⚽ Arsenal vs Fulham, League, Saturday 26 Aug, 3pm: Page 20 - The Arsenal discussion community: One More in the Tolly

⚽ Arsenal vs Fulham, League, Saturday 26 Aug, 3pm

daredevil

We've also had these kind of performances with Gabriel in the team.

Conceding ridiculous early goals means an uphill struggle and taking the foot off the pedal means we allow opponents back in.

I think Ramsdale gets dropped after today and the less said about the Havertz the better. Fabio Vieira on the other hand was everything people were hoping to see in Kai.

Bring Back Kerrea Gilbert

daredevil good point - Ramsdale to the bench pronto. Don't think Arteta needs another excuse.

MistaT

We traded a fullback who can't pass for a fullback who can't run, defend, or dribble. He was massively covered for by Gabriel and Xhaka last year, and we've now removed those two pillars of support.

Going to be interesting to see what comes of Zinchenko.

Ricky1985

Bring Back Kerrea Gilbert
Crazy talk, man. Zinchenko completely turned the game on its head. He tried a pass that didn't quute work and they got a corner from it. Big fucking deal. Defend the fucking corner you dickheads and all is well.

Our defending at set-pieces is completely unacceptable. We concede a goal or at least a good chance from them every single game without fail.

lorddulaarsenal

Ricky1985 that was infuriating. I recon it may trigger some transfer incomings. If Arteta was unsure whether or not to dip in to the market he will now

Zinchenko and Vieira should get starts. maybe drop Martinelli too.

Ricky1985

lorddulaarsenal

Yeah, Martinelli is a problem because he's seeing so much of the ball due to teams doubling and tripling up on Saka, and he's doing very little with it. He should have scored at least 1 or 2 goals today with the space he had. If Saka had that sort of time and space, he'd have killed them, but it's always Martinelli that gets it. And it's not an accident. Teams know he is very inefficient.

Lukazan

lorddulaarsenal Vieira was good today and has earned himself some credit back but starting him next game.. I'm not sure.

Clrnc

Bring Back Kerrea Gilbert He costed us today definitely, direct error leading to the goal but I have decided we are better off overall having him AND Gabriel than not. Gabriel can cover for him and Zinchenko passing between the lines add much more to our game than anything else.

If its White and Saliba central, then we can't start Zinchenko.

Kel Varnsen

Clrnc He costed us today definitely, direct error leading to the goal but I have decided we are better off overall having him AND Gabriel than not.

He gave away a corner. About 3% of corners result in a goal.

Burnwinter

Bring Back Kerrea Gilbert I hear you but I disagree, Zinchenko's very influential as we saw again today, and despite a dip in form last season his errors have rarely penalised us.

As we've said time and again, a lot of that's been because Gabriel is a Rolls Royce who would have prevented Fulham's second goal nine times in ten.

Bring Back Kerrea Gilbert

Burnwinter why can't Zinchenko play LCM?

Clrnc

Kel Varnsen Not just today though, he always have such moments that leads to a goal and he has been like this since the City days. He was poor in the defending of the corner too with Jorginho.

But yes, as a team we have to do better. We are defending like absolute dick heads. It's not a coincidence we keep on conceding cheap cheap goals at home.

Pepe LeFrits

Bring Back Kerrea Gilbert Zinchenko is firmly a squad player for me. He showed once again he cannot be trusted not to provide some moronic moment.

We're in trouble if that's the case because he seems to be the only full-back we have who can invert now that Timber is out. He was so much vastly better than Partey at it, it changed the game so much when he came on. We tried doing the traditional inverted full-back with Partey for 10 minutes after half time but struggled through to get through the first line of their press.

I don't think the players fully have internalised the movements, patterns and routines with White and Partey interchanging and it cost us today, but I guess that can be the price for trying to evolve the team.

Bring Back Kerrea Gilbert

Pepe LeFrits we must sign Timber cover before the deadline.

James

Pepe LeFrits We're in trouble if that's the case because he seems to be the only full-back we have who can invert now that Timber is out. He was so much vastly better than Partey at it, it changed the game so much when he came on. We tried doing the traditional inverted full-back with Partey for 10 minutes after half time but struggled through to get through the first line of their press.

I don't think the players fully have internalised the movements, patterns and routines with White and Partey interchanging and it cost us today, but I guess that can be the price for trying to evolve the team.

