Granit Xhaka: Page 4 - The Arsenal discussion community: One More in the Tolly

Granit Xhaka

flobaba

Meh. It’s always talent first. That’s why we have an Ozil on our books.

Klaus

We have Özil on our books because he had already been doing it for years when we bought him. He's the kind of signing Real pulls all the time, the kind that doesn't need scouting.

We have Guendouzi on our books by contrast because he was so young that there was nothing but talent to go on, and it didn't show how thick he is or what an unagreeable personality he has.

flobaba

Most times you want to take that risk though, and you want to take it fast. Especially for outstanding talent. What did we know about Fabregas when we brought him in for example? If it doesn’t pan out then you sell, and cut your losses. But if it does, you’re a genius Cagigao.

Meatwad

Klaus wrote:
😆 You don't think other clubs scouted players in 2007?

The point wasn't that you have to go to 40 games to decide on a player, but that there is much more than just determining whether someone has talent that goes into it.

no i don't think other elite clubs were interested in sagna in 2007. we had that kind of player all to ourselves if they wanted a team at the top of the premier league, always in the champions league, etc. we try something like that now and there are many clubs that today's players see as better or arsenal's equivalent.

flobaba

Oh, I also think Claude’s idea is a tad out there...

Claudius

Klaus wrote:
Have to say I think your idea is horrible, Claude, and there are good reasons why clubs don't operate like this.

Scouts don't just find players, they study them to build mental profiles, to see how they would fit into the design, etc. We were reportedly watching Sagna 40 times or so before we signed him, and it wasn't just to decide whether he could defend or not.

I've said that you put that in the terms of reference. Read what I included before.
The watching Sagna 40 times - a lot of that will already have been done on video in the example above. The scout now needs to go out and do the stuff you cannot do in the video room: see his off the ball movement, energy levels, communication, training methods, lifestyle, etc. And then send a detailed analysis on that basis.

The scout will also know that he is focusing on serious targets, so he can really go in depth on his analysis. And he can really focus on refining analysis on all the elements a machine can't do as well.

I really don't see the value of having this in-house. It is information gathering. In your companies, what do you guys treat as strategic information gathering that you keep in-house?

Meatwad

of course it is. all it would take is another club adding a little something extra to delay a report by 24 hrs so they can get a jump on the signing. no honor in football, money talks and bullshit walks.

Klaus

Claudius wrote:
I really don't see the value of having this in-house. It is information gathering. In your companies, what do you guys treat as strategic information gathering that you keep in-house?

You make sure that they work for you and not for their own interests, for one thing. What you're proposing is the same thing as asking Kia for players when you need them, basically. It's a terrible idea for so many obvious reasons.

Claudius

Klaus wrote:
Claudius wrote:
I really don't see the value of having this in-house. It is information gathering. In your companies, what do you guys treat as strategic information gathering that you keep in-house?

You make sure that they work for you and not for their own interests, for one thing. What you're proposing is the same thing as asking Kia for players when you need them, basically. It's a terrible idea for so many obvious reasons.

I won't extend this much longer. But my final thoughts are
You have talent agencies and headhunters hiring at multiple companies for similar roles in the same industry. You outsource this function because they build out scale in sourcing talent. You don't worry about the conflicts. What you care about is their ability to identify the specs you want and do the due diligence required for the job before they hand over data to you. Your internal HR is responsible for asking the talent agencies to do the right searches, and then taking this info and making the right choices based on the needs of your company.

In this instance, you'd have internal scouts doing exactly this. Working with Edu to identify what's required, and then saying we need to finish off the due diligence with West Africa Scouting Group or Italian Scouting Network, etc.

(btw: I think our problems probably lie elsewhere - they lie in team strategy and execution of that strategy, not the scouting network. The scouting network is useless without those two issues in place. This issue is more about creating value for all of football).

Anzac

MistaT wrote:
C'mon Anzac, Lemar is as tainted (risky) as Coutinho at this point.

I'd be furious if we signed him.

Agreed - but I'd rather take a punt on him aged 24 & for 27m than on Coutinho aged 28 and on mega wages.

Pepe LeFrits

Xhaka :john:

Clrnc

That's really quite good

Anzac

Clrnc wrote:
That's really quite good

His highlights package from the game is generally good - I just want someone who is more mobile and not as limited regardless.

jones

Pepe LeFrits wrote:

Xhaka :john:

You think that wasn't on purpose?

est

Good pass, but "one of the most creative, well-executed and difficult passes of all time"? Not really.

goon

He had a super game, even used his right foot a few times. What a turnaround it's been for him.

QuincyAbeyie

est wrote:
Good pass, but "one of the most creative, well-executed and difficult passes of all time"? Not really.

😆 Football Twitter seems to love using hyperbole like that with every clip they post.

HomeSteak

😆 😆

KurtEisner

HomeSteak wrote:

😆 😆

Is that Augsburg making fun of us? Fucking hell, I need a smoke or three.

Rohit

He keeps getting picked. It isn't his fault. We should have sold him a long time back. Not only has he stayed, he keeps starting.

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