We're not getting Goetze, we all know that. Too much money, not enough pulling power.

I think it's a measure of how far our stock has fallen that we have serious interest in two of Ligue 1's best players, in M'Vila and Hazard, with no other clubs seemingly moving on them, and we were never getting them from the get go. Sad. They were this year's Fabregas and Nasri, super young talents replacing outgoing stars, now it looks like we're going to have to settle for mediocre players who nobody else wants. If we get stuck in that cycle it's going to be very, very hard to move up to the next tier again.

We could get Hazard and M'Vila today if we paid the asking price.

I don't think so. I just don't think they particularly want to come

Pretty sure we could get M'Vila.

We can't pay Hazard's asking price though.

Ricky1985 wrote:

We're not getting Goetze, we all know that. Too much money, not enough pulling power.

I think it's a measure of how far our stock has fallen that we have serious interest in two of Ligue 1's best players, in M'Vila and Hazard, with no other clubs seemingly moving on them, and we were never getting them from the get go. Sad. They were this year's Fabregas and Nasri, super young talents replacing outgoing stars, now it looks like we're going to have to settle for mediocre players who nobody else wants. If we get stuck in that cycle it's going to be very, very hard to move up to the next tier again.

To be fair, we are always on course to be stucked in the cycle till we win something. Said it before things will never be the same again unless we start winning things. Wenger don't realise how much it hurts us to be an average european team rather than a top one

How do you start winning things if your so called rivals are the ones signing the Hazards, Goetzes, M'Vilas of this world, whilst we are forced to bring in the likes of Mertesacker and Elia etc? It's a vicious cycle.

You have to do what Liverpool and ManCity have done; overpay and add quality where you can. Basically, you need to spend some fucking money.

Either way, we have enough pulling power to sign all three of those players in my opinion.

Liverpool haven't though. They've signed players from the tier below that of their rivals, hence they won't be getting near them this season. Although I agree with the point you're making, City don't count as any kind of comparison.

This could very well be the last summer where we have even a slight of chance of being in the position to overpay for top talent, next summer even that option could be out of reach.

We should have gone all out for Cahill, M'Vila, Hazard and Benzema in May. We could have recouped the money from sales throughout the summer. I actually believe Wenger wanted to do something along those lines, perhaps not that extravagant, but something similar, and is livid with how the club's buying team/Gazidis/the board have handled the summer.

Liverpool have several players of very good quality, chief amongst them Suarez.

Suarez is a good player, but he's the exception. Your point was you can get those top players by overpaying for them ~ Henderson, Adam, Downing and Carroll are not top players. Will those players get them back to the very top and challenging? Would they have spent that £100M on better players if they hadn't have been so thoroughly shit in the last few years?

Ricky1985 wrote:

Suarez is a good player, but he's the exception. Your point was you can get those top players by overpaying for them ~ Henderson, Adam, Downing and Carroll are not top players. Will those players get them back to the very top and challenging? Would they have spent that £100M on better players if they hadn't have been so thoroughly shit in the last few years?

They very realistically could them back into the champions league and a domestic trophy and then you kick on from there. It's not a magic wand, it's building and developing; surely as someone who champions all sorts of youth players, you should understand that.

Signing those players they shouldn't have had a hope in hell of making the top 4, it's only because we're a disgrace that they haven't spent that 100M to play Europa League football.

Anyway, I know what you're saying and you're right, all i'm saying is once you drop out of that top tier and are no longer able to compete for players that would get into your rivals' team, it's a long, hard road back.

They have had championship form for months now mate. It's delusional to ignore what is happening there; they are building a good side.

You wouldn't put any money on them finish any higher than 4th would you?

My suspicion is that they will fall away when the squad gets stretched a bit more but if we could go how many months without a win and still get fourth by only a three point difference, then yes, it is possible. 3rd and 4th are invariably interchangeable if you get a decent rub of the green.

Liverpool went for a strategy of buying english. From your list above Rick they could definitely have got hazard and cahill if they'd targeted those players. Arsenal and liverpool are still massive draws for players if the money is acceptable.

Cahill maybe, Hazard no chance in my opinion.

I don't think they did go for a particular strategy of buying English, they just know that with no Champions League football that there pull was still greater with home players. They lost out on quite a few foreign transfer targets this summer.

I think Daglish definitely has a preference for British players. If you took the money they spent on Carroll, Henderson and Downing and looked abroad you'd get much better players. Its not only his signings either its that he dropped alot of Liverpools better players for English lads then. Merieles on the bench and Henderson on the pitch makes no sense. Kuyt had to basically win his spot back. Suarez had to prove he was better at CF than Carroll.