qs! wrote:

Suarez is a complete cunt and I don't think I'd be happy if we signed him but he's undoubtedly a world class player. He's serious trouble though. Imagine having to put up with that whole racism row. Things like that would completely derail your season.

Exactly. Would never want a player like him here (nor would I want Ballotelly, Tevez, or even milder mental cases).

asajoseph wrote:

Only if you base your assessment on the last 10 games and ignore absolutely everything else about last season.

Does anybody remember we get dominated by fucking QPR and 10man Fulham?

Clrnc wrote:

Anyway, all these flexing of muscles wouldn't matter if we start the season with Sanogo and Giroud as our only striking options. We need to seal some deals, instead of testing water for every player and then pull out when they ask for abit more.

Well a lot of the rumours so far are making it look like we want Higuain and another star forward.

Now that would be flexing our muscles.

Though I have little doubt all this is not happening, Pepe's idea about
us doing it for the Higgy situation is interesting (if that was really his idea): If you know for a fact that Madrid wants him, and we want what they have but they put pressure on us, then there's no real risk in bidding for him. Like this you can make a 3 party situation a one on one deal, in which you have the most valuable asset. If we bid 35 mil and pool accept, we're basically facing Madrid, offering them Suarez for Higgs + 13 mil.

Now - they may or may not accept, but that would depend solely on their valuation. They don't have the extortion position anymore. If they were initially ready to pay 35 for him (likely? probably), and consider 22 for Higgs proper, yet were holding us for ransom just cos they could (likely? I think that's reasonable), in the imagined scenario they'd be forced to sell Higgs to us, which is all we wanted in the first place.

Wenger not likely to operate like this? sure. But it's an interesting exercise (which maybe the egg man can think of?).

One thing though I could never ever imagine: Wenger buying a player like him. Can't see it in a million years.

Clrnc wrote:

asajoseph wrote:

Only if you base your assessment on the last 10 games and ignore absolutely everything else about last season.

Does anybody remember we get dominated by fucking QPR and 10man Fulham?

It wasn't exactly a smooth ride - we hardly dominated every game, even if we got the results we needed.

Results are all that matters in the end. When I look at our fixture list for August, including whoever we may get in the CL qualifier, then I see our current team as favorites in every fixture. There is enough strength in depth as well IMO.

To actually compete for silverware come the business end, we need to strenghten the squad though. A top class striker and a starting CM at least. Have no problems with late signings this summer - if we end up getting two top class players worth the wait.

Results only matter for last season. When judging how we'll perform next season, a lot more is needed than just drawing an arbitrary line through last season's fixtures & ignoring all performance.

Experience tells us that with a shit striker & a defence prone to ricks against just about anyone, this team will drop points.

The defense was, statistically, the 2nd best in the PL last season. In the last 10 games or so they even looked the part. We also scored about the same as the season prior to last.

Why is it so difficult to think that it actually took the manager and the players two thirds of a season to find a formula that worked? I think you get a much more realistic assessment of the current team's capabilities when looking at the last part of the season for that very reason. The fixtures at the start of next season also has a lot of similarities compared to the end of last season IMO.

I prefer to depend more on quality than luck. Alot of our wins towards the end of the season were lucky single goal victories where we weren't the better team clearly.

I don't think there's any real way to predict the way the start of the season will go before the pre-season has happened, but it's certainly not only down to the players, good or bad.

Anyone who would unthinkingly back Giroud, Podolski, Walcott and Cazorla to start turning on the goals from the first second of the season seems misguided.

Timothy wrote:

Personally I think we've bid for Suarez cos we want Suarez. No other reason.

A drawing hand is worth a bluff. If we enquire at there or thereabouts for Suarez, he turns out to be available, and Wenger thinks he'd be a good player for us, he could always enter negotiations in earnest.

But let's say the followup story is true and there's been no formal enquiry from us for Suarez. No one doubts Wenger's willingness to play a long game with low margin for error in the transfer market. To do that from a strong position he needs everyone to know he has multiple options. Who knows what other factors may be involved?

Without getting too grassy knoll about it, this rumour seems like a plant and it'd only really make sense for us, Liverpool or a player agent to do that …

Rex wrote:

The defense was, statistically, the 2nd best in the PL last season. In the last 10 games or so they even looked the part. .

Also made the most individual errors in the league, by an absolute mile.

