Klaus wrote:

Bloomberg is not the one pretending to be a progressive. Warren is.

Warren voted for Reagan and Nixon. She was a republican until the late 90's. Of course she had no interest in letting the Dems move left.

Claudius wrote:

Bernie is losing “self-identifying” Democrats by large margins. Again, it’s sad but it goes back to what I was saying about building relationships. The guy has great ideas, but when he comes into the Democratic Party and is talking about taking on the establishment, etc., rather than focus on his great ideas, he starts to turn off some people. Hopefully, the younger socialists like The Squad are watching him and know how to navigate. They often display similar tear the house down ideals, and they could also experience cell rejection at Presidential level of not careful.

It's a really annoying trait of the left, always preaching to the choir and alienating everyone else instead of attempting to bring them with you. 

This whole narrative of Warren laying down for Bernie doesn’t make sense. Again, on the previous page I listed all her accomplishments. One thing I left out was consumer financial protection bureau. I went to university in the states. We all had massive loans. When financiers were fucking over young adults with usurious practices, that’s the only place that helped my American friends out. Who else is successfully taking on big corporations and holding them to account. Sanders supporters need to end this misinformation about Warren being some wolf in sheep’s clothings. She’s all wolf. The financial sector, healthcare companies and big tech do not want to see her in power.

Klaus wrote:

Bloomberg is not the one pretending to be a progressive. Warren is.

What I meant was that if Bloomberg fucked off, his votes would end up with Biden so in effect Warren and Bloomberg are cancelling each other out. It's relevant because at some stage they both will step down but I don't think it'll end up having a dramatic impact on the race.

Claudius wrote:

This whole narrative of Warren laying down for Bernie doesn’t make sense.

She hadn't won a single state before the super tuesday and was polling worse than most of the ones that dropped out and endorsed Biden. She finished third in her own home state tonight, now that's embarrassing. She had no chance at winning anything but stayed in to fuck things up for the part of the left that did. There were 1.5 million votes or so that could have a big difference even if not all of them had gone to Sanders. Qwiss is exactly right.

Mirth wrote:

Klaus wrote:

Bloomberg is not the one pretending to be a progressive. Warren is.

What I meant was that if Bloomberg fucked off, his votes would end up with Biden so in effect Warren and Bloomberg are cancelling each other out. It's relevant because at some stage they both will step down but I don't think it'll end up having a dramatic impact on the race.

Gotcha. Yes, sure. But Bloomberg didn't fuck off so that feels irrelevant. In fact, the fact he didn't fuck off like everyone else made it even more urgent for Warren to do so if she ever had any intention of seeing someone pushing a progressive platform in the White House.

Mirth wrote:

Can someone explain why the African American demographic tends to vote for Biden?

Obamas VP, abd tendencies to stick to the conservative democrat lane out of loyalty and fear of big change. I think religion plays a part too. Bernie is a atheist and that doesn't fly among conservative african americans that make up the bulk of their vote. I would say also a lack of specific messaging from bernies campaign. An african american friend of mine voted biden in TX and basically said when there's a big shake-up like what bernie is proposing black folks still end up at the back of the line. He also said he felt bernie worked overtime for the latino vote, and felt like his policies were only beneficial to black people tangentially or as an afterthought. Things like M4A and tuition free college would benefit the black community immensely, but the message was delivered as a rising tide lifts all boats, and the more extreme interpretation as my friend put it was heard as 'all lives matter'. The classism over racism rhetoric just isnt received well

Thank you Mirth and Gazza. It's not easy to understand the nuts and bolts of American politics.

12 years later nothing changed

Gazza M wrote:

Mirth wrote:

Can someone explain why the African American demographic tends to vote for Biden?

