• The Houseboat

  • Other clubs transfer thread summer 2019 edition (Official: Madrid sign Hazard)

Claudius wrote:

We should be all over that. When Sokratis leaves next year, Saliba and Upamecano would be a young but high potential core.

the only leipzig CB i want is konate.

Meatwad wrote:
Claudius wrote:

We should be all over that. When Sokratis leaves next year, Saliba and Upamecano would be a young but high potential core.

the only leipzig CB i want is konate.

Why? They have 4 CBs miles better than what we have.

Diaby KungFu wrote:
Meatwad wrote:

the only leipzig CB i want is konate.

Why? They have 4 CBs miles better than what we have.

i'm biased against CBs under 6'2".

Meatwad wrote:
Claudius wrote:

We should be all over that. When Sokratis leaves next year, Saliba and Upamecano would be a young but high potential core.

the only leipzig CB i want is konate.

He’s also the most expensive when there are other high quality CBs. The not the best on their teams but still high quality young CBs like Upamecano and Diallo are the guys I’d roll the dice on

Upamecano is by far the best CB on that team. The only reason for that price could be that he’s refusing to sign a new contract. Else he should be worth over 50M easily. I’d have him here in a jiffy.

In 2008, Wenger predicted 'the end of transfer fees' as free transfers maximise players' earnings.
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2008/jun/29/arsenal

That hasn't happened as paying is the only way to guarantee getting the player.
Also clubs responded with 5 year deals for stability but it's still in the interest of the players to not sign as Ramsey is much happier than Zaha.
Kane is another example as he could've been earning double what he is on now at a bigger club had he not extended

Yeah, sorry, I meant to reply to Anzac. I accidentally quoted you instead and then followed up on your last sentence.

Bold Tone wrote:

In 2008, Wenger predicted 'the end of transfer fees' as free contracts maximise players' earnings.
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2008/jun/29/arsenal

That hasn't happened as paying is the only way to guarantee getting the player.
Also clubs responded with 5 year deals for stability but it's still in the interest of the players to not sign as Ramsey is much happier than Zaha.
Kane is another example as he could've been earning double what he is on now at a bigger club had he not extended

Wenger was right. It came to pass. Our players like Ramsey just walk away.
Unfortunately, other clubs have managed to protect and grow their players’ values

Bold Tone wrote:

In 2008, Wenger predicted 'the end of transfer fees' as free contracts maximise players' earnings.
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2008/jun/29/arsenal

That hasn't happened as paying is the only way to guarantee getting the player.
Also clubs responded with 5 year deals for stability but it's still in the interest of the players to not sign as Ramsey is much happier than Zaha.
Kane is another example as he could've been earning double what he is on now at a bigger club had he not extended

i actually wonder if football contracts may start to go the way of NBA contracts. if you just look at the current landscape, take a player like mbappe. If he were free to sign a contract with any club and that club didn't have to pay a fee, he could command a huge sum over multiple years. he could also decide to only sign a 1 year contract and ask for even more money. when you sign a 5 year deal, unless your agent negotiates great escalators in the deal, your wages per week will probably remain fairly flat. lets say real madrid offered him £250k per week on a 5 year deal. with slight raises, what would he be making in year 4? £275k per week maybe? or, he could sign a 1 year deal for £250k per week today, and then next summer, he could sign another 1 year deal for £280k per week as revenues continue to swell and wages continue to rise across the board.

the risk for a player to sign a 1 year deal is they are not getting long term security in the event of major injury or form loss. for a young player in his early 20s, you'd imagine those would be less of a concern. for example, if mbappe breaks his leg tomorrow and he misses a season, its not like teams won't be interested in signing him next summer. for a lesser player or an older player at the end of their prime, the longer guaranteed deal might be a better business decision. but if i were mbappe or some other young elite talent, i wouldnt be eager to commit the next 5 years of my career to a club on a fairly flat wage scale

mdgoonah41 wrote:
Bold Tone wrote:

