Kai Havertz: Page 24 - The Arsenal discussion community: One More in the Tolly

Kai Havertz

AAStyle

Garbage player, at least for now. Let's just hope that Arteta is right and in the long run this guy unleashes his potential. Nonetheless, honestly, I think that this will be another Willian.

What also worries me is that his vibe may be reaching others. It is a fact that if you have someone dizzy, defeated and without the will to fight then that will impregnate all your troops. Poor morale is contagious.

flobaba

I'm getting worried about this guy. I know it's basically a case of rock bottom confidence, but this is really bad.

The penalty he didn't win. I've watched it a few times and it feels like he was through on goal if he didn't elect to go down. And, knowing that, he chose to go down. He chose not to put himself in a situation where he might have to take a shot one on one at close range...

Clrnc

His finishing has always been tame and placed shots in his career. But look at him coming all the way from left to overlap Lukaku here giving him support.

He's not appearing everywhere here yet due to confidence. This was when he just joined

Big Willie

Clrnc But look at him coming all the way from left to overlap Lukaku here giving him support.

Bro that's such a basic run. Fuck me, is this the level we are hoping he gets to?

Kel Varnsen

A lot of wishful thinking here. Individually, he hasn't shown anything in three years. He is sloppy and unimaginative on the ball. Physically he's nothing special. So that means all hope is on him doing things off the ball that is so magnificent that it not only weighs up for his lack of technical ability, but also elevates everyone else.

He might find back to his old form, but we really can't afford to carry passengers. He needs to be dropped right now, and perhaps win back his place in time.

Claudius

I feel like I’m the only one not stressed by this guy. He could have started with better link up play but this is a hard system to master. It took the players we have months to make it work. He has to create much more movement than he did at Chelsea. You can see he is struggling with offense the way much of the team did for months when fans said our football is dreary.

What he is giving is better defense than Xhaka, so this isn’t a player who isn’t trying. Stick to this lineup with Martinelli and Zinchenko, and he will get his rhythm

banduan

Claudius I feel like I’m the only one not stressed by this guy.

I'm open to give the guy time and I know he needs to adapt to the system.

That does not stop the stress. Watching him right now is stressful.

Burnwinter

Gazza M 😂 If Arteta ever does win a few major trophies, the Tao Te Ching wisdom-dispensing phase of his coaching career is going to be gold.

The motorway analogy before this match and the marriage analogy afterwards, now he just needs some Cantona level enigma.

Burnwinter

I'm officially off the Havertz train. His confidence is shot full of holes.

If I were Tet I might tell Havertz I was making him a situational super-sub, and just to play his game when he gets a run and express himself. He's managing to look claustrophobic in yards of space. I think his role may be too complicated for him as well.

Claudius

Burnwinter you’re saying the way to get to a man whose confidence is down is to sub him. Just stick with him so he can learn the actual offense. This is a massive investment. Certainly not as big as Rice, but significant nonetheless.

Notice how with all our defensive riches, Mikel made sure to start Timber whether at left back or right back to get him up to speed quickly. Stick with him.

awooga83

I don't think it's about trying to bring his confidence down but people react differently to that pressure and the trying to make things happen. Rice seems to have a character that relishes it and enjoys that. Havertz does not appear to have that so it might be better to remove some of the pressure around him by not being the starter right now and as has been said letting him build himself from the bench and find what works for him.

Burnwinter

awooga83 That's my take on it. I think if he isn't dropped Trossard and Vieira will be asking why. If it's not off the bench, he could play in home games, against teams that park the bus, or in specific competitions rather than starting every match.

Coombs

Only thing keeping him on is his recovery work. He's very useful stopping counters, which has been our weakness in midfield. Much better than Xhaka who can only really defend facing forward.

Too bad the rest of his game is so bad, because I don't think Vieira or Trossard can do what he does on the defensive side.

Arteta may be partially at fault, here. He's got him doing hold up work in the midfield, so he's laying it off backwards when there are runners ahead of him. If he could only find a way to get him facing forward more when receiving, maybe we'd see more of his playmaking or running with the ball. His defensive strengths and attacking weaknesses seem related to some extent.

Claudius

Coombs he had five recoveries yesterday. The hustle is there and is an upgrade from Xhaka in that regard. Helps us keep the ball higher up the field. We domianted territory yesterday. It’s the offensive movement that is bad right now. When Marrinelli gets the ball, where do you run to ensure he has options? That’s the most glaring thing right now.

flobaba

Claudius his link up play in midfield is also suspect. In that video where Zinchenko was talking up Xhaka, he spoke to the Swiss' ability to anticipate spaces where the ball could come through before the pass was made and to step in there to pick up the ball. It was fundamental to our offensive transition and for breaking opponent's midfield lines. Kai sees, and is able to receive the easy, in to feet passes, but isn't nearly as adept at feeling out the holes where the line splitting pass will be coming into. That's where his biggest sync needs to happen in my opinion. Scoring goals will be a natural bonus/by-product of that vision.

Qwiss

After the break we'll be playing 2 games a week, I think that spot becomes the most obvious for rotation as well as CF.

KingslandBarge

Qwiss I initially find myself agreeing with DiabyKungFu (perhaps for different reasons) and that playing him for the Everton fixture could still be a manageable risk, hoping that his integration progresses. I'd be curious to see how he does with Germany.
At the same time, it would be really unfortunate to let the flame Trossard and Vieira have caught to die out without us capitalising on it. Can't be taking it for granted, and personally can't be playing favourites either. Maybe Havertz can be lined up for PSV and Brentford in the EFL.

Qwiss

KingslandBarge Thats partly what I'm getting at. I think he should start one of Everton and PSV but not both. If his form doesn't improve soon I'd be swapping out ESR and Vieira though and giving Kai minutes off the bench. Right after PSV is Spurs, can't say I want him to start that one but who knows. Its a pity he'll be away with Germany because having the break at Arsenal could have been good for him.

Pepe LeFrits

I suspect games like Everton away are part of the reason Arteta signed him (no pressure, Kai).

daredevil

This is what a good Kai looks like.

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