Official: Mikel Arteta is the new Arsenal manager.: Page 119 - The Arsenal discussion forum and community: One More in the Tolly

Official: Mikel Arteta is the new Arsenal manager.

awooga83

This is the worry for me. There is nothing wrong with looking to give people time and supporting them in principle. But you have choose to do that in times where there is something to suggest it's worthwhile. Not just blindly backing anyone because we need to give them time.

There is no signs that what Arteta is doing is working or taking us in the right direction and as a new manager they're is no previous example to point to and say here is a time it worked.

Instead the only thing we have is hopefully he will get better, that can't be a way to run a club with any serious intention to improve itself.

Klaus

mdgoonah41 wrote:
crystal palace is 11th in the league with 16 points in 11 games. they have scored 17 goals and allowed 16 for a GD of +1.

is their squad more talented than ours? can you even name 5 players on their team without going and looking? do you know who their top goalscorer is this season?

Yes, it's the bloke we were offered on loan with an option to buy this summer, but Arteta and Edu turned him down because they were working with Kia to bring in Willian on a three-year £200K per week contract instead.

Coombs

It's an absolute shambles to be sure. I have no real hope whether Arteta keeps his job or not.

RC8

mdgoonah41 wrote:
is their squad more talented than ours? can you even name 5 players on their team without going and looking? do you know who their top goalscorer is this season?

We will likely finish above them, but at any rate, yes. Zaha is their top goalscorer. The guy Emery wanted at Arsenal but who was deemed inferior to Pepe by the board.

RC8

Klaus wrote:
mdgoonah41 wrote:
crystal palace is 11th in the league with 16 points in 11 games. they have scored 17 goals and allowed 16 for a GD of +1.

is their squad more talented than ours? can you even name 5 players on their team without going and looking? do you know who their top goalscorer is this season?

Yes, it's the bloke we were offered on loan with an option to buy this summer, but Arteta and Edu turned him down because they were working with Kia to bring in Willian on a three-year £200K per week contract instead.

I forgot we had passed on him twice. Good god what a mess.

Still, recruiting is where we've fallen off a cliff since 2016.

We could still get more out of the current players if we aim for mid-table, but Arteta is trying to make them play like the Spanish NT and that system requires talented players (same as Klopp's system or Mourinho's or whichever other top manager's preferred style).

Claudius

Mu worry is the last few years could harm us long term. Culture is so hard to build, and we’ve created one where just enough is acceptable. And that’s what allows decline to set in without raising alarm amongst board, team, fans. There was hope Arteta would help arrest this but perhaps this is is too big for him.

My other concern with the outcome of Arteta is it risks making our investments last summer bad. The reason we went in big on Aubameyang, Willian, Luiz was there was a belief that we could turn things around quickly and compete (win the champions league in 3 years, he said). So aggressive investments made sense in that context. But if we’ve already thrown away one of those three years, it makes those investments in older talent look unwise. It’s a very different story if you say “I am investing in a win now player profile because I believe we will win quickly” vs “the development path is longer and therefore we must stretch out the investments”.

goon

We lost to Tottenham, the league leaders with two of the deadliest strikers in Europe at the moment. They had an xG of 0.39, we had an xG of 0.7. They beat City in pretty much the exact same fashion, except their chances were better in that game.

You'd think we just lost at home to Brighton.

We've lost 6 games this season, 4 of them are in the top 6. The other two are Wolves and Villa. I'd argue only the last one involved a performance that gave us no chance of actually getting something from the game.

I'm not saying we're unlucky, I think the brand of football (which I'm becoming less hopeful will change) is a large part of the reason for not only our form but the crisis in confidence. Talk of relegation and crisis are just nonsense. At worst we'll be a mid table side in 8 or 9th again by the end of the season and that may well be enough to signal the death knell for Arteta if there are no visible shoots, but lets not become irrational.

Klaus

Recruiting hasn't even been bad in my opinion. Look at some of the players we've gotten since 2018: Aubameyang, Leno, Gabriel, Partey, Tierney. That's half of a top class team, and it's not even including the talented but inconsistent ones, like Pepe, or top youngsters like Martinelli (and you could argue Saliba too). That's a better haul than in the previous five-year period put together. We should be playing so much better with the group we have, regardless of whether we turned down Zaha or not, irrespective of whether Pepe managed to hit the ground running or not.

The real issue is concerning vision in my opinion. We hired one manager who had none, and then followed it up by hiring a rookie with a vision so specific that he needs eleven new starting players to execute it.

Claudius

goon wrote:
We lost to Tottenham, the league leaders with two of the deadliest strikers in Europe at the moment. They had an xG of 0.39, we had an xG of 0.7. They beat City in pretty much the exact same fashion, except their chances were better in that game.

You'd think we just lost at home to Brighton.

We've lost 6 games this season, 4 of them are in the top 6. The other two are Wolves and Villa. I'd argue only the last one involved a performance that gave us no chance of actually getting something from the game.

I'm not saying we're unlucky, I think the brand of football (which I'm becoming less hopeful will change) is a large part of the reason for not only our form but the crisis in confidence. Talk of relegation and crisis are just nonsense. At worst we'll be a mid table side by the end of the season and that may well be enough to signal the death knell for Arteta if there are no visible shoots, but lets not become irrational.

We aren’t creating goals. We don’t score. We all accept that we’ve played some tougher teams, but even with the smaller teams we don’t score. Take Leeds. In the games around us, they conceded 4,4, and 3 goals. We got 0. Oh, I’m sure you’ll say we’re unlucky we had red.
I don’t care so much about brand of football. I like competing. That’s what is evaluated at the end of the season. And he isn’t creating the fundamentals to do so

QuincyAbeyie

Kurt Eisner wrote:
Klaus wrote:
If Brighton win at home against Soton tomorrow we're 16.