In 2008, Wenger predicted 'the end of transfer fees' as free transfers maximise players' earnings.
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2008/jun/29/arsenal

That hasn't happened as paying is the only way to guarantee getting the player.
Also clubs responded with 5 year deals for stability but it's still in the interest of the players to not sign as Ramsey is much happier than Zaha.
Kane is another example as he could've been earning double what he is on now at a bigger club had he not extended

i actually wonder if football contracts may start to go the way of NBA contracts. if you just look at the current landscape, take a player like mbappe. If he were free to sign a contract with any club and that club didn't have to pay a fee, he could command a huge sum over multiple years. he could also decide to only sign a 1 year contract and ask for even more money. when you sign a 5 year deal, unless your agent negotiates great escalators in the deal, your wages per week will probably remain fairly flat. lets say real madrid offered him £250k per week on a 5 year deal. with slight raises, what would he be making in year 4? £275k per week maybe? or, he could sign a 1 year deal for £250k per week today, and then next summer, he could sign another 1 year deal for £280k per week as revenues continue to swell and wages continue to rise across the board.

the risk for a player to sign a 1 year deal is they are not getting long term security in the event of major injury or form loss. for a young player in his early 20s, you'd imagine those would be less of a concern. for example, if mbappe breaks his leg tomorrow and he misses a season, its not like teams won't be interested in signing him next summer. for a lesser player or an older player at the end of their prime, the longer guaranteed deal might be a better business decision. but if i were mbappe or some other young elite talent, i wouldnt be eager to commit the next 5 years of my career to a club on a fairly flat wage scale

like anything else, im sure it will take longer than it should to become a thing because "this is just the way we do things" seems to be how this sport is run

I don’t see it.
What you are saying makes sense - reallocate value to the players away from the teams. However, if a player has a chance today to lock in 5 years of guaranteed income, then he will. Just gives him financial security now, which has a higher value than some hypothetical value in the future.

In addition the current system reduces friction. Imagine if every summer we had to re-sign Aubameyang, Lacazette and other top players. Would be so unsettling for the team and fans.

Claudius wrote:

I don’t see it.
What you are saying makes sense - reallocate value to the players away from the teams. However, if a player has a chance today to lock in 5 years of guaranteed income, then he will. Just gives him financial security now, which has a higher value than some hypothetical value in the future.

In addition the current system reduces friction. Imagine if every summer we had to re-sign Aubameyang, Lacazette and other top players. Would be so unsettling for the team and fans.

im not sure its as upsetting as having players constantly agitating for a move away. and again, i dont think every player would want to do a deal like this, just like every NBA player isnt looking to sign successive 1 year contracts. for example, an 18 year old who has made no money on youth contracts, getting a commitment of £25k per week for 4 years might be life changing. of course it would be. im thinking more about the elite superstars. i used mbappe as an example. every summer, from now until hes in his mid 30s, every top team in the world will be lining up to try and acquire his services. even if he has a "down" season, elite teams will still want him, and will still be willing to outdo each other to get him. if im him, im using that leverage. it also doesnt mean he has to move clubs every summer. but he can use the ability to move clubs to gain higher wages.

look at the flip side. imagine if we'd only signed mustafi on a 1 year deal. or ozil.

It makes sense from the players point of view but the clubs would hate it and put up barriers/safety nets.
A perfect example is the 5 yr contracts as a reaction to the "final 2 year" rule.
The 3 yr short term contract is not offered to younger players entering their prime.
The blueprint for every player is to sign a 5-year contract between the age 19 and 21 then leave on a free transfer with a Flamini wage.
The worst that can happen is what Alexis and Ozil are going through (laughing all the way to the bank).

So how does that work in NBA then. Using your Mbappe example would it be the case that he moves at the end of his current contract and only signs for one season at his new team? Then that would start the cycle of short term contracts?

