Coombs wrote:

And you call me a nitpicker.

Emery has overseen, or at least been part of the management team, during a period of radical transformation of Arsenal's setup.

I cannot think of even one benefit of sacking this guy now, at this moment, as we approach this window. We are still waiting for a technical director, we've seen an unbelievable amount of change across the back room, and now we are cresting the wave which will see, potentially, our biggest squad overhaul since the invincibles left. Maybe bigger.

I, for one, see no value at all in doing that without a head coach. Whoever we bring in, it will be far too late to influence our transfer window in any meaningful way (much like Edu, who has to play catch up), and we'll see another season where we don't actually get to judge results without endless caveats. It'll be really tiresome. We need at least one season with this team of people to settle the soil.

We should be talking to a lot of managers behind the scenes, of course. Young guys with potential, rising stars, and old heads. Whoever comes in next, they should come in with a reasonably complete team (even if the quality isn't quite where we want it to be) with players that have something to prove, and who are not anchored by the baggage of the previous setup.

In the next year, Edu will work with Emery to develop youth, along with Per. They'll have discussions about who should play, who should be loaned, who should be released. They'll talk about number of minutes, subs vs starts, etc. If you keep pressing reset, and you can't buy a few 50m pound players to inject some quality and freshness to your squad, then you're digger the grave deeper. It might feel better to go around sacking people, but it won't be. 

I'm actually afraid that Emery might go too soon. It'll be a step backwards, make no mistake. There would have to be someone truly brilliant lined up for it to make any sense, and I highly doubt there is. Even if there was, it seems impossible that we could go much further.

All of Poch, Klopp, and Pep walked into a project that had been ongoing for some time, that was building towards bringing in a manager who could bring the club to a more consistent, higher level. We are so far behind, at all levels of this club. Honestly, all we need is a competent, warm body filling the role of head coach at this point, which has never existed here before. There's too much work to do before any kind of magic can happen.

With that said, I think Emery would have to deliver a title challenge that went to the last 2 or 3 weeks of the season. Otherwise, we should move on. Top 4 and the Europa League would do nicely, and he could leave with his head held high, but I'm not expecting it. Raul and Edu (or whoever it ends up being) are going to have to work very, very fast.

If results are horrid at the beginning of next season, or Ozil is still moping around, or we are still playing we 3 CBs (god fucking forbid), we may need to sack him midseason. As tumultuous as that can be, I'd prefer it over sacking him now and leaving Raul as the only football person employed at the club apart from the players and the kit man.

I appreciate your point that Emery hasn't been here long enough but you have simply ended up explaining in more detail why the manu situation is not a good example.

As for calling you a nitpicker, it was something that i had noticed going on for several weeks but i commend you for stopping since i mentioned it.

Agree with Coombs, clearly not the right time to sack Emery while other positions are still in flux.

We also have to accept that whatever happened behind the scenes with Gazidis, Mislintat, Ramsey and Özil this year needs to be put in the rear view mirror and he needs time to do that.

i agree. i've seen warning signs that emery isn't the right man for the job long-term, but i'm not quite at the point where i'd give up on the guy given the state of the playing staff and leadership group he walked into

Seems to me we would be better off having another season like the one just gone if it means getting the right technical staff in place overall, and then letting him move on, than ratcheting up the chaos right now.

When I think about when my mood started to drop a bit about this new era, it was when we learnt Gazidis was really off. I feel quite a lot of resentment regarding his departure.

FA Cup and third place minimum whilst playing some clever, pacy, enthusiastic, free wheeling football.

Highly unlikely if this absolute deadening drudge of a season past is anything to go by.

I don't think Emery has been bad enough to warrant a sacking. He was literally two wins away from getting both a top 4 spot and winning the Europa League. Whatever other misgivings you might have about style of play, progress etc, objectively I don't think the board have enough to get rid especially since they seem to be impressed with what they've seen on the inside.

Will be interesting to see what if any impact Edu's arrival will have. If he doesn't like what he see's on the pitch, how much of a say will he have on Emery's future? You'd imagine quite a lot given he's supposed to be executing the clubs long term vision, I don't think Sanllehi on the other hand is qualified enough to make that assessment unless it's done on a superficial basis. On that note, without a technical director, can we really afford to get rid of the one man currently at the club with an idea of how he want's to build the team in the short term?

Whatever your thoughts on Emery, it's just not practical to move him on now.

Exactly.

We finished a point behind Spurs where Pochettino is still being hailed as a genius, and reached the final of the only European competition Wenger got us into.

The failure to reach top four has empowered the critics for the summer, and that's fine. I was disturbed by our awful form slump during the end of the season, and I think it pointed to a fundamental problem for Emery. He wasn't able to contain the damage.

Looking back at the season overall, Holding's injury and Ramsey's last injury probably made the difference on reaching the top four. The fact we were that dependent on Holding is an indictment.