Obamas VP, abd tendencies to stick to the conservative democrat lane out of loyalty and fear of big change. I think religion plays a part too. Bernie is a atheist and that doesn't fly among conservative african americans that make up the bulk of their vote. I would say also a lack of specific messaging from bernies campaign. An african american friend of mine voted biden in TX and basically said when there's a big shake-up like what bernie is proposing black folks still end up at the back of the line. He also said he felt bernie worked overtime for the latino vote, and felt like his policies were only beneficial to black people tangentially or as an afterthought. Things like M4A and tuition free college would benefit the black community immensely, but the message was delivered as a rising tide lifts all boats, and the more extreme interpretation as my friend put it was heard as 'all lives matter'. The classism over racism rhetoric just isnt received well

Makes sense, I'm just shocked by the degree to which Biden is supported

I personally think you cannot underestimate how much Bernies atheism hurts him among African-American voters. Think it's a bigger deal than Biden's Obama rub.

Strange given his record alright.

Klaus wrote:

Claudius wrote:

This whole narrative of Warren laying down for Bernie doesn’t make sense.

She hadn't won a single state before the super tuesday and was polling worse than most of the ones that dropped out and endorsed Biden. She finished third in her own home state tonight, now that's embarrassing. She had no chance at winning anything but stayed in to fuck things up for the part of the left that did. There were 1.5 million votes or so that could have a big difference even if not all of them had gone to Sanders. Qwiss is exactly right.

It would be interesting to poll her voters though and look at her second choices now that the choices have narrowed. I wouldn’t be surprised if it wasn’t a 100% Bernie allocation but closer to a 60:40 Bernie: Biden allocation. She’s a attracting a lot of establishment voters, particularly women and white college educated types. Many of those might be more convinced by Biden’s ‘electability’ than Bernie’s revolution.

Also worth saying that Biden will generate a lot of funds now and he still has the Obama card to play as well. Conventional logic says that invoke the Obama's name to take on Trump but if he does get into trouble before that then being able to deploy both Barack and Michelle Obama will be effectively a get out of jail card since they're both still incredibly popular with Democrats.

Gazza M wrote:

Mirth wrote:

Can someone explain why the African American demographic tends to vote for Biden?

Obamas VP, abd tendencies to stick to the conservative democrat lane out of loyalty and fear of big change. I think religion plays a part too. Bernie is a atheist and that doesn't fly among conservative african americans that make up the bulk of their vote. I would say also a lack of specific messaging from bernies campaign. An african american friend of mine voted biden in TX and basically said when there's a big shake-up like what bernie is proposing black folks still end up at the back of the line. He also said he felt bernie worked overtime for the latino vote, and felt like his policies were only beneficial to black people tangentially or as an afterthought. Things like M4A and tuition free college would benefit the black community immensely, but the message was delivered as a rising tide lifts all boats, and the more extreme interpretation as my friend put it was heard as 'all lives matter'. The classism over racism rhetoric just isnt received well

Good points. Another aspect is the risk: reward issue. Based on conversations I have had with African American friends, they look at electability seriously. They know that they face a bigger risk than White friends if Trump continues to be president. He’s been openly racist in a first term where there is a threat of losing an election. What might he do in a second term where he has no controls? So they prefer the moderate candidates.

There are a lot of other under-reported dynamics going on with black voters. A lot of black voters I know are dedicated churchgoers and socially conservative, regardless of where they sit on the economic spectrum. But a post-Gingrich Republican Party is no place for a black voter, and the further left you go in the Democratic Party is also increasingly alienating. So it’s always interesting to hear the media talk about black voters, but I suspect there are at least two clusters (and it might be worth thinking of them that way even if they only constitute 4-7% of the vote each).

Oh, just saw that Jens covered atheism.

Mirth wrote:

Also worth saying that Biden will generate a lot of funds now and he still has the Obama card to play as well. Conventional logic says that invoke the Obama's name to take on Trump but if he does get into trouble before that then being able to deploy both Barack and Michelle Obama will be effectively a get out of jail card since they're both still incredibly popular with Democrats.

Biden has weathered the storm, has the momentum and if all else fails they can produce the Obamas at some big rallies near the convention to slam the door. Sadly the writing seem to be on the wall for another heartbreak for Bernie.

Jens wrote:

Mirth wrote:

Also worth saying that Biden will generate a lot of funds now and he still has the Obama card to play as well. Conventional logic says that invoke the Obama's name to take on Trump but if he does get into trouble before that then being able to deploy both Barack and Michelle Obama will be effectively a get out of jail card since they're both still incredibly popular with Democrats.

