Official: Mikel Arteta is the new Arsenal manager.: Page 144 - The Arsenal discussion community: One More in the Tolly

Official: Mikel Arteta is the new Arsenal manager.

Coombs

jones wrote:
Emery came within inches of CL spots with a squad worse than our current team. There are many more factors playing a role to be fair, but claiming this squad isn't better than what they're currently showing or that he just needs more time when the team is actively regressing seems short sighted

I've said he should be sacked, but I still don't like it. Same with Emery and same with Wenger. At some point don't we have to accept the common denominator? I don't want Arsenal to be on the manager merry-go-round and I don't think the Kroenkes can just cycle through people and get anywhere. I'd rather we just take the hits but both the club and the company can't afford to.

The relationship we supporters have with the people at the club, players included, is so eroded that I'm unconvinced it can be built back by anyone other than a visionary, or by fluking a Goldilocks scenario by trial and error. I'd personally rather just lose all the so-called stars and commit to fighting our way back over the long haul. Perhaps the Kroenkes would eventually sell and then at least we'd have some kind of solid ground to kick on from. At the moment it's all castles in the sky.

Qwiss

There isn't really much vitriol though. Just a call for accountability. For the manager to be judged by results. The fans have some non negotiables.

The Kroenke are terrible, you are spot on there but part of their cluelessness allowed them to appoint a man City training coach as Arsenal manager.

flobaba

Let’s not forget - he did rightly earn himself some credit with what he was able to achieve in the first few months.

Temo

Remember when when we had that crisis at the end of Emery's first season as we completely fell apart fighting for 4th place and Europa?

The PL form (before 18/19 Europa final):
WWLWLLLDW

Arteta's last 9:
LWLDLLLDL

This is ignoring Emery's 4 victories against Napoli and Valencia in the quarters and semis.

Emery's last 9 before the sack:
DWDWLDDLD

Clrnc

Coombs wrote:
jones wrote:
Emery came within inches of CL spots with a squad worse than our current team. There are many more factors playing a role to be fair, but claiming this squad isn't better than what they're currently showing or that he just needs more time when the team is actively regressing seems short sighted

I've said he should be sacked, but I still don't like it. Same with Emery and same with Wenger. At some point don't we have to accept the common denominator? I don't want Arsenal to be on the manager merry-go-round and I don't think the Kroenkes can just cycle through people and get anywhere. I'd rather we just take the hits but both the club and the company can't afford to.

The relationship we supporters have with the people at the club, players included, is so eroded that I'm unconvinced it can be built back by anyone other than a visionary, or by fluking a Goldilocks scenario by trial and error. I'd personally rather just lose all the so-called stars and commit to fighting our way back over the long haul. Perhaps the Kroenkes would eventually sell and then at least we'd have some kind of solid ground to kick on from. At the moment it's all castles in the sky.

We need to be on a manager merry go round before we find the right man. If its not right, sack and start with a new man. You don't need to tear up the entire back end structure just by replacing the manager, unless the whole club structure is retarded itself.

People keep talking about how our club is being mismanaged for years, that's correct but that does not mean we have a squad as good as a relegation contender currently. We have actually started well this season, I looked up our results at the start and it's actually pretty decent, even winning away to Leicester and Pool in Carabao. Something changed in between with our squad dynamics and Arteta has lost the plot completely. And when he gets the sacked he will only have himself to blame because most of these losses are his own makings.

He speaks well but isn't true to his words. He speaks about non negotiables but week in week out he let Willian stroll around doing shit. He says he wants to attack but set up defensively every fucking game at the start planning not to lose it if he can't win it. He puts 3-4 defenders on the bench every bloody match. It's infuriating and there's very little positives to take out of it currently

Big Willie

Clrnc, I reckon we do need to be on the manager merry go round as well at some point. Even if Arteta somehow lasts until the end of the season, if things don't improve we need to be proactive about what is progress and what the minimum level or performance and results are even during the initial stages. If performances or results drop below that minimum level for any sustained period there needs to be action taken. I'd have advocated sacking Arteta weeks ago if he was anyone else and did not have the goodwill earned from the FA Cup.

It's getting pretty hard to defend Arteta now especially when compared to the run of form that Emery was sacked for.

Clrnc

I will give you one positive...

Trust the process?

Big Willie

Lol, process you know. It's depressing watching us these days.

Edit: By the way, with regards to sacking, even Watford have sacked their manager after just 4 months. He was in charge for only 20 league games - winning nine, drawing seven and losing four - picking up the manager of the month award for November.

goon

Their policy on managers hasn’t actually worked out all that well for them though has it.

awooga83

I think there is a case for trying to stick with managers at times depending on the circumstances but Arteta isn't that guy. He's totally unproven so you would be sticking with someone who has no basis today suggests he will get better and his current level just isn't good enough.

It's harsh but he would of known the score you cannot think you could come to s club perform like this and get 4 years in the job was a total inexperienced manager.