Welbeck, holding, bellerin, and ramseys injuries were too much for the squad to handle. I think we just about fineigle 4th if those guys were more available this season

Gazza M wrote:

Welbeck, holding, bellerin, and ramseys injuries were too much for the squad to handle. I think we just about fineigle 4th if those guys were more available this season

Considering the lack of quality, balance and depth to begin with we did remarkably well when on our knees after the triple injury header, and the Rambo injury was simply the final straw / knock-out blow.

Bellerin was a big miss yes.

I'm a bit confused thinking about it, as we haven't done that badly overall.

But now we lose Ramsey and just to tread water, you feel we need to rebuild our defence and bring in at least one really good player forward of defence.

Burnwinter wrote:

Bellerin was a big miss yes.

I'm a bit confused thinking about it, as we haven't done that badly overall.

But now we lose Ramsey and just to tread water, you feel we need to rebuild our defence and bring in at least one really good player forward of defence.

I'd be happy if the 2 CMs worked together as a unit to cover the backline and support the attack, and then we spent the funds to sign players in positions required to make the tactical style work.  I don't care if they're not known names or CL quality so long as they can get the job done for the season.

That said if we're working within a limited budget and we're not culling this season beyond those out of contract or in their last 12-24 months, then if we're going to only spend on one player I'd spend it all on a goal scoring wide man & I'd happily take Mahrez if he's looking for more playing time. 

Gazza M wrote:

Welbeck, holding, bellerin, and ramseys injuries were too much for the squad to handle. I think we just about fineigle 4th if those guys were more available this season

If we are to be balanced, we have to apply that "if" to other clubs as well so i think it's best to go with the "season evens itself out over 38 games" logic.

Muswell Hill Gooner wrote:

Gazza M wrote:

Welbeck, holding, bellerin, and ramseys injuries were too much for the squad to handle. I think we just about fineigle 4th if those guys were more available this season

If we are to be balanced, we have to apply that "if" to other clubs as well so i think it's best to go with the "season evens itself out over 38 games" logic.

Except that in terms of season ending injuries it didn't, and likewise none of the other contenders were required to change their shape half way through the season as a result of injuries.

Anzac wrote:

Muswell Hill Gooner wrote:

If we are to be balanced, we have to apply that "if" to other clubs as well so i think it's best to go with the "season evens itself out over 38 games" logic.

Except that in terms of season ending injuries it didn't, and likewise none of the other contenders were required to change their shape half way through the season as a result of injuries.

Every other team can make up as many "if" excuses for themselves (as you can for us) as "if" is based on supposition.

Also injuries are part of the game and every team suffered them but other teams insulated themselves from it by having deeper squads or having more robust players who wouldn't break down with muscle injuries when their manager asked them to run more. Emery recognised this around Christmas and the team stopped playing the mad pressing game but Ramsey still did his hamstring which shouldn't have been a surprise.
https://www.transfermarkt.com/aaron-ramsey/verletzungen/spieler/50057
We were 5th as 4 teams accumulated more points than us over 38 games.
End of story.

Muswell Hill Gooner wrote:

Gazza M wrote:

Welbeck, holding, bellerin, and ramseys injuries were too much for the squad to handle. I think we just about fineigle 4th if those guys were more available this season

If we are to be balanced, we have to apply that "if" to other clubs as well so i think it's best to go with the "season evens itself out over 38 games" logic.

Nowhere did i suggest it was an excuse. Just an observation on how fragile the squad is

Fair enough but i hope you can understand why your use of the word in the second sentence made me think that.

Muswell Hill Gooner wrote:

Anzac wrote:

Except that in terms of season ending injuries it didn't, and likewise none of the other contenders were required to change their shape half way through the season as a result of injuries.

Every other team can make up as many "if" excuses for themselves (as you can for us) as "if" is based on supposition.

Also injuries are part of the game and every team suffered them but other teams insulated themselves from it by having deeper squads or having more robust players who wouldn't break down with muscle injuries when their manager asked them to run more. Emery recognised this around Christmas and the team stopped playing the mad pressing game but Ramsey still did his hamstring which shouldn't have been a surprise.
https://www.transfermarkt.com/aaron-ramsey/verletzungen/spieler/50057
We were 5th as 4 teams accumulated more points than us over 38 games.
End of story.

That Ramsey injury history is unreal. That Gazidis did not sell him last summer is nothing short of irresponsible if there were willing buyers.
We need to be smarter with asset management. Need to

• Buy more younger gems. Torreira and Guendouzi are a good start
• Buy fewer retirees. Our squad is full of creaking knees now - Monreal, Koscielny etc.
• Know when to sell while we have value. Unfortunately, given our poor squad management in the past, this really points to selling one or more of Xhaka, Lacazette, Aubameyang. That’s where all the value sits, and with the strikers there is enormous value that will evaporate by next summer.

It’s what i’m saying Claudius Maximus. One of Laca or Bama has got to go now if we are serious about turning the model.

Agreed. Laca for 80+, Bama for 100+. Either or works for me.