Tam wrote:

So how does that work in NBA then. Using your Mbappe example would it be the case that he moves at the end of his current contract and only signs for one season at his new team? Then that would start the cycle of short term contracts?

kevin durant is a good example. when he went to golden state, he signed a 1 year deal with a 1 year option (his player option) to extend. after the first year, he "declined" his option year, then signed the same type of deal again, 1 year with a 1 year player option. after his second season, he declined his player option and again signed a 1 year deal with a 1 year option. then this summer, he declined his player option and chose to go to brooklyn. due to the NBA's weird sign and trade rules, he technically signed with golden state and was then traded to brooklyn. but he effectively decided he was leaving because his contract was up, and golden state was able to trade him to the team he wanted to sign with.

so, he signed basically 3 one year contracts with golden state, then decided he wanted to go elsewhere. he now signed a 3 year contract with 1 player option after the third year, so it is essentially a 3 year deal. lebron james did similar things when he came back to cleveland.

from a team perspective, it is tough to plan long term. for the player, it allows them maximum leverage and power, both to go where they want to go, and also to pressure their team to stay competitive or they will leave. given how reliant some clubs are on transfer fees to stay afloat, it would be a huge change. this would probably only happen for the best players in the world, because they will have staying power consistently for the duration of their career. for younger players, or non-superstars, having the longer term guaranteed is probably better for them

Unless I'm mistaken the difference in the NBA is players under contract can not renew their contract before the contract is done even if the team and the player want.

Big Willie wrote:

Unless I'm mistaken the difference in the NBA is players under contract can not renew their contract before the contract is done even if the team and the player want.

there are rules around the specifics, but i know that teams can extend their own players if both sides agree. i know the OKC thunder extended russell westrbook's contract the summer that durant left, for example. he was still under contract, but they tacked on additional money and years. both sides had to agree to it.

But MD, forgive me if I’m mistaken, aren’t a lot of these shorter deals that elite NBA players take typically so that they can be part of an elite squad in the short term under restrictive salary cap situations. The idea being that once they get to the end of the 1 or 2 years, they will seek to find a situation where they can get themselves a maximum contract for the full length the CBA allows.

Again, the rational player will work himself towards guaranteeing himself the biggest possible pay packet. If that means taking a hit for one or two years to win a title with the promise of a max deal down the line, then they can do that. But it seems irrational to normally want to go into annual contract negotiations.

Theres a difference between a 20 yo player leaving Toronto for Cleveland Miami or LA and another one for someone leaving France for Madrid Milano or London too. No way we'll have a NBA situation any time soon in football

Claudius wrote:

But MD, forgive me if I’m mistaken, aren’t a lot of these shorter deals that elite NBA players take typically so that they can be part of an elite squad in the short term under restrictive salary cap situations. The idea being that once they get to the end of the 1 or 2 years, they will seek to find a situation where they can get themselves a maximum contract for the full length the CBA allows.

Again, the rational player will work himself towards guaranteeing himself the biggest possible pay packet. If that means taking a hit for one or two years to win a title with the promise of a max deal down the line, then they can do that. But it seems irrational to normally want to go into annual contract negotiations.

they make short term deals because the max salary in the NBA is tied to a percentage of the salary cap. for example, the max contract this year for someone with 7-9 years of service time was 30% of the overall salary cap, which is $109M. that works out to $32.7M per year. next year, if the cap rises again (like most expect), a 1 year deal at 30% of a $115M cap would be $36.8M. if a player signed a 2 year max contract this summer, he'd make $32.7M and $34.8M for 2 years, because raises can only go up by a certain percentage each year. so by signing a 1 year deal and then signing a new 1 year deal next year after the cap has gone up, you make more money. the superstars have signed shorter deals to maximize their earnings. they risk the long term stability. but as we just saw with durant, even though he suffered basically the worst injury you can suffer, he declined his 1 year option, then signed a near max contract with brooklyn. they were willing to pay him for 1 season to do nothing because of how good he is and the surplus value they'll get when hes actually back and healthy.

in a way, this is all just an academic exercise, because the NBA is a salary cap world and football isnt.

jones wrote:

Theres a difference between a 20 yo player leaving Toronto for Cleveland Miami or LA and another one for someone leaving France for Madrid Milano or London too. No way we'll have a NBA situation any time soon in football

i know. but thinking about stuff like this distracts me from the realities of arsenal

Anything that distracts you from Arsenal Football Club is fair enough in my book man

Napoli's President De Laurentiis on signing Icardi: "I met Wanda Nara three years ago and I have no intention of seeing her again. That meeting was enough for me."

