Artetaball Tactics Thread: Page 5 - The Arsenal discussion community: One More in the Tolly

Artetaball Tactics Thread

Burnwinter

Not going to go into full anti-Arteta kneejerk mode, but …

By my count we've dropped four points in the league this season. All four could have been protected if we'd seen more pragmatic, empirical decision-making by our coach, and better preparation of our players.

Today he got out-thought by a Postecoglou-led Spurs with no Kane. From the half hour mark they screened Odegaard out of the game almost completely, and they seized their chances pretty well. Glad we survived with a point, as if we'd lost the reporting would've been intolerable.

awooga83

Burnwinter agree with this view, Arteta still has some worrying traits in who his favourites are and how we manage games when we don't get it right first off.

This season is a test for him as much as the team. We had a fantastic season last year, but my question has always been how much was it down to the team, squad and management or a lucky one in 100 season with the 50 points. It'll be telling what we come out with at the end and where it sits on what Arteta has achieved in his time here.

Clrnc

Burnwinter Today he got out-thought by a Postecoglou-led Spurs with no Kane. From the half hour mark they screened Odegaard out of the game almost completely, and they seized their chances pretty well. Glad we survived with a point, as if we'd lost the reporting would've been intolerable.

I am more worried by this. From about the 29th min mark onwards they pretty much controlled most of the game and we have no answer to defend against their swift attacks. I really thought Arteta would switch not only personnel but our tactics to cope with their press and attacking play.

Anyway as you aussies already knew Ange is absolute quality and can work with whatever he already have on hand.

est

It's pretty clear that although Arteta is a great young manager with some fantastic upsides, he also has some critical flaws. He needs to improve on those, if he wants to lead us to PL/CL success. Unfortunately, one of those flaws is a massive ego, which makes it difficult for him to admit his own mistakes and correct them in time.

naz

His player biases & ego willbe the end of him

RocktheCasbah

naz Kai Havertz is already starting to feel like he could be a career defining signing for Arteta.

Rohit The occasion got to him today. He went for what he thought were the right players for the occasion, especially up front from an experience point of view. He got it wrong. In a derby when you are thin, rather go with Hale End boys. They know what this game means. It was a toss up between Havertz and Vieira otherwise. Nelson and ESR may not be upto much in training but it must be so demoralizing to be behind Martinelli, Trossard and Jesus on the wing.

Agree with this. Smith Rowe has excelled in this fixture, to now be given 5 minutes at the end because you're behind Vieira & the aforementioned Havertz must be incredibly galling. Both he and Nelson should have been on the pitch at least 15 minutes earlier as the game slipped from our control.

My uncle is absolutely raging tonight about our lack of quality at centre forward. Although, paradoxically, he does also like Eddie. Bottom line is, Jesus should have had us 2 up and we would have deserved that lead. We didn't get it and fell away second half.

Burnwinter

I wouldn't be so worried about the two points dropped today if the two dropped against Fulham didn't belong to the same pattern.

Similar limitations were showing last season when the chips were down. We had a few underperformers and some troublesome injuries, but Arteta didn't get a greater resolve from the rest, nor adjust tactically to avoid our horror run in April.

Our next three league matches are away to Bournemouth, at home to City and away to Chelsea, could easily be another 5 points dropped.

Rohit

The occasion got to him today. He went for what he thought were the right players for the occasion, especially up front from an experience point of view. He got it wrong. In a derby when you are thin, rather go with Hale End boys. They know what this game means. It was a toss up between Havertz and Vieira otherwise. Nelson and ESR may not be upto much in training but it must be so demoralizing to be behind Martinelli, Trossard and Jesus on the wing.

I still remember how excitedly ESR and Saka reflected on the game when we beat them season before last after going up 3 goals in the first half an hour. Both of them were electric.

This was a sorry Spurs side.

Coombs

Tactics are no problem for me, it's the fucking weird player selections that produce such disjointed performances.

And it's not just for individual games, it's from game to game. Should've started the same team that started against PSV, and replaced Trossard like-for-like. We can still press hell for leather in the opening, but then we have control ball as our fallback. We had no fallback because the selection was bananas.

SimplyThePest

I'm not convinced by this guy. He's spent an absolute motza (including on some rubbish), taken ages to improve our fortunes and still doesn't seem to have got it quite right.

He needs to deliver and the pressure is on.