We're playing Burnley and Southampton in the next two, and then we have Everton, Man City and Chelsea coming up with Brighton themselves rounding off the year. We could genuinely be under the relegation line by the time 2021 rolls in.

It genuinely terrifies me. I'm convinced most of our players would crumble under the pressure of a relegation battle.

It genuinely frightened people under Emery as well, and we won't be relegated this season either. Not that not being relegated is something to celebrate, I just think it's a bit weird to be worried about it.

Claudius

Quincy Abeyie wrote:
Kurt Eisner wrote:
It genuinely terrifies me. I'm convinced most of our players would crumble under the pressure of a relegation battle.

It genuinely frightened people under Emery as well, and we won't be relegated this season either. Not that not being relegated is something to celebrate, I just think it's a bit weird to be worried about it.

Nobody is worried about relegation. We are worried about being stuck in the nether regions of the table. We have folks saying we aren’t far off top 4, when we are 10 points of the pace 11 rounds into the season. We finished 10 points off 4th and 20 above relegation last season. I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s flipped this season.

KurtEisner

Quincy Abeyie wrote:
Kurt Eisner wrote:
It genuinely terrifies me. I'm convinced most of our players would crumble under the pressure of a relegation battle.

It genuinely frightened people under Emery as well, and we won't be relegated this season either. Not that not being relegated is something to celebrate, I just think it's a bit weird to be worried about it.

I mean, I don't think we'll be relegated either, and I'm sure tomorrow I'll be a bit more sensible about it, but right now it's hard to see where we'll get the points to get out of the lower half of the table if we can't score a fucking goal.

Klaus

Most people don't expect us to be relegated, but the longer we stay in the lower regions of the table the more it's going to be in the back of the players' minds. If Leicester could go from winning the league to nearly being relegated we can to from finishing 8th to doing the same in an incredibly bad year where everything just keeps piling on.

We were so deep in the swamp by this time last year too. What does it do mentally to someone to go through that, then experience a short relief where it looks like the team has straightened out the issues, only to then sink even lower within 12 months?

lorddulaarsenal

Why is it with Arsenal you just permanently want to hit the fast forward button

lorddulaarsenal

Play the Europa team in the league

Would like to see something fresh

_________Leno
AMN—Chambers—Gabriel—Tierney
————Ceballos—Partey
Nelson——Martinelli ———Saka
————-Aubameyang

goon

Claudius wrote:
goon wrote:
We lost to Tottenham, the league leaders with two of the deadliest strikers in Europe at the moment. They had an xG of 0.39, we had an xG of 0.7. They beat City in pretty much the exact same fashion, except their chances were better in that game.

You'd think we just lost at home to Brighton.

We've lost 6 games this season, 4 of them are in the top 6. The other two are Wolves and Villa. I'd argue only the last one involved a performance that gave us no chance of actually getting something from the game.

I'm not saying we're unlucky, I think the brand of football (which I'm becoming less hopeful will change) is a large part of the reason for not only our form but the crisis in confidence. Talk of relegation and crisis are just nonsense. At worst we'll be a mid table side by the end of the season and that may well be enough to signal the death knell for Arteta if there are no visible shoots, but lets not become irrational.

We aren’t creating goals. We don’t score. We all accept that we’ve played some tougher teams, but even with the smaller teams we don’t score. Take Leeds. In the games around us, they conceded 4,4, and 3 goals. We got 0. Oh, I’m sure you’ll say we’re unlucky we had red.
I don’t care so much about brand of football. I like competing. That’s what is evaluated at the end of the season. And he isn’t creating the fundamentals to do so

I'm not denying that. If we were creating and scoring goals we'd be up there near the top four and we'd have probably won some of those bigger games. What you're describing is a team that doesn't have many issues.

As for the fundamentals, I'm actually more encouraged in the last 2-3 games than I have been. We're actually playing with the right system now and are going after the opposition territory. Laca who I actually thought had a decent game today was in that usually vacant space in the middle and we've managed to do without really suffering in the defensive transition.

The rest is all about margins and when all your players are playing like shit, it's going to be on the wrong side of that. This is the aspect that winds me out when it comes to Arteta's management. He's putting far too much weight on players he trusts and experience over the ones who should actually be starting based on ability and form.

invisibleman18

@lorddulaarsenal wrote:
Play the Europa team in the league

Would like to see something fresh

_________Leno
AMN—Chambers—Gabriel—Tierney
————Ceballos—Partey
Nelson——Martinelli ———Saka
————-Aubameyang

Well yeah. We might as well just bring the likes of Willock, Nelson, Nketiah, Martinelli once back into the starting side. What's the value in continuing to play Lacazette, Xhaka and Willian at this point? Surely we don't think we're somehow increasing the transfer value for the former two at present?

goon

Klaus wrote:
We were so deep in the swamp by this time last year too. What does it do mentally to someone to go through that, then experience a short relief where it looks like the team has straightened out the issues, only to then sink even lower within 12 months?

If he loses the players en masse then he needs to go because that's pretty much the point of no return for any manager, but I don't get that sense personally. It can turn pretty quickly though, I always thought the players fought for Emery but that visibly changed in his last few weeks very suddenly. He needs to turn around results quickly.

I also really don't think it helps morale to have a dozen guys in the squad who can't even get in the match day squad. That needs to be addressed asap.

Asterix

Yep that's what I reckon too.

HomeSteak

Auba's father-also his agent, taking shots at Arteta already

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