Time for the fans to stick by the manager: Page 18 - The Arsenal discussion forum and community: One More in the Tolly

Time for the fans to stick by the manager

Klaus

I'm honestly not sure which part you're referring to. I know he wasn't sick/injured because his social media accounts contradicted it. I know Emery has cited a number of different reasons because he has actually cited them in his press conferences.

arsedocmd

Ozil at some point tweeted he was fit, think about 3 games ago.
This is exhausting guys. ..it was a depleted bournemouth side, not barcelona. I know we did good but can we wait a bit more before the I told you so's.

QuincyAbeyie

Klaus wrote:
jones wrote:
When did he claim Özil was injured when he wasn't? Genuine question

Also is Ornstein lying too about Özil not putting in enough effort in training?

Özil has no more been dropped for performing lacklustre in training than Ramsey has.

What do you think he's been dropped for?

Klaus

Quincy Abeyie wrote:
Klaus wrote:
Özil has no more been dropped for performing lacklustre in training than Ramsey has.

What do you think he's been dropped for?

Because Emery doesn't play through the middle, or even through the right much, which are the two areas that Özil operate in. Since October or so we've played almost exclusively down the left flank and stuffed the rest of the field with labourers. Same reason Ramsey hasn't played much really. We have no intention to break through the lines most of the time.

Lately we've been on a horrid run and needed more creativity, but I don't expect this to last.

flobaba

But how does that even make sense? I’m serious, how? He dropped him because “he doesn’t play through the middle or right much”? Is that not cutting one’s nose to spite the face? Who would do that for no reason other than, personal preference? And now we need more creativity, so suddenly Emery can play through the middle, and if things continue to go well, we will drop Ozil again so the grass in the middle of the park doesn’t get over trodden? I really don’t get this logic.

Claudius

Klaus wrote:
Quincy Abeyie wrote:
What do you think he's been dropped for?

Because Emery doesn't play through the middle, or even through the right much, which are the two areas that Özil operate in. Since October or so we've played almost exclusively down the left flank and stuffed the rest of the field with labourers. Same reason Ramsey hasn't played much really. We have no intention to break through the lines most of the time.

Lately we've been on a horrid run and needed more creativity, but I don't expect this to last.

Last week you said we shouldn't delve into conjecture. This is certainly that zone. That beyond all the other explanations we have for Ozil's absence that he has suddenly been resurrected only to give us creativity during a horrid run.
It also makes no sense. The argument is that the manager is willing to punish the star performer by benching him. Then in his darkest hour when the team is not creating he appeals to the star to save him. When the star saves him doesn't that make said manager look like an absolute buffoon for having sat him before? It would also give the upper hand to the star in the standoff, the knowledge that he owns the power in the relationship, the manager needs him more than he needs the manager. I really doubt that Emery has played himself into such a situation.

As for playing through the right, we were very strong through the right early in the season with Mkhitaryan and Bellerin. They tied up brilliantly and some argued that we were potentially too weighted to that flank. And then Mkhitaryan lost form before both men picked up injuries.

flobaba

And We played almost exclusively down the left because our best attacking outlet down the right wing, Bellerin, is out for the season. No one knows why Ramsey hasn’t played much, but the fact that he is leaving us, and priority should be given to the players we know are going to remain with us long term is a much more plausible theory to me than “Emery doesn’t attack through the middle”

goon

Going into the season I thought it was well established that his preferred formation is the 4-2-3-1 with a No.10?

Also Ozil getting dubious injuries and illnesses has been going on since he signed. There was a pretty incredible stat on how many games he'd missed through illness since 2017. I don't think it has anything to do with Emery covering for himself. When he's left him out of his own accord he's made it pretty clear it's for 'tactical' reasons.

Klaus

flobaba wrote:
But how does that even make sense? I’m serious, how? He dropped him because “he doesn’t play through the middle or right much”? Is that not cutting one’s nose to spite the face? Who would do that for no reason other than, personal preference? And now we need more creativity, so suddenly Emery can play through the middle, and if things continue to go well, we will drop Ozil again so the grass in the middle of the park doesn’t get over trodden? I really don’t get this logic.

