Jack, would Gotze be available?

I'd guess he'd be a hard one to prize away but he's gettable. It wouldn't be like trying to sign ozil, more like trying to sign hazard from lille. Maybe slightly tougher

Tim wrote:

I've gradually come to terms with the idea of Cesc leaving, and i think he's behaved really badly this summer, but in the cold light of day I'm pretty gutted about it all. We might watch Arsenal for another 40 years and not see a player as good as Cesc in our shirt. He's been brilliant for us and carried the team on his shoulders for large parts of the last 5-6 years.

I'm sure people thought the same after the likes of Wright, Bergkamp, Henry, Vieiera etc. We have Wilshere now who has the potential to be exceptional.

Dont be too down, onwards and upwards once Wenger goes, he cant manage us forever

gotze would be very hard to pry from dortmund. i imagine they wouldnt even consider an offer < 30m. but he'd be the type of signing we need - top, top class.

Good fucking riddance. Hope you achieve as much for Barcelona as you achieved for us. Looking forward to the post Cesc and hopefully soon post Wenger era.

People here can be so whiny and ungrateful sometimes.

If you put yourselves in Cesc's shoes you would have done exactly as he did.

In all the interviews he gave the Spanish press he insisted he was planning to stay at Arsenal. He made it as easy as he could for us to get a large sum of money while securing a move to the club he's always been a fan of, and which is currently managed by his favourite player ever and who he chose his number 4 for - not to mention the best team in the world in his home town.

If we'd been winning trebles no doubt we wouldn't have lost him when we did, but it's nothing short of a mad fantasy considering how much money we actually have compared to the giants we are competing with.

Thanks for the good memories, Cesc, but make no mistake, you never 'paid us back'.

P.S. looking at the picture of flamini above I can't help but think of how 90% of Arsenal-Mania cited Flamini (and later Song and Adebayor) as nothing players that'd never do anything and proved Wenger was mad. Strangely enough I feel more confident about our season now that Cesc is gone. His style was after far from suited to the premiership.

Grateful? for what?

RC8 wrote:

His style was after far from suited to the premiership.

Totally agree RC, and I'd be optimistic too- If I had the slightest hope that Wenger would bring in players that are suited- But I don't.

I'm incline to agree, I don't see why we should wish Cesc an injury or hope he fails. As far as I'm concerned he was a talented footballer who did a good job while playing for Arsenal. Maybe he could have handled the transfer better but he sure as hell could have done a lot worse.

I don't have any affection for him now that he's left and I cannot wish him well while he plays for Barcelona, but I hope he's happy living in Spain. To me he's just another footballer now.

Word to the wise Cesc, you need better mates.

I'm optimistic even if he doesn't. With Fabregas the team hasn't been built to play like a team, it hasn't been built to its strengths, but rather to the strengths of this one (admittedly great) player instead.

Even with Cesc at his best we never really played what was once known as 'wengerball' whenever teams closed down at the back. The current teams needs too many touches to get things done.

Word to Cesc.
Prepare to go on strike.

200 liga players will be owed a total of $71 million by the start of the season.
All players say they will go on strike if a new collective bargaining agreement is not signed.
http://www.mail.com/int/sports/soccer/618842-spanish-players-threaten-strike-season.html

Strange looking back now on the seasons when Cesc was at his best.
Maybe I'm not alone in remembering the feeling that we were on the cusp of something great with him at the hub of the team of 2007/08.
All we needed was to keep the team together and reinforce.
Naturally Arsene didn't see it this way.

I do feel sad, I remember Cesc greeting us supporters in the North Bank in 2006 as he was about to come on against Portsmouth. He was a bright kid back then, a talent in whom only those of us at Arsenal believed in. There was no trophy-less drought back in that winter night, and if him, Reyes, Flamini, etc. blossomed under the leadership of Cole, Henry, Pires, and Freddie, we would continue our dynasty and keep the chants of 'one team in London' ringing through the terrace for a while.

The aura around that team was special. Arsenal didn't feel hopelessly corporate then, it also didn't feel like we needed to be.

Remember when Chelsea ruining football was an anomaly and not a fact of life that all clubs do when they have the means (sugardaddy) to? When the vast majority of Arsenal fans wanted Barca to beat R. Madrid to punish them for how they'd behaved towards us during the Vieira saga? Those were the days when a young Cesc Fabregas promised to continue bringing glory to Highbury.

RC8 wrote:

I do feel sad, I remember Cesc greeting us supporters in the North Bank in 2006 as he was about to come on against Portsmouth. He was a bright kid back then, a talent in whom only those of us at Arsenal believed in. There was no trophy-less drought back in that winter night, and if him, Reyes, Flamini, etc. blossomed under the leadership of Cole, Henry, Pires, and Freddie, we would continue our dynasty and keep the chants of 'one team in London' ringing through the terrace for a while.

The aura around that team was special. Arsenal didn't feel hopelessly corporate then, it also didn't feel like we needed to be.

Remember when Chelsea ruining football was an anomaly and not a fact of life that all clubs do when they have the means (sugardaddy) to? When the vast majority of Arsenal fans wanted Barca to beat R. Madrid to punish them for how they'd behaved towards us during the Vieira saga? Those were the days when a young Cesc Fabregas promised to continue bringing glory to Highbury.

Jeez RC8 now you're making me sad.
It wasn't even that long ago.

What the hell happened?
Every season that followed 2007/08 saw us standstill or regress.

yea you really summed up how football doesnt feel the same anymore. not sure that its just the lack of trophies, either.

anyway, i dont blame fabregas for anything - he created more chances for us than anyone in europe. i blame wenger for his failure to surround him with a team that was capable of winning, for his failure to adopt tactics and a footballing philosophy that could be successful. i can't say i wish fabregas well at THAT CLUB, but that's more to do with them than him.

looking back at fabregas' arsenal career, it's just a shame that all that talent was wasted by wenger.

Kami. You have beautifully captured my feelings on the whole Fabregas affair. in the end, it feels a big waste

it's a shame. i feel like wenger is running this club down the same dead end over and over, and there's nothing we can do about it. it's a mix of anger, irritation, frustration.

i feel like if i saw wenger in the street, i'd run up to him the way terry or rooney run up to a ref, and just scream "what the f*** are you doing??? snap out of it!!!" to his face.

RC8 wrote:

P.S. looking at the picture of flamini above I can't help but think of how 90% of Arsenal-Mania cited Flamini (and later Song and Adebayor) as nothing players that'd never do anything and proved Wenger was mad. Strangely enough I feel more confident about our season now that Cesc is gone. His style was after far from suited to the premiership.

That's a good point, and I think it's something all the pundits are ignoring. The Henry departure spurred us on, and you'd have to think that the players might actually feed off all the bullshit. We always seem to do well when the pressure's off, and in a lot of respects that's what is happening right now.

Say, if Cesc goes that makes Almunia the longest serving Arsenal player. With RvP.

Hmm those 3 players define Wengers last 6 years perfectly.
The brilliant player whose career was hamstrung by injuries.
The worthless clod who only Wenger sees worth in and persisted with to the point of lunacy.
The genius who he nurtured and betrayed and was betrayed by him.

I've always believed that Wenger's biggest mistake was replacing Vieira with Cesc and building the team around him. Glad that that's over at least.