Caligula wrote:
Tim wrote:

Do you or do you not agree that Cesc's refusal to go anywhere but Barcelona is depressing the price we're getting from the Catalan Cunts?

I already mentioned in my four reasons why the price is depressed that Fabregas' desire to go back to Barca is partially responsible. But what do you want? You want him to declare that he is willing to go anywhere in Europe, then when Inter bids for him he says "No, I'm not interested". Everyone and his dog knows Fabregas is interested only in Barca. I am not sure wha tyour point is. You want to villify him because he is not open to moving to Milan or PSG?

Eh? Have you and Tony got some sort of pact to annoy the fuck out of me tonight?

To paraphrase:

Tony: "whatever we get for Cesc represents a fair price on the open market"
Tim: "No, not really, cos Cesc isn't on the open market. He'll only go to Barcelona. His refusal to go anywhere but Barcelona depresses the price."

That was the conversation. Now what's your point?

You asked me a question on a point that I had made very clear. A point in fact that was the thesis for for the reason Fabregas is not going to go for 40 or 50m. You need to calm down, mate 🙂

Ok, at the risk of driving myself completely insane.

What was this post in response to, or directed towards:

Caligula wrote:

What is so hard to understand that a player has no fixed value like a commodity. He goes for the price the two teams decide works for them, whether it's 12million for Oezil or 35m for Carroll. Who from you can tell me which of those two players went for his 'real price'?

And why, when you clearly understand that Cesc's price is being depressed and we aren't getting full market value, did you tell Tony his point was valid? I can only assume you didn't read the first couple of posts properly.

Tony has been trying to argue that we cannot expect a big fee for Fabregas for the exact same reasons that I have given. I think we should complete the Cesc transfer tonight and start spending that cash. And not on more adolescents. On men who are ready to contribute.

on Nasri, Fabregas’ situations…
We are, on both fronts, in no mans land. At the moment, they are players of Arsenal Football Club.

Is Wenger taking the piss or have Barca and the media jumped the gun?

He's probably waiting for it to be announced on Arsenal.com before further discussing the matter.

Jokes aside, there's no way we have enough time to adequately replace both Nasri and Cesc now. Another monumentally fucked up transfer window by Arsenal.

Caligula wrote:

Tony has been trying to argue that we cannot expect a big fee for Fabregas for the exact same reasons that I have given. I think we should complete the Cesc transfer tonight and start spending that cash. And not on more adolescents. On men who are ready to contribute.

Well then I think you've misunderstood. Tony was making a point about economics. i.e, that Arsenal fans cant say Cesc's open market price is £45 million, for example, when the only club bidding is offering just £30 million.

YounGunner wrote:

The whole system was built around Fabregas and it will collapse without him.

That is the only thing that is giving me reason for hope at the moment.
That we'll give up naive foolish thoughts of playing like them in the premiership.

I was going to start an "After Fabregas" thread but then I thought that the greasy little rat doesn't deserve one so I may as well kick off here.

First thing we need to do (with or without Wenger) is get back to basics.
Defensive organisation: And that means everyone, no more prima donnas everyones first duty is to work hard and win the ball.
Be pragmatic: No more trying to win games in the first 20 minutes or cavalier naive suicide attacking, wait watch and then pounce.

Only by making ourselves difficult to break down and defeat will the confidence and self belief grow.
Then gradually after a couple of years should we think of adding style to graft and play with swagger.
In order for us to be in the running we have to learn how to walk again.

Apologies if I'm getting 'ahead of the curve' but we have to move on forget the slimy little fucker and plan for the future.

Biggus is Mourinho in disguise?

You are overcomplicating things Gus. We really only need a manager who can
a) instill some work ethic in the squad
b) put emphasis on defending as a team as opposed to 11 individuals
c) finds a reasonable balance between attacking and defending
d) bring in a few quality players that are something other than forwards or attacking mids

No need for the "in a few years" thing.

