Rex wrote:

This season he plays much more as a box to box midfielder, and he does it well

That is simply not true. Sorry, but it's stuff like the above that make me think people haven't even watched him play much, and are just being caught by the hype.

If you watch Saints, he's clearly the deepest midfielder for them, while Wanyama is their box to box midfielder. If it's not evident enough when watching him play, then look up their heat maps over the season, where it's quite clear who's the one going up and down the pitch, and who's staying deeper and dictating play.

He has not the skillset to play box to box for a club of our calibre, he's not particularly good at anything going forward, no vison, not comfortable in tight spaces, not the best technique, has no clue how to dribble, can't really pick a pass, he's just super dull.

Now, I'm not saying he's shit, I think he's a good player... for Saints that is.

Chili Palmer wrote:

He has not the skillset to play box to box for a club of our calibre, he's not particularly good at anything going forward, no vison, not comfortable in tight spaces, not the best technique, has no clue how to dribble, can't really pick a pass, he's just super dull.

Now, I'm not saying he's shit, I think he's a good player... for Saints that is.

That is simply not true. Sorry, but it's stuff like the above that make me think people haven't even watched him play much.

Gunner89 wrote:

Irish gunner wrote:

What are you referencing G89? You keep passive aggressively banging on about Real Sociedad season ticket holders and trips to the Basque country.

If you read his posts you would know what I am referencing to.

I follow other leagues too, not just the PL. Maybe you should too, you'd then maybe understand that Schneiderlin isn't the pinnacle of midfielders in Europe that you're potrating him as.

Gunner89 wrote:

Tam wrote:

I take you're point about the worth of Schneiderlin but disagree with your example. We wouldn't have had those two in the starting line up to stop that. There's no way anyone in their right might would be calling for two more defensively minded players in central midfield at home in a game against a team expected to sit deep and counter. One, absolutely, to stem the inevitable counter attacks and provide protection when the fullbacks are caught high up, but two at the expense of a more creative player you'd be looking at to open up their defence is madness. And even if he was a squad option, we all know Wenger isn't choosing that line up in a home game where we're on the front foot. Yes it gives us more solidity and scope for better varying our approach to games, but re-writing history that way to prove the point doesn't help the argument. 

As Claudius said Scheiderlin can do both jobs as he has last season mostly alone and this season with Wanyama.

And if Wenger had both he would choose that line-up in many away games and all home games against United, Chelsea, Liverpool, Everton, Spurs, City. Additionally I also know who I'd have to close a game with a slender lead and the only thing Flamini would bring is fouls and/or yellow cards. Not sure how much football for a top club Arteta can handle. He's a year older and coming back from a major injury. His contract expires in 2 months and hasn't been renewed yet. 

Claudius wrote:

Tam, Schniederlin is a two-way midfielder. He can do both jobs. He's just much better than anyone not named Coquelin on our team at defending.

I'm aware of what type of player he is, it was more a comment on the type of player you'd want facing a deep set team looking to stay compact and hit you on the break. I wouldn't be wanting a player who who can do a job there. He's a well rounded midfielder, but I don't think he's especially brilliant going forward, and I'd be looking for more creativity from a third midfielder in the circumstances Claudius described. In a season where our midfield line ups have recently been Coquelin, Cazorla and Ramsey or Ozil, I don't see what you would gain overall in those types of games by dropping one of Cazorla/Ramsey/Ozil to partner Coquelin and make us more solid in the middle. 

Schniederlin is a good box to box player but I don't think that should be confused with him being particularly good on the ball.

That doesn't mean he can't be useful next to Coq though, would allow us to press high up the pitch, win the ball earlier and generally increase the intensity of our game.

Chili Palmer wrote:

Rex wrote:

This season he plays much more as a box to box midfielder, and he does it well

That is simply not true. Sorry, but it's stuff like the above that make me think people haven't even watched him play much, and are just being caught by the hype.

If you watch Saints, he's clearly the deepest midfielder for them, while Wanyama is their box to box midfielder. If it's not evident enough when watching him play, then look up their heat maps over the season, where it's quite clear who's the one going up and down the pitch, and who's staying deeper and dictating play.