Bring Back Kerrea Gilbert

Watching from the stands was an eye opener. Saka and White in particular look so leggy.

Cannot understand why Arteta plays Saka to inevitable terrible injury.

Sicario2 - Tier 1

Clrnc

Ange is not the second coming of Sir Alex ffs.

This game was on Arteta for not trusting Nelson/ESR and poor in-game management.

To begin with, Jesus on bang on hot form should have played centrally with Nelson on the wing. Unless they are managing his mins he shouldn’t come off either.

I don’t want Eddie to play a big game again, ran out of puff after 20 mins and generally useless.

Segway

Arteta's insistence on jamming Eddie fucking Nketiah in the side today at the cost of putting Jesus out on the left makes zero sense to me when we have Nelson and ESR.

RocktheCasbah

Segway completely agree. I didn't understand how this was going to work when I saw the teams and the answer is now obvious: it wasn't going to work. I like Eddie but it's fucking insane that he is now ahead of Emile & Reiss in the pecking order.

MistaT

Lots of options today from a tactial perspective too that we’re overlooked…

I think playing Rice as the left “8” could have completely disrupted them. He would have stuck tight to Bissouma and nullified their build up intentions, and helped vs Kuvelski (who Zinny did ok against). The game would have been fine for Jorginho to start at the base.

Also would have played either of Nelson or ESR at LW as both would have everything to prove. Could them have started Jesus and kept Nketiah ready for the 65th minute.

CPM

What have Nelson or ESR done to suggest they should start a huge game? Subs could have happened earlier but Jesus-Nketiah-Saka was a reasonable selection under the circumstances. LW is probably Jesus's best position, and Nketiah has done just as much in an Arsenal shirt as Jesus.

We're just in some trouble if we're missing Martinelli and Trossard. Jesus and Nketiah aren't elite, and we're way too reliant on Saka and Ødegaard for goals.

And we still haven't figured out the Xhaka/LCM role. Vieira looked overwhelmed today – it's great that he's become an impact player but I wouldn't want him starting in a game of this magnitude. And I'm tiring of the Havertz drama – did we really need to take on such a gamble to find a #8? And give Chelsea £65m for the privilege of doing so?

Rohit

CPM What have Nelson or ESR done to suggest they should start a huge game?

ESR has played in his huge game before? Isn't that enough? And he has played incredibly well against a much better Tottenham side. We were up by 3 goals in 30 minutes then.

That's the whole point. The question is conservative. Arteta could drop what could traditionally be the logical thing and be brave.

Tottenham were braver today. In selection and in their play.

Qwiss

CPM What have Nelson or ESR done to suggest they should start a huge game?

Well Smith-Rowe has done more good work in the Premier league than Havertz or Vieira ever have. He's played in games like this and turned in cracking performances.

CPM Jesus-Nketiah-Saka was a reasonable selection under the circumstances.

I agree with that and it worked pretty well for half an hour where they pressed the shit out of Spurs to the point they barely had a kick in our half.

CPM And I'm tiring of the Havertz drama – did we really need to take on such a gamble to find a #8? And give Chelsea £65m for the privilege of doing so?

And we're paying him €300k a week. This is probably the worst transfer we've ever made. We'll almost certainly end up stuck with him sucking up wages for years.

Kel Varnsen

CPM What have Nelson or ESR done to suggest they should start a huge game?

What have Nketiah, Havertz (previously) and Vieira done? I'd say ESR and Nelson have done at least as much as Havertz and Vieira, and Nketiah has looked ok at best for us.

naz

It's bothering how we create few clear goal scoring chances every game. We labor to wins and draws

Bring Back Kerrea Gilbert

naz yep. Painful watching us try to create.

RocktheCasbah

Rohit ESR has played in his huge game before? Isn't that enough? And he has played incredibly well against a much better Tottenham side. We were up by 3 goals in 30 minutes then

I mean, he also helped save Tet's job against Chelsea. I'm finding the notion that Smith Rowe somehow needs to prove himself again, whilst Vieira flatters to deceive every other week and Kai can't even flatter, increasingly difficult to stomach. Even if Emile is not yet trusted as one of the two 8s, you know you can stick him on the left wing and he'll do...
something.

Don Pacifico

RocktheCasbah the only thing I can think it is, is he's trying to ease him back into the team without putting him under too much physical/mental pressure post-injury. Reminds me of how he was with Martinelli a couple of years back.

That's my optimistic take are least.

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