Players Out: Page 154 - The Arsenal discussion forum and community: One More in the Tolly

Players Out

Gazza M

It's getting to the point where we should be considering project youth 2.0

Any senior players who don't want to be part of leading such a project can be sold

Get in young talent on lower wages that fit a vision, and grow them together over time

flobaba

“Over time”

How much time are you willing to wait for a project that has no guarantee of success? We are not Ajax. This isn’t the Dutch League. Our fan base expects trophies yesterday! Don’t see us or any premier league side in this time and age committing to a youth project anytime soon.

Claudius

Gazza M wrote:
It's getting to the point where we should be considering project youth 2.0

Any senior players who don't want to be part of leading such a project can be sold

Get in young talent on lower wages that fit a vision, and grow them together over time

Please describe this youth project in more detail. Who are your ideal youth?

goon

flobaba wrote:
“Over time”

How much time are you willing to wait for a project that has no guarantee of success? We are not Ajax. This isn’t the Dutch League. Our fan base expects trophies yesterday! Don’t see us or any premier league side in this time and age committing to a youth project anytime soon.

What’s the alternative that does guarantee success? There isn’t one. And for a club with our budget, there isn’t an alternative that even provides a better chance of success. A rolling youth policy of some sort is one of a very limited number of options available to us.

Our fan base needs a reality check if they want to realistically win the league in the next year or two.

Coombs

I have to say, I feel the calls for youth are very naive. Our current prospects are overrated, and the viability of such a project in this league is limited even if we got 1 or 2 genuinely top talents. We didn't succeed before, why would we on a second go around?

Gazza M

Given the europa league death spiral we're in and how bloated the wage bill is i don't see many other options. The days of signing lacazettes, aubameyangs, ozils, and sanchezes have been pissed away and the best established players we can afford are middling at best. The wishlisting I've seen going on around here features some very optimistic takes on what new players would cost

The self sustining model has proven to be horse shit. It should read self sustaining unless we miss cl for a few seasons in which case the wage bill will collapse on itself

goon

We got very, very close before, certainly closer than we have since.

Turning to youth isn’t just about using academy players, that’s just a small part of it. Signing guys who fit the profile of Douzi and Torreira is key.

And again, what’s the alternative? Spending £50m a year on a couple of average players a season?

Clrnc

Going big on the next big thing is the key now. Be smart with a couple of free transfers or cheap young players, then go big on 2 or 3 positions.

Claudius

Clrnc wrote:
Going big on the next big thing is the key now. Be smart with a couple of free transfers or cheap young players, then go big on 2 or 3 positions.

This. You need anchor quality.

Gazza M

That anchor quality can still be in the form of young players, apart from perhaps the defense

I'm not saying going all youth from the academy. But prioritsing great young players - either via academy or recruitment - must be the cornerstone, as well as a steady manager to grow and guide them. If it works they won't be rushing off to other clubs, and if they do, we hopefully get 9 figure sums to reinvest. There's no other route for us back into the top echelon

Claudius

Okay. So you’re not talking about Nketiah and friends? You’re talking about bringing guys like Konate or Jota in?

Gazza M

or possibly guys even a bit earlier in their development cycle. we have to go backwards to go forwards, because imo the majority current crop we have are sadly going nowhere due to their age, and not really ever gelling together properly

Claudius

Konate is 19 and Jota 22. You want to field a team younger than that?
Or are you sticking with the current team and then going out and buying the world’s best 17 year olds?

Qwiss

goon wrote:
We got very, very close before, certainly closer than we have since.

Turning to youth isn’t just about using academy players, that’s just a small part of it. Signing guys who fit the profile of Douzi and Torreira is key.

And again, what’s the alternative? Spending £50m a year on a couple of average players a season?

This. And then you might even have to do what Liverpool did with Suarez, Sterling and Coutinho and let them go so you can reinvest and start again with more resources.

Anzac

Perhaps this potential youth project should be looking at players mainly aged in the early 20s rather than late teens - start cherry picking the talent such as the likes of those at Ajax, Monaco, Lyon etc, or those that show signs of breaking through like Pepe, Dembele, Martial etc.

IIRC this was the age group AW built his 2nd Double Winning Squad once he replaced The Legendary Back4. We only went to internal youth u20 post 07/08 in the Fabregas Era and then the English Core.

Coombs

Everyone prioritizes great young players, it's not exactly revolutionary thinking. That's not a youth project, just a regular project.

Clrnc

goon wrote:
We got very, very close before, certainly closer than we have since.

My turning point is missing out on Suarez. We would have won the double with him in the team that year hands down.

Bold Tone

Clrnc wrote:
Going big on the next big thing is the key now. Be smart with a couple of free transfers or cheap young players, then go big on 2 or 3 positions.

I'm worried that it's never possible, as a Europa team (see manu recently), to go really "big".
I'd much rather go smart and buy a player like Tielemans than Suarez.
That way we can ease Guendouzi into the team when he is strong enough to stop diving whenever challenged.

Klaus

Qwiss! wrote:
goon wrote:
We got very, very close before, certainly closer than we have since.

Turning to youth isn’t just about using academy players, that’s just a small part of it. Signing guys who fit the profile of Douzi and Torreira is key.

And again, what’s the alternative? Spending £50m a year on a couple of average players a season?

This. And then you might even have to do what Liverpool did with Suarez, Sterling and Coutinho and let them go so you can reinvest and start again with more resources.

Yep. It was the same thing we did with Anelka. There wouldn't have been a Thierry Henry if we hadn't sold him for a world transfer record first.

Coombs

We don't have anyone like that to sell. Instead, we've consistently run down our biggest assets' transfer values over the years, including down to zero. Wenger destroyed the possible long term value of our youth project, purposefully. It'll take another decade to rebuild that way.

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