Gazza M When it is this close I think it might make some difference because surely banging on about their main points will keep their base happy but the swing voters might need more convincing.

JazzG i think a lot is made about "swing voters" but these people are not really undecided ideologically, its whether or not they are going to actually vote. a lot of people "in the center" are apathetic, and its a matter of will they actually go and vote or not. its 2024, i think most people have their minds made up regarding abortion, immigration, and the social safety net.

I see she's taken her defeat well....

mdgoonah41 From the outside it feels like you have two candidates that nobody is all that enthusiastic about. So you would think some of the voters might leave it late to decide, especially in the swing states which are going to decide the election.

Like flobba says 3 months is a long time in an election campaign, a few weeks ago after Trump got shot it looked like the Democrats were ready to throw the towel in but Kamala has hit the ground running and made it a contest.

AIPAC poured funds into her opponent , nothing new in American politics. It's always the pro Israel mob that gets funded and ultimately put into positions of power which then allows the likes of Netanyahu and company to lie steal and murder with impunity.

GooneriC 100% right, she has every right to be angry. the most depressing thing right now about democratic politics is how willing they are to be swayed and outright gaslighted by the right.

i read an article yesterday about how some right wing strategists were feeding opposition research on shapiro to the media and more left wing liberals to try and tarnish him and create opposition to him, because republicans were afraid of him on the ticket. whether that is true or not, i dont know. and shapiro obviously has his issues and potential liabilies, as noted in this thread.

but the bigger issue is that the democratic party has allowed itself to be influenced and swayed by republicans over the last 8 years. republicans closer to the political center were rightly disgusted by trump and felt the party no longer was welcoming to them, so they wanted to coopt the democratic party and turn it into their idealized version of the republican party. thats not how any of this is supposed to work. you dont show up to someone's house for a dinner party and start changing the music and then go into the kitchen and tell the hosts they are cooking everything wrong. if you do that, the host would be justified in ejecting you from the party.

never trumpers either need to create their own viable third party (will never happen) or they need to figure out whether their views more closely align with democrats or republicans and then vote that way. they dont get to change the democratic platform or completely water down views on repro rights, immigration and the environment. if these never trumpers had it their way, dems would have nominated liz cheany and mitt romney for the ticket. that isnt a world i want to live in.

JazzG hard disagree here. the dem base is definitely more excited about harris. i think most people agree she isn't the dream candidate. but dems also cant fall into the trap of letting perfect be the enemy of good. shes a better candidate than biden, shes more progressive than biden. shes still a cop, and she'll never win over certain people, but shes far from some disaster candidate. if she'd fucked up the VP selection, i think the momentum train could have derailed, but she picked the guy that has drawn plaudits from AOC and progressive groups, all the way to joe fucking manchin and republicans like larry hogan. this is as united as the dem party has been since probably 2008, to be honest.

mdgoonah41 thats not how any of this is supposed to work.

I think the way it's "supposed" to work is that you make the compromises necessary to secure an electoral majority.

RowJimmy lol well not to be pedantic, but democrats have a pretty substantial majority in this country and regularly lose elections because of gerrymandering and the electoral college. a small sliver of trump hating republicans shouldn't swing the outcome of a national election, especially when the democrat gets 7 million more votes for president than his republican challenger

Gazza M let the Republican Party burn. Given current dynamics and the Democratic ticket, I think they’d lean even more into their pettiness and hateful rhetoric instead of reforming towards the centre. A black woman as president will not sit well with white nationalists.

It's insane that those two are the best options for the strongest and largest country in the world. We're at the mercy of a bunch of fools like them

You're lucky Elon is ineligible

flobaba wait, aren't you lucky, too?

Someone show me Kamala’s resume please.

Qwiss Trump is a typical business man, pay who you need to in order to get what you want done.

flobaba he has more power than the US president anyway.

looks like the attempted swift boating of walz is not going as smoothly for republicans as it did when they derailed kerry's campaign 20 years ago. the internet has really evolved.

mdgoonah41 their attempts are really pitiful.

50 years ago yesterday since Nixon resigned. All The Presidents Men on the box - seen it a few times now and its power only seems to grow with each viewing. The book is something else too.