Summer 2025 Transfer Window: Page 132 - The Arsenal discussion forum and community: One More in the Tolly

Summer 2025 Transfer Window

RowJimmy

Klaus
MLS's current role allows us to play a 442 defending and a 3223 attacking. If you start him in midfield you will need to:
1) have him play as a single pivot - we then need a different fullback to start inverting next to him
2) drop Rice, not going to happen
3) drop Odegaard - Rice would need to be playmaker as well as BTB, not his strength
4) drop an attacker

None of these seem to me an improvement. (NB 2-4 assume Zubimendi [backed by Partey] is playing as a 6)

Sicario2

samthegooner what’s the point of signing a star striker if they don’t start ahead of Kai? We are not paying £60-80m for a squad player.

Kai is ok but possibly the strangest footballer I’ve ever seen - a complete enigma.

Claudius

Sicario2 we aren’t talking about signing Aguero or Saurez here. We are talking about a Bundesliga kid who is still developing or a guy who beat up on a league whose average wage is less than the Championship. Both excite me, but the idea that they just come in and easily replace Kai isn’t easy to ingest

samthegooner

Sicario2 The point would be bringing in someone like Sesko who ideally would develop this year and displace him by the end of the year, but at the very least he would provide another great option off the bench that isn't a CM playing striker like we had last year. Being able to bring in a Sesko like talent in the 70th minute of a game is something we haven't had in years and it clearly killed us this year. And then if he hits the ground running and continues to fulfill his immense potential, you've got a league winning CF emerging in the second half of this year.

Personally, I think we can win trophies with Kai as our CF and think he is very underrated on this forum with the work he does outside of simply finishing. The list of CF's in the league right now that start over him is very short IMO: Haaland and Isak.

Sicario2

Claudius ok so let’s write off another season then. Can’t wait for 2026-2027.

Don Pacifico

Claudius it's also about having options to rotate in/out not just from a freshness perspective but in terms of tactical variety too. We've not had that capacity in the forward line.

samthegooner

If I were Berta, this is what I'd do (June 16th edition):
Sell: Trossard and Zinchenko.
Buy: Kepa, Zubimendi, Sesko, Rodrygo, Eze, defensive depth (the Brazilian CB from Lille, Alexsandro, or Hato)

Rodrygo (Martinelli/Eze) -------- Havertz (Sesko) -------- Saka (Nwaneri/Eze)
--------- Rice (Eze/Merino) --------------- Odegaard (Eze/Nwaneri) ---------
------------------- Zubimendi (Partey/Rice/Merino/MLS) -------------------
MLS (Calafiori) -- Gabriel (Kiwior/Alexsandro) -- Saliba (Alexsandro/White) -- Timber (White)
------------------------- Raya (Kepa) -------------------------------

We'd have depth at every role 1:1 but also have versatile players like Eze that could get minutes at 4 different positions. I'd argue that Eze might even displace Odegaard at 8, although I doubt Arteta would bench a healthy Odegaard. Sesko would have time to adapt to the league but at the very least would be an impact sub off the bench for the first few months. My only worry would be speed across the team as Rodrygo isn't a burner but we collectively upgrade our technical ability by a good deal with Rodrygo and Eze joining, both of which would thrive in UCL knockouts where we have been craving some individual brilliance. Personally, I think this team wins a trophy next year and also think we can realistically bring in these 5-6 players. I'd be okay with other wing options in order to allow us to get Eze, as I am just a huge believer in his talent and fit in our current squad. Assuming that Nico is heading to Barca, I'd be fine with Anthony Gordon, Barcola, Gittens or even going for a development prospect like Nusa on the left if it meant that we could also bring in Eze.

samthegooner

samthegooner If I were Berta, this is what I'd do (June 16th edition):
Sell: Trossard and Zinchenko.
Buy: Kepa, Zubimendi, Sesko, Rodrygo, Eze, defensive depth (the Brazilian CB from Lille, Alexsandro, or Hato)

Rodrygo (Martinelli/Eze) -------- Havertz (Sesko) -------- Saka (Nwaneri/Eze)
--------- Rice (Eze/Merino) --------------- Odegaard (Eze/Nwaneri) ---------
------------------- Zubimendi (Partey/Rice/Merino/MLS) -------------------
MLS (Calafiori) -- Gabriel (Kiwior/Alexsandro) -- Saliba (Alexsandro/White) -- Timber (White)
------------------------- Raya (Kepa) -------------------------------

We'd have depth at every role 1:1 but also have versatile players like Eze that could get minutes at 4 different positions. I'd argue that Eze might even displace Odegaard at 8, although I doubt Arteta would bench a healthy Odegaard. Sesko would have time to adapt to the league but at the very least would be an impact sub off the bench for the first few months. My only worry would be speed across the team as Rodrygo isn't a burner but we collectively upgrade our technical ability by a good deal with Rodrygo and Eze joining, both of which would thrive in UCL knockouts where we have been craving some individual brilliance. Personally, I think this team wins a trophy next year and also think we can realistically bring in these 5-6 players. I'd be okay with other wing options in order to allow us to get Eze, as I am just a huge believer in his talent and fit in our current squad.

I said this back on June 16th and thought it was very optimistic but now I'm starting to think this may be the reality.

No one will be surprised that I am planting my flag on side of the fence that says we are going to do what we have said we are trying to do this summer and its going to be a banner summer. I will admit I was drinking the kool-aid and give everyone on the more negative side their flowers on September 1st if I am wrong of course.

I feel like we are going to end up with the following: Kepa, Zubimendi, Norgaard, Mosquera, Eze, Rodrygo and one of Sesko/Gyokeres. Sesko would be my preference due to a higher ceiling with his size, pace and unicorn skills of ball striking and technique for his size but I won't be upset at all if we end up with Gyokeres. If we do end up pulling this off, it's a 10/10 summer for me and I would fancy our chances against any team out there.

