Raya joins Arsenal: Page 12 - The Arsenal discussion community: One More in the Tolly

Raya joins Arsenal

lorddulaarsenal

Felt like he was used as another credible passing option at the back too rather than a last resort when players had no other option

Bring Back Kerrea Gilbert

invisibleman18 I agree. Nothing special at all about his distribution last night.

Good presence and calmness at the back though.

Don Pacifico

Sicario2 - Tier 1 not really, I'm just not yet on the hype train. At no point have I said he hasn't done well but he's also not been tested.

Qwiss

I'm wondering why Raya is kicking like Ramsdale did in his first season here but Ramsdale isn't. You'd have to think both are doing as instructed so did Arteta lose faith in Ramsdale long ball and get him to do it less?

JazzG

He's looked very confident and assured last two games, definitely looks the better option right now.

Ramsdale has it in him to take his place back and now needs to work hard on his game to get back in.

lorddulaarsenal

Ramsdale seems more nervous with his kicking even when on form - they were often overhit

goon

Ramsdale's kicking was phenomenal when he first came in and in parts of last season. I remember especially those low pinged balls into Laca and later on Jesus that would bypass the press completely, never mind those long balls for Martinelli to chase on to. His short passing could be risky at times but they were great for the most part.

He's gotten more and more conservative as time goes on, and that's one of the problems of not having competition and playing every game, you subconsciously reign it in.

daredevil

Don Pacifico

The dropped goalkeeper was on the bench in all 5 league games, so it was clear rotation by Brighton.

Personally, I agree with the consensus that Raya is number 1 and there won't be the kind of rotation that Arteta is alluding to. Ramsdale will likely play in the cups and that's it.

But this idea that you can't rotate goalkeepers is a limiting belief like every other, up until you can do it. Brighton are doing it as we speak.

Qwiss

Get the feeling this story is going to run all season. The English press are heavily invested in Ramsdale as a potential England number 1 and I think thats driving a lot of the outrage about us signing another keeper. The way I see it its all good for us. Either Raya keeps Ramsdale out of the team on form or Ramsdale gets a chance to come back and in and win his place back. Where is the downside?

Burnwinter

Qwiss Where is the downside?

At the moment, there's mainly the £30m on Raya's fee, and the millions that will likely be lost on Ramsdale's transfer value out of here by next summer.

JazzG

Qwiss Spot on, English propaganda has been in full flow recently.

Actually has given me more belief in Arteta because for a long time I've not been convinced by Ramsdale, didn't think Arteta would drop him but glad he has. Whether Raya turns out to be the right option remains to be seen but so far so good.

Like you say now it is on Ramsdale to prove Arteta wrong and get back into the side.

AAStyle

You may be right, in any case I don't see Ramsdale staying after this season if he is the number 2.

RocktheCasbah

Burnwinter Ramsdale signed a new contract this summer, I don't think this stock has fallen so far we wouldn't recoup a high percentage of the fee paid for him. I suppose turning a profit might be too much to ask.

Qwiss

Burnwinter thats possibly be true. If Raya becomes the de-facto number 1 then as much as I like Ramsdale he needs to be sold, no good for anyone if he spends a year on the bench. Then again maybe Arteta is going to push on with playing both, who knows.

RocktheCasbah if they decide on Raya then Ramsdale needs to go for at least the Raya fee. It'd be interesting if we did decide to sell. Apart from Liverpool, City and maybe Newcastle I could see the other big PL sides coming for him. He'd walk into Uniteds or Chelsea's team no problem.

mdgoonah41 Ramsdale is too good to be only playing FA cup and League cup games. If he's resigned to those he'll go in the summer. Possibly even January.

Clrnc

Claudius

Clrnc thanks for sharing this data, Clrnc. Very important numbers for our game. The threat that he has distributing to our front four means that we can quickly get the ball upfield and press the opposition, which is our safe space. On the other hand, it also creates doubt in opponents minds about how much to commit to pressing when we play out the back as they could be caught out by a long ball. It’s a properly credible threat.

Knowing how coherent a thinker Arteta is, I wouldn’t be surprised if this and the Havertz acquisitions are related.

Don Pacifico

RocktheCasbah either way, that's not great business (even if it could be worse!).

I may be wrong (and it's incumbent on Ramsdale to prove this) but I still believe he has a higher ceiling than Raya. So in terms of long-term planning, I have a concern that we're making short-term gains for long-term losses.

Sicario2 - Tier 1

Don Pacifico

Long term planning doesn’t work here. Raya is the better keeper and will be in his prime next 5-6 years, so Ramsdale having a higher ceiling is immaterial.

Ramsdale will be gone next summer so him being better in 2033 is little to no relevance.

George Graham swapped title winning keeper in John Lukic in 1990 for Dave Seaman and that ended out ok.

RocktheCasbah

Don Pacifico well, let's see. Obviously, we're dealing with a small sample size at the moment, but everything Raya has had to do in his first two games, he's done excellently. I'm still suspicious of him, so certainly not writing Aaron off yet, but I can see why the Spaniard appeals to Don Mikel.

Don Pacifico

Sicario2 - Tier 1 Long term planning doesn’t work here. Raya is the better keeper and will be in his prime next 5-6 years, so Ramsdale having a higher ceiling is immaterial.

Gonna have to agree to disagree on that one. Short-term thinking has led us down some dark roads.

Also, Seaman vs Lukic isn't a direct analogue given Seaman was the younger prospect (ie. yet to fulfil his potential).

Sicario2 - Tier 1

Don Pacifico

Lol Raya is not the GK equivalent of Cedric or William man.

He’s 28 and as mentioned in his prime or about to hit it. There is nothing short term about this. He’s here to stay as our number 1.

Doc

Ramsdale has (a probably still has) some great long passes in him but Raya's short passing game looks like it is a lot more accomplished and is more composed on the ball, which is more important for the way we play... Still early days, and he has far from been tested yet... Competition is good and Ramsdale looks the type to react positively to it.

invisibleman18

Sicario2 - Tier 1 are you suggesting Raya is the equivalent of Seaman? Graham signed Seaman because he was the best keeper England. If you think that's what we've done here then fair play.
Ramsdale is also not the equivalent of Cedric or Willian btw. He was just named in last season's team of the season and nominated for the Yashin award for what it's worth.

mdgoonah41

i mean, now that we are back in the CL, i am sure we are going to deprioritize the FA cup and league cup. so, raya starts every PL and CL match, and then ramsdale starts the FA cup and league cup. this is what we used to do.

if raya loses form and ramsdale comes back in, their roles flip flop. raya is not going to start every single game this season, no team really does that anymore, the backup usually always gets run in the second and third tier competitions

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