Laca starting to boss it?: Page 29 - The Arsenal discussion forum and community: One More in the Tolly

Laca starting to boss it?

QuincyAbeyie

Don't really think Laca and Giroud are very similar. I don't think people have a short memory either, they say we need a better striker than Laca. It's the type of striker that's the point. You said yourself that performances like yesterday will be few and far between, isn't that exactly that what a better striker with similar strengths would fix?

flobaba

Giroud is/was a much better striker than Laca. Their career stats bear this out, for both club and country.

We are not going to get a haaland or the like, so we are basically shopping in tier B. That's the Giroud level shelf

QuincyAbeyie

All I've seen is that people want a striker who can link up. Doesn't mean they want a slow striker who can't run with the ball for shit. It sounds like you're saying there are two types of strikers, the Giroud type and the non-Giroud type. If you disagree that a striker should be able to link up (the "Giroud level shelf"), then what kind of tier B striker are you looking for?

goon

Giroud is a houseboat fraud of a striker, nobody wants more of that. His holdup and link play was more problematic than a skill. His one trick being first time layoffs to runners.

There's plenty of strikers who can play, I'd argue the Auba/Vardy type centre forwards are the ones that are a dying breed.

flobaba

The in form Auba type.

But that doesn't work for controlball for whatever reason.

QuincyAbeyie

So if we want a striker who can link up we have to shop at the Giroud tier but if not we can shop at the in form Auba tier?

flobaba

goon wrote:
Giroud is a houseboat fraud of a striker, nobody wants more of that. His holdup and link play was more problematic than a skill. His one trick being first time layoffs to runners.

There's plenty of strikers who can play, I'd argue the Auba/Vardy type centre forwards are the ones that are a dying breed.

I don't think there's a dying breed of any position. You can be required to add more strings to your bow, but a strikers basic function is to put the ball in the back of the net, regardless of what else is going on around him. If Auba was playing as shit as he has been (with his zero hold up play ass) but still knocking those easy chances he's been missing recently in, even with his disciplinary issues, no one would be calling for Laca right now.

Ricky1985

Even with wide men like Martinelli and Saka - speed, flair and goal threat - I absolutely cannot be doing with a striker that can't run.

That said, I think your definition of a striker is a little too narrow. They don't all have to be Thierry Henry in terms of quality, impact and style. Firmino is a bit of a plodder in some ways, for example, and quite similar to Lacazette really, as has been discussed here before, and yet it works for Liverpool in their set-up. Salah and Mané are the "Henrys" of the team.

I think Martinelli and Saka are good enough for something similar to work here, even if it's not to my taste.

flobaba

Quincy Abeyie wrote:
So if we want a striker who can link up we have to shop at the Giroud tier but if not we can shop at the in form Auba tier?

If that's what you think I'm getting at, sure

QuincyAbeyie

flobaba wrote:
Quincy Abeyie wrote:
So if we want a striker who can link up we have to shop at the Giroud tier but if not we can shop at the in form Auba tier?

If that's what you think I'm getting at, sure

People want a striker who can link up and you say that sounds like people want Giroud because that's the tier we're shopping at. I then ask you what kind of striker you would shop considering the tier you say we're shopping in and you say in form Auba. Surely the budget/status limitations you put on people who want someone who can link up need to apply for you as well.

You could just explain what I've gotten wrong instead of whatever it is you're doing.

goon

flobaba wrote:
goon wrote:
Giroud is a houseboat fraud of a striker, nobody wants more of that. His holdup and link play was more problematic than a skill. His one trick being first time layoffs to runners.

There's plenty of strikers who can play, I'd argue the Auba/Vardy type centre forwards are the ones that are a dying breed.

I don't think there's a dying breed of any position. You can be required to add more strings to your bow, but a strikers basic function is to put the ball in the back of the net, regardless of what else is going on around him. If Auba was playing as shit as he has been (with his zero hold up play ass) but still knocking those easy chances he's been missing recently in, even with his disciplinary issues, no one would be calling for Laca right now.

There's more than one way to skin a cat and obviously there's a place for an in form Auba, but it doesn't mean it's the best way.

It is definitely a dying breed though for top sides, I reckon the likes of Auba are moulded into wingers these days. No coincidence that Wenger, Emery and Arteta put Auba himself out there for large spells.