Biden has weathered the storm, has the momentum and if all else fails they can produce the Obamas at some big rallies near the convention to slam the door. Sadly the writing seem to be on the wall for another heartbreak for Bernie.

Also catching up on the news this morning, some how Biden's managed to tap into the underdog narrative this past week

I have no idea how he's spun that but I'm grudgingly impressed and it'll probably ensure a consistent turnout.

Don't think this is quite over yet, Biden in some ways hasn't been thoroughly vetted and will be subject to more (if not enough) scrutiny from here on in.

Burnwinter wrote:

Don't think this is quite over yet, Biden in some ways hasn't been thoroughly vetted and will be subject to more (if not enough) scrutiny from here on in.

https://www.salon.com/2020/02/27/superdelegates-willing-to-risk-intraparty-damage-to-block-sanders-at-contested-convention-report/

It was over before it ever started really.

Well it’s like a boxing match where you are trying to defeat the champion or odds on favorite. You can’t afford for it to be close in any way. You go for the KO and make sure it’s out of the hands of the judges.

Sanders couldn’t do that.

The appeal of Biden is as a stabilizing force or personality post Trump.

Only problem is things are returned to the very status quo that produced Trump in the first place, so what next?

flobaba wrote:

Well it’s like a boxing match where you are trying to defeat the champion or odds on favorite. You can’t afford for it to be close in any way. You go for the KO and make sure it’s out of the hands of the judges.

Sanders couldn’t do that.

Yeah, that sounds pretty accurate flobs. I don't recall Sanders running any attack ads vs. Biden. 

The moderates have combined:

https://www.businessinsider.com/mike-bloomberg-drops-out-of-the-2020-presidential-race-2020-3?fbclid=IwAR0vpJ3T66yely4PpY3_fvaYWJJ5zVP_9c8Ps_DqtY7UiM6f3BZ8JyjY-GM

Bloomberg’s gone. Half a billion dollars for 12 delegates. Won’t even be able to bargain with that at the convention. Should’ve just put his cash towards climate change, black lives matter or some other cause, or my retirement fund. He’s having a laugh

Hopefully his campaign discourages other billionaires from trying to buy in.

First sensible thing he's said in a while. The only reason for her to stay in the race is to ensure that Sandes doesn't win.

I have to admit I really enjoyed his Bloomberg impression.

arsedoc md wrote:

Trump is a Bernie bro.

if there's one thing he knows well, it's money and influence. with that in mind, i think he's always known biden would be the guy. throwing out pro-sanders tweets is part of a longer play to paint the democrats as corrupt and against the working class in the general election. at least, that's always been my take. plus he's just a massive troll

I think / hope Biden would be calmer on a one v one stage against Trump. In that scenario he doesn’t have to think about trying to make quick points, but rather just address issues and direct his talk to the American people rather than attack or defend against accusations in 20 second question blocks.

He's seriously showing signs of dementia

jones wrote:

He's seriously showing signs of dementia

What issues is he going to address? His entire career has been to coopt positions from Republican opponents and sell them back as liberalism.

"Running Joe Biden for president is like making your dog wear a dress, it may make for an amusing Instagram post but it's wrong, you can see the confusion in the dog's eyes, you can see the confusion in Joe's eyes....if you look closely"

Tucker is utterly reprehensible.
Biden could be buried by these guys, he's a disaster, seems Democrats would be insane to go with him.

Alternatively Covid-19 could be Trump's Katrina

flobaba wrote:

I think / hope Biden would be calmer on a one v one stage against Trump. In that scenario he doesn’t have to think about trying to make quick points, but rather just address issues and direct his talk to the American people rather than attack or defend against accusations in 20 second question blocks.

On current evidence, Biden will get wrecked. He's an old and (for a politician) thoroughly confused man. His brand is traditional and safe but he can't beat Trump on reactionary nativist nation-building. He can't attack Trump on character because he's got his own accusers. He can't attack Trump on the economy because Trump and the media have successfully sold the illusion that it's solid.

The Democrats need a candidate that appears to be outside the establishment this time around, not a Former Vice Has-Been.