Kai Havertz: Page 101 - The Arsenal discussion forum and community: One more in the Tolly

Kai Havertz

JazzG

Thought apart from some of his finishing he was excellent, the problem however is if you are a CF and your finishing is off you will be judged harshly

Him leading the line was one of the main reasons we actually gave City a game. He simply has to finish at least one of those chances but at least he is getting on the end of chances and proving a threat, unlike Gyokeres who gets marked out of these games and doesn't even get a sniff.

Merino scores that header at the end, that was the chance....

RowJimmy

JazzG Merino scores that header at the end, that was the chance....

Yeah, I think so too.

Claudius

We need a Merino / Havertz hybrid as CF.
The only thing I’d take from Gyokeres is his penalty kicks when building this frankstein forward

Ray

Claudius but we’ve “outscored everyone” why do we need another forward now.

Lacazette was a decent penalty taker too, let’s sign him back bring him on when we have a penalty to take.

Coombs

I like Havertz, but this was not a good game. Some mediocre holdup and bad misses is nothing to write home about. Whatever about Gyökeres in the precious buildup, if you don't have finishers on the pitch you don't score.

Don Pacifico

Coombs Whatever about Gyökeres in the precious buildup, if you don't have finishers on the pitch you don't score.

Gyokeres still has to prove he's a finisher at the highest level because so far he's not shown that to be the case.

Claudius

Ray but we’ve “outscored everyone” why do we need another forward now.

Imagine how much more we could score if we had better forwards available. 80% of the season has passed. We’ve been hurt by strategic injuries. But we can also see that Madueke and Gyok aren’t the level required.

The difference between forward reserves and central midfield reserves in a 5 sub era with pressing is that you need depth of quality up front. So you can re-energise during the game. Much more so than in midfield. Also helps to have multiple fullbacks in this context.

Qwiss

Ray it's funny cos I don't as thinking of when Laca was used behind the striker and just won a few headers and battled a bit.

Ray

Claudius it’s the system that has allowed us to outscore everyone. You can put a Bonafide 20 goal a season striker up front but if he’s sticking to the game plan and not getting more service they do what Gyokeres is doing.

Stick Ollie Watkins upfront and the results the same. But it needs to be compensated for by wingers that actually can score goals on a regular basis

Tam

Claudius You’ve been banging on all season about how good a team we are, how we’re out scoring everyone, and how the league is much more difficult to score in these days. But now it’s simply a case of get a few players and bang them in? Come off it, you’re wanting to have your cake and eat it.

banduan

we improved immensely controlling the game from up top with Kai and Ode in the side. If we need goals let's makes sure these two play alongside our goalgetters Gyok, Eze and maybe Leo. The wasters can sit out.

daredevil

I thought Kai and Gyok together could be a hack but the problem is that Kai only worked behind the striker with Trossard because they alternated between dropping deep and going in behind. With Gyokeres - the two roles are fixed so the unpredictability isn't there and Havertz isn't leading the line enough to hold up the play and allow us to build.

Claudius

Tam You’ve been banging on all season about how good a team we are, how we’re out scoring everyone, and how the league is much more difficult to score in these days. But now it’s simply a case of get a few players and bang them in? Come off it, you’re wanting to have your cake and eat it.

I’ve said we are good. Not perfect. Your argument is nakedly disingenuous

QuincyAbeyie

Claudius you've literally said that the league is basically done and that we'd win it a while ago. And that's not having a dig at you, I thought the same thing.

It's entirely possible to have injuries and do worse with those injuries than expected. We haven't had some unprecedented and insane injury crisis since the time we thought the league was done.

Tam

Claudius You've been saying all season how the league has got more difficult and that is the root of fewer goals across the board. When doing so, you neglect to point out the context that this season appears to be more difficult compared to 23/24 and 24/25, but is entirely in line with scoring rates across the league in years gone by. You've also used incorrect statistics to further your points about scoring rates.

You're now saying, despite telling us all season how difficult the league is due to teams being much fitter and better tactically in setting up defensively, to "imagine how much more we could score if we had better forwards available." If it's the case that we need better players it is an indictment on our squad building, and the quality of the league is and can never have been as big of an issue as you have characterised it.

If there's any disingenuity in this discussion it's not on my end.

awooga83

QuincyAbeyie agree I've seen a few people say we had injuries and you can't deal with that we had very winnable matches with city messing up through Jan-march presenting us numerous chances to extend the lead and kill them when we played lesser opposition. It's not injuries that will have cost us it's our poor quality from this team and a failure to deliver, no excuses injuries didn't cost us this one.

Claudius

QuincyAbeyie I think you and Tam are saying different things. I agree with you that I potentially overestimated our ability to close comfortably given where we were. I was in a 70/30 space then but have regressed to more 50/50 now. I'm happy to see our players coming back, and I have every confidence we can get near maximum points here on out if we play that we did last weekend. But City have an incredibly easy schedule where nobody is fighting for anything meaningful.

So, yes, have some regrets for specific games like Bournemouth and Liverpool, but not dwelling on that.

Bring Back Kerrea Gilbert

Claudius Wolves, Bournemouth, Brentford, United at home (disgusting), Liverpool at home (pathetic and cowardly), Forest away...

There are plenty of them mate.

Sicario2

Claudius the way the table is right now, City’s opponents,Bournemouth, Everton and Brentford are all fighting for a European position. Hell, if Aston Villa finish 5th and win Europa League it means 6th place can get you CL which means these teams will be fighting.

Qwiss

Bring Back Kerrea Gilbert 10 man Chelsea.

Sicario2

Bring Back Kerrea Gilbert what about the games we weren’t supposed to win ie Man Utd away or even Brighton away where we were fortunate to come away with three 3 points on both occasions.

As fans we only look at the ‘what if’ moments if it cost us but we’ve had a few that could have gone the other way too.

We’ve been a bit unfortunate that we have played certain teams at peak form: Sunderland away, Chelsea away, Man Utd under new manager bounce when they just beat their city rivals, Bournemouth who had 3 weeks rest and so on.

Qwiss

Sicario2 were Chelsea in peak form against us? They lost to Leeds in the next game. Same with Fulham, draw the game before us against Everton and lost to Fulham right after. We just underperformed, no bad luck about it.

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