Genuinely, what is there to get, flobs? He has flopped around all season on formations and tactics. The one constant is the absurd overloading of the left flank. You get Aubameyang up front one week, and in midfield the next. We play three at the back and load the middle with three central-defensive players on most days, only pick one goalscorer and create very few chances. Is it good management? No, not particularly, and it's at the core of the issue a lot of people have with Emery.

flobaba

No, the core of the issue most people have with Emery is primarily that he is not playing Ozil, and also Ramsey (to a lesser extent). And without these two, he is obviously limited in what flexibility he has in player selection in attack (midfield specifically). Our left side also happens to have one of the most dynamic attacking full backs in the league in Kolasinac. On the right, Micki has been wish washy with form and injury before the last couple of games, and Bellerin also was shaky even before his big injury. I don’t think there’s more to it than that.

Clrnc

One good match and all the conspiracy theories start again. FFS guys just enjoy our recent good form, Ozil or not. I prefer to support Arsenal as a club irregardless of who plays in our match, as long as we win.

It's not Emery's fault Ozil is always out with dubious reasons. It's exactly the same under Wenger, the only common denominator here is the player himself often being weak and sick. Even Wenger recently said Ozil is in his comfort zone, hinting he isn't giving his full effort.

Ray

Ozil has missed something like 100 games out of 300 since signing for Arsenal. Can't really blame Emery for Ozil missing games, Ozil's issues were here long before Emery arrived.

Klaus

flobaba wrote:
No, the core of the issue most people have with Emery is primarily that he is not playing Ozil, and also Ramsey (to a lesser extent).

I can only vouch for whas has been said on this forum, but the issue most people have had with Emery since day one is that we don't play in a way that creates a lot of chances. It's connected to not getting the most out of players like Özil and Ramsey of course who both operate centrally and break up lines on the field, but there were many games during the fall where he'd punt Özil and Ramsey around in unfamiliar roles. We talked about overperforming expected goals stats more than anyone else in Europe to an insane degree, even when we were on a good run. Our chance creation has not gone up since while our efficiency in front of goal has decreased. That's a big part of the reason why we've lost 8 games since the beginning of december.

flobaba

Unfamiliar roles? Did he ever ask either of them to play in goal or defence?

Klaus

Yes, that's exactly it.

Ray

Klaus wrote:
flobaba wrote:
No, the core of the issue most people have with Emery is primarily that he is not playing Ozil, and also Ramsey (to a lesser extent).

I can only vouch for whas has been said on this forum, but the issue most people have had with Emery since day one is that we don't play in a way that creates a lot of chances. It's connected to not getting the most out of players like Özil and Ramsey of course who both operate centrally and break up lines on the field, but there were many games during the fall where he'd punt Özil and Ramsey around in unfamiliar roles. We talked about overperforming expected goals stats more than anyone else in Europe to an insane degree, even when we were on a good run. Our chance creation has not gone up since while our efficiency in front of goal has decreased. That's a big part of the reason why we've lost 8 games since the beginning of december.

We lost 7 games. 4 of which involved Spurs, Pool, Utd and City. Games we have lost previously and would have lost regardless of whether Ozil was playing or not. Not to mention some of these weren't PL games, and I couldn't care less about the league cup or FA cup in a season where we need to get back into CL.

Klaus

I didn't say all of them were PL games. We lost to Southampton, West Ham and BATE Borisov and drew against Brighton & Hove. That tells me the issue was not just playing against top teams like Spurs, Pool, United and City.

Ray

There's a difference in mindset for a cup game and a PL game. The Southampton game our issues were defensively, West Ham and Bate Borisov were games where Ozil may have made a difference, but the Bate game didn't really make a difference.

Claudius

Don’t forget that we played a lot of these games with a stretched team. Injuries to half the defense and key folks like Mkhitaryan as well. That also contributed to these losses.

flobaba

The more relevant point to me is that most of these games Klaus is referring to happened to be away from home. As against the quality of opposition. That is the more worrying trend which I hope we can address and arrest in weeks/ games to come

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