Other Sports: Page 202 - The Arsenal discussion forum and community: One more in the Tolly

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Gazza M

it's all about opinions. the warriors have an all-time great roster and skill, but really i doubt this will be a widely respected title win. sweeping every series after the best player on one of your rivals joins you after a 73 win season - how is that worthy of huge admiration?

now KD is being pumped up as the new best player in the world - really? he's just doing what he normally does, but with a hyper-stacked roster to support him and allow him to take breathers when necessary. the comparisons to lebron imo are insulting and nonsensical

mdgoonah41

who is saying hes the best player in the world? all ive read these playoffs is that lebron is the best player on the planet, which seems indisputable.

do the 90s bulls teams get a whopper of an asterisk too? they had the best player of all time and 2 of the 50 best players ever on those teams and faced little resistance.

Gazza M

mdgoonah41 wrote:
who is saying hes the best player in the world? all ive read these playoffs is that lebron is the best player on the planet, which seems indisputable.

do the 90s bulls teams get a whopper of an asterisk too? they had the best player of all time and 2 of the 50 best players ever on those teams and faced little resistance.

that team was built organically through the draft. and they had to earn their place after being beaten multiple times by the pistons. jordan didn't go joijn isaiah and demolish the entire league. no asterisk for me

yes there have been other superteams, before you bring up 08 celtics or 12 heat. the warriors imo are the most egregious example

i'm not saying you have to agree. i'm just saying i can't respect it personally

mdgoonah41

they didnt draft rodman, they traded for him when he was the best rebounder/post defender in the league. jordan is the GOAT and was in his prime, better than anyone currently on the warriors.

this warriors team was built through the draft, except for durant. curry, klay, and dray are all warriors picks, all outside the top 5. their role players were shrewd FA signings, some off the scrap heap.

its all opinion, but i think you are re-writing history with your comments

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My problem with this super team era is that it will most likely turn the NBA into a 2 team league like la liga.

Gazza M

mdgoonah41 wrote:
they didnt draft rodman, they traded for him when he was the best rebounder/post defender in the league. jordan is the GOAT and was in his prime, better than anyone currently on the warriors.

this warriors team was built through the draft, except for durant. curry, klay, and dray are all warriors picks, all outside the top 5. their role players were shrewd FA signings, some off the scrap heap.

its all opinion, but i think you are re-writing history with your comments

that was their 2nd run. you just said "90s bulls". their first run was all drafted talent. and comparing signing rodman to signing KD isn't really isn't really worthwhile is it? it would be more like if they drafted hakeem or shaq in 95

i would have a lot more respect if the warriors relied on their drafted talent again, bounced back this season without signing KD, and beat his OKC team to get to the finals. that's the point. battering every team after drafting the 2nd best player when you've won 73 games the previous season just feels off to me

My problem with this super team era is that it will most likely turn the NBA into a 2 team league like la liga.

i hear you, but tbh it's usually only 2-3 teams that are a legit title threat when you look back at history, and then another 2-3 'nearly men' teams that are missing a critical piece or two

Bryant

flobaba wrote:
My problem with this super team era is that it will most likely turn the NBA into a 2 team league like la liga.

I think it's already a 2 team league. I don't see any team competing with the Warriors or Cavs for the next few years unless if we see another super team formed.

CP3 to the spurs?

arsedocmd

mdgoonah41 wrote:
it defies logic/gravity.

maybe the earth really is flat.

Rex

Durant to Warriors isn't really different from what we see in football all the time. Just goes to show that talented players want to play with other talented players, and they want a real opportunity to win.
Was another great game! Kyrie is amazing, and it was about time he got to show it in this series. Must be utterly demoralizing for the Cavs though to see their two superstars have otherworldly games and it STILL isn't enough. Both Steph and Durant have been amazing throughout, but neither of them have to carry their team the way LeBron has to. Warriors is the only super team here; it is just that the Cavs happen to have the second best player of all time playing for them, but they have been pretty crap last couple of years when James has missed a game. Their record is mediocre at best without him. The contrast with that to Warriors missing Durant for 19 games is monumental.