Best analysis I’ve read of the situation this Peps. The Timber injury is huge, because he allowed us to keep that familiar shape, and pattern of play/relationships by slotting in for Zinchenko. He could do that inverted full back, but he also would’ve been so much more effective in the Tomiyasu/Kiwior role if we chose to play Partey at RB. Like you say, Arteta is trying to evolve the side and make us less predictable, but it feels like one step back at the moment. Hopefully the two forward comes further down the line. That, or we just slot Zinchenko back in, go back to last season, and pray he doesn’t get injured.

Pepe LeFrits

BTW it was Saka who cost us the most for both of our goals - asleep at the corner and played a blind back-pass for the first. I feel like that should be mentioned considering it seems to be Zinchenko getting all the blame. Partey's decision to charge forward for the first goal was also a pretty bad error.

Pepe LeFrits

Pepe LeFrits was also a pretty bad error.

... which mostly sums the game. We made so many errors today and it cost us. For all the talk of formations etc we created more than enough to have won this game easily if we'd been switched on and on it. I don't know what it is about playing at the Emirates but the side just don't seem to focus properly there. It's an issue.

edit. I see the xG confirms the eye test. We should have won that easily and the players will have to ask themselves why they didn't.

Kel Varnsen

Clrnc Not just today though, he always have such moments that leads to a goal and he has been like this since the City days. He was poor in the defending of the corner too with Jorginho.

True, but I think it is also pretty clear that we're a much better side when he's playing. When you have players like that with certain extreme abilities, you build the right support structure around them. Trying to replicate what Zinchenko does with vastly inferior players (like Partey and Timber) is a bad idea.

Burnwinter

Bring Back Kerrea Gilbert I think he can. Gabriel should've come on instead of Jorginho after Bassey's red, and then we'd have had that setup if we so chose, with Kiwior returning to left back.

Ricky1985

Partey is better at the RB part than he is at the inverting into midfield part. And he's pretty average at the RB part...

JazzG

I didn't watch the game fully again shows we are dominating in terms of chances and yet still giving the opposition cheap goals.

All the fucking time at home as well.

Big Willie

Coombs Underlying stats suggest game was a fluke, but it's still a selection problem for me. Hard to argue against a system that produced a 3 vs .5 xG game in our favor, but Eddie and Gabriel should have started imo.

JazzG I didn't watch the game fully again shows we are dominating in terms of chances and yet still giving the opposition cheap goals.

This was the same stat against Forest.

Dunno if that shows domination. Take these stats with a pinch of salt. We may be dominating possession and territory but our game has not looked good all season. Our attack has been disjointed and our defence isn't any stronger for it. Time will tell how this goes.

Sicario2 - Tier 1 One saving grace of not winning is that it didn’t allow a win to paper over the cracks.

It’s good that Arteta knows ASAP this ain’t working rather than leaving it too late.

You think Arteta is that easy to have his mind swayed if he sets his sights on something? Nah, I think he's gonna keep his experiement going until it either works or it reaches a stage where it's cost us too much. Hopefully it just works in the end.

Clrnc

Ricky1985 I lost count of how many times he could beat his man on the outside to deliver a telling ball but he chose to fucking cut back and pass it back.

Clrnc

A penalty increases the xG by quite a bit.

Really don't get the Partey at RB inverting experiment. Hasn't worked for me as no clear advantages for us there and it breaks the White Saka Odegaard axis.

Ricky1985

Clrnc

We earned the penalty, so of course it shouldn't be disregarded in the XG stat.

We were absolutely all over them for pretty much the entire match - the period where we went ahead until they scored is the only time they were in the game - but it's about outcomes. And we fucked up the final pass or shot over and over and over again, to the point of tedium. It's just not acceptable. Ødegaard and Martinelli should have done much more with what they had, everyone who started should have, but those two were involved a lot, got time and space often, and yet did very little.

I like the idea of being able to "invert" the RB, btw. I think it'd be great to have that bilateral threat and unpredictability. I just don't think Partey is the man to do it with.

HomeSteak

Arteta said we were 10 times better(at least 10 times better he said) today then when we beat them last game, when we won what? 4,5-0?

Clrnc

HomeSteak Fuck me, that's straight out of Pep's book

est

HomeSteak 😆 I can see where the players got the drugs from...

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