ESR: Page 29 - The Arsenal discussion forum and community: One More in the Tolly

ESR

QuincyAbeyie

If you show me a table for a period in which changes include having signed Ødegaard, Ramsdale, White and Tomiyasu and said "look this is evidence that ESR improved us loads" then you're clearly the weird one.

goon

Except no one has said that, no one has said it's solely down to him, that it's conclusive proof or suggesting it's anything more than a possible connection.

Seriously, people use stats and data to spot trends ALL THE TIME, by fans, pundits and outside football too. But data gleaned from a table that falls outside the paramaters of the start and end of a season? Lolz yeah let's make a trophy for them lmao.

Genuinely think you guys are suffering from some weird complex.

jones

Nobody would argue that we haven't improved in general since ESR came into the team, doesn't change the fact that it's ridiculous to show arbitrary PL tables for any specific time frame. A table shows the league standings of 20 teams with squads of 25 players each, picking one where we have ESR in the team as if it meant anything is beyond ridiculous it's embarrassing. How many times have we won the calendar table trophy in seasons past? Or just talking about the real league table did you post the one after three league games here to prove how ESR is shit since he played the full 90 in all three games?

If you think everyone around you is suffering from some complex I've got some bad news for you lmao.

Ricky1985

Whatever the case with Smith Rowe specifically, it's a good sign that over a span of 35 games we've been consistently winning points at a pace that matches everyone bar City. That's really encouraging.

goon

jones wrote:
Nobody would argue that we haven't improved in general since ESR came into the team, doesn't change the fact that it's ridiculous to show arbitrary PL tables for any specific time frame. A table shows the league standings of 20 teams with squads of 25 players each, picking one where we have ESR in the team as if it meant anything is beyond ridiculous it's embarrassing. How many times have we won the calendar table trophy in seasons past? Or just talking about the real league table did you post the one after three league games here to prove how ESR is shit since he played the full 90 in all three games?

If you think everyone around you is suffering from some complex I've got some bad news for you lmao.

A table shows a bunch of data, data which can be used to inconclusively support arguments. That's it, all the rest about proof and trophies is straw man arguments you're dreaming up. Show me anywhere where anyone reasonable has used the blasphemous league table to make any sort of firm conclusion and I'll hold my hands up.

Anyway it's not worth the grief. Instead of backing my opinion up with data next time I'll just say - 'hey our results have been much better since last boxing day which is good, I hope we can keep it up' - and just pray the PL table police leave me alone.

Burnwinter

Quincy has it correct, it's both qualitatively evident and "backed up by data" (as far as that goes in terms of methodology for any of these claims) that we've had a number of first team changes that have been positive since our poor start to the season. It's great for Smith-Rowe that he's part of it.

Anzac

TBH I think they just use ESR as a reference point as it was his debut in the Boxing Day win v CFC that 'saved' Arteta and saw our improvement in results last season. They're also using it to suggest that even with our poor for at the start of this season we are still seeing us maintaining that level.

However the stats posted in the LFC match thread (re xG & xGA), suggest that we are out performing the data and our results/position is not sustainable, just as it wasn't under Emery.

FEBravo

What's going there? He's clearly fully fit by now right? Did he steal the Xhaka nudes from Arteta or something? You would think he is the type of sub we need when chasing a goal rather than Fabio fuckin Viera no?

lorddulaarsenal

He’s not part of the long term plan. He’s not a good fit for our style of play anymore.

Recon he’ll be sold in the summer

Kel Varnsen

lorddulaarsenal

I think you're right. Wouldn't be surprised if both ESR and Tierney are sold this summer.

Clrnc

Don't understand how he is not a good fit for our style. Technically accomplished, good finisher, versatile.

I can understand if we sold him because he is injury prone, nothing else

Burnwinter

Clrnc It's quite hard to find players as good. The comment that Smith Rowe may well be better value than substantial investments like Vieira seems accurate.

Gazza M

Clrnc my suspicion is it's a workrate and reliability issue. he isn't as durable or defensively able as martinelli and saka.

Claudius

Arteta is a simple and predictable guy. As soon as ESR was healthy, he made him a core part of the team 2 years ago, sparking the revitalisation at Chelsea. And then he gave him the number 10 shirt. And has spoken often about how he wants more from him. Arteta likes this guy a lot. There’s nothing to see here.

The big thing is getting this guy healthy. A bit like Vieira who started the campaign without a preseason and took forever to integrate.

lorddulaarsenal

Smith Rowe served a purpose back then. He added dynamism and directness to an attack which really struggled to create anything and score freely like our frontline now does.

He’s a bit of a turnover machine and holds on to the ball too long. He’s more of a back up option to Martinelli if anything.

Don Pacifico

lorddulaarsenal He’s a bit of a turnover machine and holds on to the ball too long.

Think the same could definitely be said of Martinelli; I'd say it's a function of age and inexperience so not necessarily terminal just yet.

Bring Back Kerrea Gilbert

lorddulaarsenal he holds onto the ball not long enough.

I'm annoyed he keeps getting rid of the ball as quickly as possible when his on the ball talent is very high.

Gunner89

The All or nothing documentary suggested he has sort of a timid/shy personality

He had a purple patch last season then struggled to really contribute

With a fit first team, he doesn't get a sniff. I'd sell him, Lokonga, Viera for reasonable funds this summer.

Claudius

Would sooner sell Holding, Tierney and Nketiah. They just don’t fit. Along with Tavares, AMN, Pepe - that’s a lot of change

Vieira and ESR need a proper fitness program. And then let’s give it a go.

lorddulaarsenal

Rather cash in on ESR and see how Patino develops

Bring Back Kerrea Gilbert

Not sure Patino is good enough.

Claudius

Bring Back Kerrea Gilbert would send Patino out to a place like West Ham - maybe as part of our Rice deal. Give him premier league experience. And put him on the same Nando’s bulking program as Vieira.

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