I'm with you, I want my striker to score at least 15+ league goals, but they need to be able to join in with the build up too, it provides too much of an advantage not to.

flobaba

😆 Don’t you get tired of getting into these sort of conversations? You can either take what I’m saying and parse it word for word, letter for letter, or you can catch my drift.

QuincyAbeyie

I'm sure it was a really good point. You're right, everyone's asking for Giroud instead of in form Auba.

flobaba

goon wrote:
flobaba wrote:
I don't think there's a dying breed of any position. You can be required to add more strings to your bow, but a strikers basic function is to put the ball in the back of the net, regardless of what else is going on around him. If Auba was playing as shit as he has been (with his zero hold up play ass) but still knocking those easy chances he's been missing recently in, even with his disciplinary issues, no one would be calling for Laca right now.

There's more than one way to skin a cat and obviously there's a place for an in form Auba, but it doesn't mean it's the best way.

It is definitely a dying breed though for top sides, I reckon the likes of Auba are moulded into wingers these days. No coincidence that Wenger, Emery and Arteta put Auba himself out there for large spells.

I'm with you, I want my striker to score at least 15+ league goals, but they need to be able to join in with the build up too, it provides too much of an advantage not to.

Yep. you’re talking about the total package there. My point is you’re not going to find very many of those, who are in the top tier both physically and technically. Which is why I mentioned Haaland as an example of someone who does that to a world class standard.

In the premier league you have players like Lukaku, and in the next tier the Toney’s, Calvert Lewins etc.

I don’t want bloody Ivan Toney/ Calvert Lewin as my top striker. Unless they are going to become Drogba, and even peak Drogba had his detractors on here.

flobaba

Quincy Abeyie wrote:
I'm sure it was a really good point. You're right, everyone's asking for Giroud instead of in form Auba.

🙂 okay boss.

goon

flobaba wrote:
goon wrote:
There's more than one way to skin a cat and obviously there's a place for an in form Auba, but it doesn't mean it's the best way.

It is definitely a dying breed though for top sides, I reckon the likes of Auba are moulded into wingers these days. No coincidence that Wenger, Emery and Arteta put Auba himself out there for large spells.

I'm with you, I want my striker to score at least 15+ league goals, but they need to be able to join in with the build up too, it provides too much of an advantage not to.

Yep. you’re talking about the total package there. My point is you’re not going to find very many of those, who are in the top tier both physically and technically. Which is why I mentioned Haaland as an example of someone who does that to a world class standard.

In the premier league you have players like Lukaku, and in the next tier the Toney’s, Calvert Lewins etc.

I don’t want bloody Ivan Toney/ Calvert Lewin as my top striker. Unless they are going to become Drogba, and even peak Drogba had his detractors on here.

I don't think you'll find many who are simply top goalscorers either though, none come to mind and either way they'd still cost a fortune.

So if you can't buy the very best, buy the ones who fit you style the best. If plodders like Laca and Firmino can do a job, I'm sure we can find someone who can do a bit of both and hopefully one day to both to a high standard - though it defo wont be easy.

QuincyAbeyie

goon wrote:
flobaba wrote:
I don't think there's a dying breed of any position. You can be required to add more strings to your bow, but a strikers basic function is to put the ball in the back of the net, regardless of what else is going on around him. If Auba was playing as shit as he has been (with his zero hold up play ass) but still knocking those easy chances he's been missing recently in, even with his disciplinary issues, no one would be calling for Laca right now.

I want my striker to score at least 15+ league goals, but they need to be able to join in with the build up too, it provides too much of an advantage not to.

Yeah, and we can definitely get a striker like that. I don't see why we can't get a Haaland (though he's an extreme example and the next step down from him is of course not Ivan Toney). Dortmund got a Haaland, and they're not winning Bundesliga nor are they rich. He's been scoring at pretty much this rate ever since he signed for them, it's not like he's only now getting good enough. We got one of the best RBs and one of the best GKs in the league because we got them before most people realized they were that good. Being in our position means we have to get the Haalands of this world early before they're the 21/22 edition of him, not that we can't get him at all.

Ricky1985

Vlahovic is perhaps that player, but it's up for debate as to whether he has the sort of quality and all-round game Flo is talking about and also whether we have a chsnce of signing him after his the 12 months he's had.

QuincyAbeyie

He's probably one of those who it's too late to get. He's even top scorer in the league so far.

Rohit

Nice one from Laca

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