His appointments by the Kroenke does highlight how everything they are doing is mismanaged because appointing someone like Arteta is totally reckless and was more likely then not going to cause us problems.

deardevil

jones wrote:
Emery came within inches of CL spots with a squad worse than our current team. There are many more factors playing a role to be fair, but claiming this squad isn't better than what they're currently showing or that he just needs more time when the team is actively regressing seems short sighted

This is the team that played against Brighton in May 2019 when Xhaka cost us CL football.

Leno, Lichsteiner, Mustafi, Sokratis, Monreal, Torreira (Iwobi), Xhaka, Ozil, Mkhitaryan, Lacazette, Aubameyang

Now compare that to the team who played yesterday.

Leno, AMN, Luiz, Holding, Tierney, Saka, Elneny, Ceballos, Pepe, Willian, Nketiah

Of course, the team was missing Gabriel, Aubameyang and Partey. The point I am making is that within a year, the entire team has been radically changed and I don't see how you can say it's a better squad now. The performances and players are markedly worse than before. The proof is in the table.

I said it at the time and I will repeat it. The window of 2019 saw way too much upheaval. We lost a ton of experience and never replaced them properly.

Clrnc

😆 The team and squad this year is so much better it's not even close.

deardevil

Sure, the team and squad are clearly proving you right. We are destined to finish third, just like you predicted.

Big Willie

goon wrote:
Their policy on managers hasn’t actually worked out all that well for them though has it.

Not really, no. But then again there are times when results and performances are so bad that you have no choice but to part ways. Arteta may become a brilliant manager with more experience, or with a better te at his disposal. However at the moment performances and results are so far below what they should be that it will be a hard decision to justify if they keep him on other than having no other plan in the works.

I mentioned earlier that it's going to be a tough decision to make because all the pros and cons need to be weighed against each other however with each passing game I'm less inclined to want to stick with him.

If he were playing a more expansive type of football and just failing to win games then I'd have been more likely to stick with him and give him more of a chance to see how he can further lean into our strengths and fix our weaknesses. If he were playing our best players rather than always finding a way to shoehorn the likes of Willian and David Luiz into the team I'd be more inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt. If he didn't have us line up against the cannon fodder teams of the league with levels of respect they don't deserve then I'd be a more optimistic he has the makings of a good manager.

As of right now the season is basically over save for the Europa league. Let's be honest we won't get relegated. At the same time there is no way we'll be in with a shout of anything in the league if we don't change things soon. We'll most likely end the season firmly somewhere between 8th and 12th. Arteta can afford to experiment with more expansive football and giving more minutes to the likes of Saliba, Willock, Nelson, ESR and the likes. If they develop well then great, either good members of the team or we'll be able to make some money. If not, we'll probably still be able to make a few quid.

But Arteta is too cautious to play any way that isn't predominantly about limiting the chances of the opposition even to the detriment of our own chance creation. He doesn't want to change his mindset and the team's orientation to attack and score goals if it means compromising on his first goal which is to protect our own goal. Results are not good enough (even factoring in what some may consider a poor squad), performances are not good enough, we are underperforming in every attacking metric across the whole of England. I can only see things deteriorating further the longer this goes on because Arteta seems to be out of his depth and unwilling to make any compromises in his fundamentals which clearly don't seem to be working.

Clrnc

deardevil wrote:
Sure, the team and squad are clearly proving you right. We are destined to finish third, just like you predicted.

Yep, got conned by the lucky FA Cup win and Arteta.

Kel Varnsen

The squad is terrible. I don't see how anyone can say otherwise.

Klaus

The most damning thing isn't that we're 15th in the table but that most of our stats indicate that we should be lower than that. We're 20th in terms of goals from open play, 19th in terms of shots on target. 20th in shot conversion rate, 17th in goals scored overall.

We didn't get here by bad luck, by a red card or two wrecking our well-paved plans, but by systematically stripping technique and creativity from the team and whipping all the individuality out of the remaining players. That's one hundred percent on Arteta, and it's why he has to go. I don't even care if he turns things around and manages a midtable finish; he's a trash manager with trash ideas about how to play football. This is absolute garbage.

I'm sad and angry that he proved to be like this, because I absolutely loved Arteta as a player and I genuinely like him as a person. He would have been so easy to back if only there was a single thing about him that wasn't fucking nonsense, but he really is awful.

Claudius

We are waiting til the position matches the underlying metrics. And then we will fire him and the only managers interested will be those who love a relegation dogfight. Enter Tony Pulis to turn Hector Bellerin into a throw-in world champion. No need for 40 crosses a game when Hector can hurl one in

Sicario

Big Willie wrote:
Lol, process you know. It's depressing watching us these days.

Edit: By the way, with regards to sacking, even Watford have sacked their manager after just 4 months. He was in charge for only 20 league games - winning nine, drawing seven and losing four - picking up the manager of the month award for November.

For real? He won manager of the month for Nov and got sacked two weeks later? How does that work?

Sicario

Claudius wrote:
We are waiting til the position matches the underlying metrics. And then we will fire him and the only managers interested will be those who love a relegation dogfight. Enter Tony Pulis to turn Hector Bellerin into a throw-in world champion. No need for 40 crosses a game when Hector can hurl one in

Luckily Pullis is already in a job.

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