Over the whole season, we conceded the second fewest, but again, when talking about a 10 game run, there's far too many flaws in the team & squad to just pencil us in for 26 points, just because we did the same last season.

Why is it so difficult to think that it actually took the manager and the players two thirds of a season to find a formula that worked? I think you get a much more realistic assessment of the current team's capabilities when looking at the last part of the season for that very reason. The fixtures at the start of next season also has a lot of similarities compared to the end of last season IMO.

Our form at the end of the season would not net us 98 points. We didn't play that well.

I saw some stat suggesting that the bulk of those individual errors occured in the first 28 games? Supports my theory, because I want it to, that it took that long for the team to gel...

That's true. But of course we started last season with good defending and few goals scored before the "Bould revolution" met its quick demise.

All I know is, after looking at our fixture list, that the team we have now will go into every game in August and September as favorites. There is plenty of scope to bed in a player or two in September. In theory at least...

In this discussion, the key issue is obviously injuries. We have enough on paper to do very well in the first 10 games. In the last 10 games of last season, we didn't really have any injuries (apart from Wilshere) that we needed to be concerned about and we managed to do well. There's every reason to believe we would start very well if we have the same key players out there having had a full pre-season. Take a Koscielny, Cazorla, Arteta, Walcott out and immediately our chances of stealing a lead in the first 10 games drop a fair bit.

I'd take Suarez, regardless of his antics.

Don't believe for a second that we have made a bid, or are even remotely interested though.

Rex wrote:

I don't believe for a second that Arsenal Football Club has any interest in Suarez whatsoever. I am well happy with that as well.

For once we agree Rex, Rooney? Suarez? someone in having a great laugh or else there is a seditious campaign going one by someone to generate rumours.
Having to put up with stupid rumours about who will will buy is almost as bad as our usual speculation of who we will lose.

yuv wrote:

Though I have little doubt all this is not happening, Pepe's idea about
us doing it for the Higgy situation is interesting (if that was really his idea): If you know for a fact that Madrid wants him, and we want what they have but they put pressure on us, then there's no real risk in bidding for him. Like this you can make a 3 party situation a one on one deal, in which you have the most valuable asset. If we bid 35 mil and pool accept, we're basically facing Madrid, offering them Suarez for Higgs + 13 mil.

Now - they may or may not accept, but that would depend solely on their valuation. They don't have the extortion position anymore. If they were initially ready to pay 35 for him (likely? probably), and consider 22 for Higgs proper, yet were holding us for ransom just cos they could (likely? I think that's reasonable), in the imagined scenario they'd be forced to sell Higgs to us, which is all we wanted in the first place.

Wenger not likely to operate like this? sure. But it's an interesting exercise (which maybe the egg man can think of?).

One thing though I could never ever imagine: Wenger buying a player like him. Can't see it in a million years.

I don't see how it works that way. If we had an offer of 35 accepted, Madrid could have the same sized offer accepted, Suarez chooses them and Madrid can still try holding us to ransom just as if we hadn't bid for Suarez.

Macca wrote:

yuv wrote:

Though I have little doubt all this is not happening, Pepe's idea about
us doing it for the Higgy situation is interesting (if that was really his idea): If you know for a fact that Madrid wants him, and we want what they have but they put pressure on us, then there's no real risk in bidding for him. Like this you can make a 3 party situation a one on one deal, in which you have the most valuable asset. If we bid 35 mil and pool accept, we're basically facing Madrid, offering them Suarez for Higgs + 13 mil.

Now - they may or may not accept, but that would depend solely on their valuation. They don't have the extortion position anymore. If they were initially ready to pay 35 for him (likely? probably), and consider 22 for Higgs proper, yet were holding us for ransom just cos they could (likely? I think that's reasonable), in the imagined scenario they'd be forced to sell Higgs to us, which is all we wanted in the first place.

Wenger not likely to operate like this? sure. But it's an interesting exercise (which maybe the egg man can think of?).

One thing though I could never ever imagine: Wenger buying a player like him. Can't see it in a million years.

I don't see how it works that way. If we had an offer of 35 accepted, Madrid could have the same sized offer accepted, Suarez chooses them and Madrid can still try holding us to ransom just as if we hadn't bid for Suarez.

In that situation we move onto another target and Madrid are left paying the wages or 3 strikers when they only have game time for 2.