Mirth

Klaus I’d agree if money was the limiting factor for this window but it isn’t so I’d say we’re an overall better squad with Havertz in it (even as a bench option).

Say we got Gyokeres and Williams, we’d still be stuck with Martinelli and Trossard as our established options off the bench in attack. That isn’t enough.

flobaba

Sicario2

@Claudius, I take his point, that if Sesko/Gyok (natural center forwards) are not instant and significant upgrades on Havertz/Merino (not natural center forwards) in the center forward position, we are doing this wrong...

Claudius

samthegooner folks underestimate what it takes to finish 2nd for three years in a row, including an injury olagued season. We are really good. We just need to fill out the squad strategically so we don’t drop points needlessly.

Pepe LeFrits

samthegooner Agree. I'm pretty confident Havertz will start the season at 9 for us.

Havertz is a very good player and I reckon both Sesko and Gyokeres would be as well for us, so I'd be happy with us getting either as it won't leave us so exposed again to Kai getting injured or losing form. I don't see either as being the big ceiling raisers they're being made out to be though. It seems like because we need an absolutely elite striker, people have convinced themselves that they, or moreso Gyokeres, must be one. Wishing doesn't make it so and it's why I'm leaning towards Sesko now, because he has long term upside and might end up being one of the absolute elite. We already have one good striker so I'd rather our other striker to have that potential. I'd hate to see one of our rivals ending up with the next Kane/Lewa/Isak/Haaland while we're left with two strikers in their late twenties who are merely good. Of course it could turn out that Gyokeres takes the league by storm, he has a certain willfulness about him so it wouldn't shock me, but it worries me that only Man United seem to be the only other club sniffing around him. If he's the sure thing he's made out to be, he should be more sought after.

flobaba

samthegooner bold statement that there's only two strikers in the prem better than Havertz. Very bold statement.

I'm very much pro-Havertz, and while I agree that he's underrated when it comes to his non goal scoring contributions (his work rate is animalistic), I also think his goal scoring contributions, which are presumably what we pay him for, are meh enough that we have been looking to upgrade on him for the past 2 transfer windows.

Also you want a player leading the line on whom you can rely to consistently give you (an increased chance for) a moment of breakthrough when all else fails. A player defenders must account for. Even if we get a Martinelli upgrade, I would want our center forward to also have that quality.

samthegooner

Claudius Yup we need maybe 1-2 starting first team players to add a little more star power but mostly, a better bench that can be called upon and provide close to 1:1 parity in terms of quality and as Don Pacifico said, tactical variety. Think of some of the games we struggled in this year when we had a bench of teenagers and 3-4 left backs and flip that to next year having the ability to add in genuine first team challengers when we need a boost. I'm not going to be too hung up on who displaces who but moreso, that we have competition for places and a squad of 16-17 starting level players that we can rotate and use as game changers.

Claudius

Cute video

Claudius

samthegooner Yup. for me tactical variety starts with more speed particularly in last 20 minutes of games.

Klaus

Pepe LeFrits It seems like because we need an absolutely elite striker, people have convinced themselves that they, or moreso Gyokeres, must be one. Wishing doesn't make it so

Feel free to name the three football players who have scored 63 goals or more in a single season in the last 30 years. Spoiler:

I realise the bulk of those goals are in the Portuguese league, but if this was easy or common, where are the other players who have done it? I've watched a bit of this league and it's no worse than Ligue 1 or Bundesliga on average. The top teams are a tier below the two giants in Germany and France, but the quality of the rest of the league is not really that different.

Think it's hilarious to claim Havertz is anywhere near this level as a striker. He's just not. You'd be hard pressed finding a single non-Arsenal fan who'd even rank him as one of the 10-15 best strikers in Europe. That's the difference really, and it's why Arsenal never win anything.

Pepe LeFrits

Also, not a chance we're signing both.

RowJimmy

We don't need a classic/natural CF. We need more goal threat from whatever positions we can get it.

flobaba

RowJimmy if Sesko/Gyok are not instant and significant goal threat upgrades than Merino/Havertz, we are doing this wrong.

Better? 🙂

samthegooner

flobaba I probably should have qualified that as there are only 2 PL CF that would start over him at Arsenal. Yes there are definitely better goal scorers out there in the league but none offer the combination of traits outside of pure goal scoring that he possesses. I'm very biased against Haaland since I don't think he's a quality footballer - just a brute with phenomenal physical gifts and the ability to finish well, but I actually think Havertz is a better fit for how we play than an out and out finisher like Haaland. I know I am quite in the minority there and don't pretend that my own personal bias against Haaland influences my thought process but that's where I'm at. Now, I would love a guy like Sesko who has the ability (or potential ability) to do a lot of the things that Havertz does well (win balls in the air, press from the top, make intelligent runs between the lines) while also having more pace, ball striking ability and the ability to make runs on the back shoulder of the last defender. Having both of them would give us great options to play one or the other or even play them together as Sesko continues to develop.

Trust me when I say that I would be over the moon if by the end of this year, Sesko is our first name on the team sheet at CF since I think it would mean that he has started to put together all of his immense potential to become one of the best CF's in the world. But I won't be upset if he takes a bit of time to find his feet or if Havertz is still our CF at the end of the season.

Sicario2

flobaba

samthegooner what is your goal for the season? To win trophies or to develop players?

HomeSteak

samthegooner so let's say you have the choice. Haaland or Havertz to start for us?

QuincyAbeyie

samthegooner Wait, is Haaland not one of the two strikers you're referring to?

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