He has not the skillset to play box to box for a club of our calibre, he's not particularly good at anything going forward, no vison, not comfortable in tight spaces, not the best technique, has no clue how to dribble, can't really pick a pass, he's just super dull.

Now, I'm not saying he's shit, I think he's a good player... for Saints that is.

Yeah, I don't agree with any of that.

Rex wrote:

Chili Palmer wrote:

That is simply not true. Sorry, but it's stuff like the above that make me think people haven't even watched him play much, and are just being caught by the hype.

If you watch Saints, he's clearly the deepest midfielder for them, while Wanyama is their box to box midfielder. If it's not evident enough when watching him play, then look up their heat maps over the season, where it's quite clear who's the one going up and down the pitch, and who's staying deeper and dictating play.

He has not the skillset to play box to box for a club of our calibre, he's not particularly good at anything going forward, no vison, not comfortable in tight spaces, not the best technique, has no clue how to dribble, can't really pick a pass, he's just super dull.

Now, I'm not saying he's shit, I think he's a good player... for Saints that is.

Yeah, I don't agree with any of that.

I understand. It's hard to argue against the truth. :hat:

No, seriously, look up Squawka, and look at his and his midfield partners heat maps, where you clearly can see that he's the one sitting the most in probably 80% of the games.

Which qualities do you think he has to play the B2B role for us? As I really don't see them aside from his physical ones.

Its "The Michu Effect". People just see a player stand out in a mid table team and start thinking he is exactly what we need to do for us. But they never do.

marv3llous wrote:

But they never do.

Or many players Fergie bought that won him trophies year after year. There's no general rule here - some players are good enough to make the step up. All Schneiderlin would have to do is replicate his Southampton performances. Certainly do-able. 

Well, ideally we wouldnt want to buy players of his level nowdays.

His level is really, really good though, and that is what we need.

It was really good for the squad back when we bought him. We have now gone up a level and we should only be looking to spend big money on big players who either come straight into starting XI or on players who are able backups. Schneiderlin has been hyped up to be a £25m+ player, but he does not have the quality of a starter and its definitely too much for a backup/rotation player of this type.

That's the kind of quality you need to compete for the top prizes. Chelsea spent big on Cuadrado to strengthen their squad, well knowing he wasn't going to be an automatic starter. In midfield they have class players like Ramires and Mikel as back up. Ramires hasn't been a starter all season, But he still has 20 appearances in the PL.

Arteta was amazing at Everton, and he cost us only 10M.

Schneiderlin doesn't come close to the performances Arteta was putting for Everton, especially not as B2B, where Teta was scoring long shots and freekicks of highest quality that Schneiderlin could only dream of. He was especially awesome before injury his in 2009.

Schneiderlin is the Lovren of this summer. I'd wish Wenger sacked right away if he was to give 30M(we got Alexis for that) for this extremly dull footballer.

I agree and i guarantee you, our scouting team has another "Gabriel" or "Koscielny" or "Giroud" or "Monreal" ready for this CM spot as well for _£10m, if we're looking for a player to compete/rotate with Coq. In case we are looking to upgrade on Coq, then we'll use £30m+ to bring in another "Özil" or "Alexis". There is no way we will pay anywhere near £25m for Schneiderlin and its clear there are teams who would. Watch him end up at "Spurs" and us calling him average after 6 months there and laughing at the fact we even wanted him. "The Michu Effect".

Not sure about that, our scouting team hasn't been able to identify a decent ready made player in that position for over a decade, since we signed Gilberto.

Rex wrote:

That's the kind of quality you need to compete for the top prizes. Chelsea spent big on Cuadrado to strengthen their squad, well knowing he wasn't going to be an automatic starter. In midfield they have class players like Ramires and Mikel as back up. Ramires hasn't been a starter all season, But he still has 20 appearances in the PL.

I can just about let Ramires slide without feeling the need to pull you up on it, but in no universe can Mikel ever be considered 'class'. Not even for a backup. 

Cuardrado didn't strengthen their squad either, he was a replacement for Schurrle. Salah went the other way too.