arsedocmd

Another wawrinka Nadal final brewing at the French open

mdgoonah41

regarding the NBA and super teams, a few thoughts:

the idea of super teams isnt new. the 90s bulls were a super team. the 2008 celtics were a super team. the heat with lebron were a super team.
the NBA incentivizes this type of behavior. they've shown that, with the cap, the best way to win is to acquire multiple stars, then fill out your roster with guys who will take less money to ride the coattails of the stars to a ring.
the NBA, when negotiating the last CBA, could have opted for a smoothing of the salary cap and allowed for a gradual increase. instead, they allowed a drastic spike. that drastic spike coincided with durant's impending free agency. it allowed the warriors to sign one of the best players in the world without dismantling their team. but to fill out their team, they still had to make sacrifices, and they still needed role players to make sacrificies (see point #2)
even if you have super teams, the eventual winner isn't a foregone conclusion. last year, everyone assumed the warriors would roll over the cavs. it looked like that until draymond got suspended, and the result was one of the biggest sports stories in recent memory. the script changed with one swipe to the balls. rewind a few weeks, curry had sprained his ankle because he slipped a sweaty spot on the floor. what would have happened if lebron had sprained his ankle against the celtics? that might have been a completely different series. same in the west. the warriors built in more security by having 4 superstars instead of 3.
even with the way the NBA fucked up the salary cap, the warriors are going to have cap trouble in the next few seasons. durant can mitigate some of that this summer by taking less than the max, which he said he would, but hes running a risk taking a 1+1 deal instead of a 4 year deal, especially given the serious foot injuries he had in the past. guys who want to win a ring will have to take less money to be part of the big teams, if they want to sacrifice that, im not going to tell them they are wrong or its unfair. once the warriors have steph, klay, dray and durant on max or near max contracts, the rest of their roster will pay the price, and then you can question how important balance and depth is.
the NBA's biggest problem is that the regular season doesn't mean shit. teams treat the 82 game schedule as a nuisance, resting their players until the playoffs when games matter. the reason they can do this is that in a given season, at least 6-8 teams are going to prioritize losing games to improve their draft odds over trying to win every single game. the reason? so they can try to draft superstars and build a team that can compete. even with lopsided playoff games, ive found the playoffs compelling this year. but it also showed you that the regular season and the playoffs are completely and totally different games of basketball. the rockets just played a run and gun system all year. they made nearly unthinkable amounts of threes. it worked in the regular season, when they weren't playing the same team 7 games in a row. when they ran into a good defensive team with a brilliant head coach in the playoffs, the formula didn't work quite as easily.

also, unrelated, has anyone even mentioned harden or westbrook's name in the last month and thought "yeah, one of those guys is definitely the best player in the league and warrants the MVP trophy"...? nope.

mdgoonah41

nba made it clear to the refs that there needs to be a game 5, and the warriors are obliging. thats an embarrassing quarter of basketball there.

Bryant

😆 what the hell was that, call a undeserved second technical on draymond then magically change his first technical to steve kerr!!!

edit: one of the worst officiated games I've seen.

mdgoonah41

yeah this whole game has been a fiasco. which might overshadow that cleveland has shot the lights out like ive never seen

mdgoonah41

draymond green is a fucking moron.

y va marquer

Ostapenko, wow, winning cool as a breeze.
Feel sorry for Halep but she didn't have the weapons to counter that agression and power

Rex

God damn, Kyrie Irving is a magician! Another great game of basketball right there, and all credit to the Cavs for stepping up like that. However, it is hardly sustainable that you have to set finals records in threes made, points scored in a half, LeBron getting a high triple double and Kyrie playing like a man possessed to win a game. Having said that, if the Cavs can somehow grind out a win in game 5, then doubts will most likely seriously creep into the Warriors players.

mdgoonah41

thats as bad as ive seen the warriors defend in the last 3 years. maybe steve kerr's "just go out and have fun, dont worry too much" pre-game speech wasnt the best idea.

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Yeah, it's over. Good on the cavs for managing to get this one game. Warriors are just too strong. Never actually looked out of it even when they were 15 points down you just felt a brief loss in concentration and it could be game 3 all over again

Rex

They are scary good alright, they didn't defend well at all, but they are human after all. Would be interesting to see their mettle tested properly were they to lose game 5. I don't quite know how that will happen, but I don't want this series to end! 🙂

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