. A 17 year old replacement is on the high end of the risk.

              Getting someone better at half way house is better than doing nothing and hoping for the best/relying on a kid.

                Sicario2 - Tier 1 So essentially Odegaard is irreplaceable?

                Not that's not what I'm saying.

                Sicario2 - Tier 1 Getting someone better at half way house is better than doing nothing

                However I am saying getting a half way house player to fit the same system will make no difference. You're implying that if Odegaard gets injured, Nwaneri gets his minutes when in fact it'll be one of the more experienced players (Nwaneri gets on the bench) but we'll tweak our midfield system to play differently. A good mitigation strategy isn't doing Plan A but worse.

                      Mirth what does that mean specifically though? I don't want to field a midfield where three players out of Merino, Partey, Rice and Jorginho are starting. Regardless of whether you change up how you play, someone would have to play instead of Ødegaard.

                          I'd wager that nwaeri, havertz, merino, saka and trossard would be the emergency fill-ins for odegaard.

                          QuincyAbeyie Havertz and Trossard are options too. And I don't mean Havertz in the role he's taken previously in midfield for us but as a more offensive role. This could be a viable option because while Havertz is not as good as Odegaard on the ball, his pressing is elite and he could be as effective off the ball - in that sense we get to a halfway house compromise position. You've got to make it work - City played Alvarez at number 10 for some games when KBD was out and he wouldn't have been the like for like replacement but they tweaked how they played and it worked.

                          For what it's worth, the real cast iron insurance policy to cover Odegaard or Saka getting injured is to have another elite player for our front three (most likely left wing) so that it takes the pressure off the replacements.

                              Mirth I guess something like that will be the solution - so let's just hope Ødegaard doesn't get injured.

                              City had the PL player of the season filling in for KDB most of the time, so I'd say our situation isn't quite similar.

                                  QuincyAbeyie City had the PL player of the season filling in for KDB most of the time, so I'd say our situation isn't quite similar.

                                  No, Foden was the one who stepped up in KBD's absence (which is what we'd need Saka or Jesus or whoever to do) but Alvarez was the man for man replacement.

                                      Mirth 13 goals scored as a 10, 5 as RW. Doesn't really change that their situation for dealing with KDB's absence is different from ours in Ødegaard's. Moving Havertz would mean moving our starting striker - Alvarez isn't theirs so they wouldn't have to move him around. So I guess the similarities would be between Trossard and Alvarez, which to me just tells me how much easier it would be for City than us.

                                          QuincyAbeyie yep, City have a deeper squad and can pretty much cover any injury crisis so KDB's example is illustrative of the strategy that another top manager uses when one of his key players gets injured rather than the specifics of tactics. We are not as well equipped as City to deal with a loss of key personnel.

                                          The original claim was that the way to address Odegaard's injury would be to have an Odegaard-lite on the bench and play more or less the same way and hope that works. That's not how top club's approach that challenge, you need to redesign your system to rebalance away from your weakness and towards your strengths.

                                            Ødegaard being out for us would be like both Rodri and De Bruyne being out would be for City. He's both our metronome and half our cutting edge at this moment.

                                            Sicario2 - Tier 1 This loan is not to make him a better fit for the PL - feels like this is more to give him minutes so that someone (perhaps Porto themselves) will buy him next summer.