@ Flobs, I've never tried to disguise my admiration for his methods.
Crisis is another word for opportunity. 😉

@ Rex, we need to make an advantage out of having no prima donna at the center of the team so yes I definitely like your a) & b).
Points c) & d), we're not Stoke and so there is more expectation for us to create and entertain, but more than anything we need a period of stability where we can batten down the hatches and stop losing.

It's really unfortunate that we have the CL qualifier and the Liverpool and Utd games so soon as we're on a hiding to nothing.
If we do badly in those games we'll be crushed- season over.
But if we do very well all the unrealistic expectations will follow- Arsenal back on course! Crisis over! etc......
We really needed a few average teams and games just to quietly get on our feet and hum along without anyone really noticing.........

You are still over complicating things Gus.

Statistically most goals in football today come from set pieces and when you quickly switch play. Get the ball off the opponent and, as fast as possible, try to get to the other end of the pitch and score. The way we go about things now demands extremely much from the players. You need top, top players all around pretty much. Look at Barcelona. For all their good players - in 80% of their attacks nothing happens until Messi does something spectacular.

A lot of people say Chelsea and Man U play boring football. I disagree. It makes fans happy when their team scores, and both of those clubs consistently score more than we do. They both create and entertain by having a solid defence and play quick counterattacking football with pace and power. Why don´t we try that!

In Walcott, Arshavin, Gervinho, Wilshere and RVP we have players that would excel playing that game. Let them the fuck lose! Behind them AOC, Ramsey and RYO offer more of the same.

What we don´t have these days are players that are good enough defensively to comfortably let the opposition attack us. Lure them out of the trenches, soak up a bit of pressure, and hit them on the counter. We don´t have enough ball winners for that, we are not good enough in the air for that, and we are not good enough defending as a unit for that.

A great CB, a defensively good LB, a CM that excels at the defensive aspects of the game but can still pick a pass and is mobile, and another player to complement Wilshere as the main creative hub. That´s it. Done. We are contenders again. Oh, we need another manager of course.

Humble Rex wrote:

You are still over complicating things Gus.

😆 I'm usually accused of over simplifying.
I don't disagree with anything you said.

Goodbye Cesc. Thanks for the brilliance, thanks for the hard work, and thanks for the occasional ray of light. There have been plenty of bad days but it was only the season before last your performances, alone, kept us afloat.

I hope you realise that you're about to go to a club which, for all its eyelash-batting Catalonian flirtation, will never love you the way we would have. Trophies or no trophies, you could have been an Arsenal legend.

There, you could end up a third or fourth rate story. They're not going to build their team around you and you won't be getting any more traction with the manipulative nonsense to which your deficient character lends itself.

May the ex-Arsenal curse dog your steps from now on.

I'll be interested to see what you say about us in your forthcoming ghostwritten autobiographies.

10akhil Akhil Vyas
Cesc fabregas IS on his way to barcelona. My mate works at the airport and just saw him. Even told me his flight number!

This guy is a proper Gooner, rings up the Arsenal Fans Forum every week, he's not making that up.

So that's another chapter of Arsenal's history closed. Not a one to remember.

Tim wrote:
Caligula wrote:

Tony has been trying to argue that we cannot expect a big fee for Fabregas for the exact same reasons that I have given. I think we should complete the Cesc transfer tonight and start spending that cash. And not on more adolescents. On men who are ready to contribute.

Well then I think you've misunderstood. Tony was making a point about economics. i.e, that Arsenal fans cant say Cesc's open market price is £45 million, for example, when the only club bidding is offering just £30 million.

It is an open market.

Just because there's only one club bidding doesn't mean it's not open.

The fact is Arsenal are only willing to sell to Barcelona because only Fabregas wants Barca or only Barca want to buy him.

But the fact that he will only go there is not our problem is it?

What? 😃

How is Cesc only wanting to go to Barca not our problem? We can't force him to sign for another club.