😆 😆

[L'Équipe] Barcelona have paid Griezmann's release clause of €120m

This saga might really end.

Tottenham have agreed personal terms in principle with Giovani Lo Celso worth £150,000-a-week. [Estadio Deportivo]

[James Ducker] : Manchester United left stunned by Newcastle's £50m asking price for Sean Longstaff.

50 milion gets you Sean Longstaff 😆

OFFICIAL: Barça sign Louie Barry from West Bromwich Albion on a free transfer. He will play for Juvenil A

Di Marzio: Barella to Inter, deal done. Medicals soon.

BBC: Sam Allardyce Turns Down Newcastle United Job

When Sam says no to you...it's just sad.

[Luke Edwards] Sources at St James’ Park have indicated to Telegraph Sport that, barring any last-minute hitches, Steve Bruce will be announced as Rafa Benitez’s replacement before the weekend.

[RMC] PSG are keen on Sandro Tonali, Leonardo has met with the player's agent several times, the Italian player does not want to renew his contract at Brescia who expect €25m

According to Di Marzio and Turkish press, Fenerbahçe whose debt exceeds 500 million Euros and are under Financial Fair Play restrictions are interested in signing Sami Khedira from Juventus

[L'Équipe] PSG have offered €30m for Idrissa Gueye

Di Marzio: Bennacer has accepted Milan’s offer, everything could be formalised by tomorrow. Next few hours could be decisive for Veretout.

Gonna make some money here.

I. Hagi in Belgium for medical tests, hours away from officially joining Genk on 3 year deal

How much are we getting for Bennacer?

LOL @ the Napoli president on Wanda Nara. She sounds absolutely nuts.

Intrigued by this Spurs Le Celso deal. Really wonder if it is contingent on sales. If it isn’t, Spurs are going for it.

It'll be to replace Eriksen.

If they also get Ceballos (not that I am an expert on the Spaniard by any means, but he looked very impressive at Euro U21s this summer) and are able to make a trio of Ceballos, Ndombele and Lo Celso work as a functioning midfield then I would be very surprised if they weren't a much better team next season than they were last.

They would still be a mile behind City and Liverpool basically in every other area of the pitch, so not too much to worry about really. But unless big things happen here in the next few weeks, they'd be a proper, solid distance ahead of us, as opposed to last season where, even ignoring the points difference, in terms of quality there really wasn't a huge amount in it.

But there aren’t any Eriksen rumours. I don’t see Eriksen leaving this summer. It’s contingent on Pogba pursuit failing and Madrid settling for the Dane.
As for Saliba, he might make sense for them to bring in immediately if Alderweireld goes to Roma this summer.
And Spurs would be buying nice and young, protecting value for the future. This is what normal clubs seem to be doing. And then selling to wasters like us.

Does that mean no Neymar? Cos if he still does go then they'll have Messi, Suarez, Neymar and Griezman! Bonkers

Eriksen is so poor thing. Asked to leave and there's 0 bids coming in. LOL

The Barcelona videos are always so fucking cringe

mdgoonah41 wrote:

why did they get for him? about £80m?

God no. Only £8m.

arsedoc md wrote:

what on earth is a sean longstaff

apparently worth £50 million

Newcastle are crazy, I will be shocked if they are not relegated this season

We should give them a £50m hamper of Mustafi, Elneny and Jenkinson.

So in the end Rabiot went for a reported £120k a week and a £9m signing on fee, rather cheap considering the rumours that were going around.