Expectations - 2023/2024 Season: Page 6 - The Arsenal discussion community: One More in the Tolly

Expectations - 2023/2024 Season

Burnwinter

Very early to ponder title runs. To my eye we looked better against Palace than in the same fixture last season, so I question if we've started slowly.

This is one of the strongest squads, if not the strongest squad (not first XI) I've seen at Arsenal.

I've never expected our 50 point half season to be repeated, so a long run in the league hinges on big results against City, and others. I expect improvement in big matches. Our squad is older and wiser but young, and our transfers make us tougher. No idea yet how the Champions League will impact our focus.

Sicario2 - Tier 1

Burnwinter

I agree it’s one of our strongest squads but losing Timber significantly disadvantages us.
The drop in quality to Tomi is obvious. The latter has regressed and is injury prone.

The problem is our other LB’s our injury prone as well which could bite us in the bum later on in the season.

If Timber stayed fit and we signed a proper striker I think we would have given City a right proper run for their money.

QuincyAbeyie

Way too early to say that any of our players have regressed.

Sicario2 - Tier 1

QuincyAbeyie
I think last seasons sample size is large enough

Mirth

Yeah Tomi hasn’t looked good for a while. He wasn’t necessarily bad yesterday but he looked very cumbersome on the ball compared to Zinchenko or Timber.

Don Pacifico

Mirth has he ever been as good on the ball as those two? My point is, his relative weaknesses have always been there, I don't think it's anything new. He did a good job despite those limitations prior to injury and I don't think what's being asked of him now is markedly different.

Clrnc

He's actually technically very proficient for a CB. Not for an inverted fullback to be played DM though. He can keep it simple and consistent but don't expect him to ping 50 yard passes.

Burnwinter

You can classify three levels of defensive availability for the side:

Quality selection and we can play an Arteta mad scientist lineup (Saliba, Zinchenko, White, Timber)
Quality selection but with our more conventional players (Gabriel, Tierney, Tomiyasu)
Sub-par or jury-rigged selection (Holding, Kiwior, Cedric, Partey, Jorginho et al. in defence)

Arteta's very obsessed with the difference between (1) and (2), but the difference between (2) and (3) was what killed us last season.

I think it's likely Arteta wants to go to market just because in our first two league fixtures he's tried out Tomi and Partey in a bid to keep his mad scientist dreams going, rather than reverting to Gabriel or Tierney who are excellent defenders.

After Timber's unfortunate injury, if Cedric, Holding, Tavares and Tierney all leave as we half predict, the right side of defence is vulnerable to another Tomiyasu issue. If Tomi goes down, we really don't want another injury after that, and we risk fatigue and stress injuries for Saliba and White big time.

Nothing wrong with Tomiyasu as a player. If he were as durable as White he'd be a great asset. He seems to be regarded as slightly less coachable but he might just not have had the chances yet.

Sicario2 - Tier 1

Don’t want to get carried away after one draw but it’s not looked good this season and we know Arteta has over thought things.

Prob with this season was always the hightended expectations following last season.

Anything other than another title challenge will be seen as a failure.

In all honestly, for our peace of mind I think we should forget the title and hope to get top 4 and battle it out in the cups esp CL. Would make the season much more bearable.

Quieten expectations and have a really strong second half of the season, basically the opposite of last season.

Burnwinter

Sicario2 - Tier 1 In all honestly, for our peace of mind I think we should forget the title

Absolutely disagree, we're just as strong in personnel as last season.

90+ points has to remain the target, and we have to strain every fibre to beat United and get on the rails. We've got the squad, we've got the manager, we've got the individuals.

You spent the whole back half of last season declaring this Arsenal generation had achieved absolutely nothing until we had real silverware, be consistent! 😇

JazzG

Sicario2 - Tier 1 Don’t want to get carried away after one draw

I think it's too late for that 😂

Lukazan

Forget the league? We're 3 games in... 3 games. Honestly.

And if the players and manager were to 'forget' the league you'd be on here moaning and banging on about bottle, balls, ambition, mentality and the rest..

Sicario2 - Tier 1

Lukazan

The margin of error is so small and we are up against the best team in the world.

You can either forget the league and enjoy the season with your expectations managed or have a stressful next few months when we slowly drop pace and eventually reach point of no return with City by Xmas most likely.

It’s not about loser mentality it’s about seeing what’s in front of your eyes. Unless we do something incredible this last week. The Timber injury was fatal as I first mentioned when it happened.

Don Pacifico

We're basically starting the season how City did last year...😉

Only half-joking. Watching our start to the season, I'm torn between thinking we're still working through the new setup that Arteta has instructed this season vs whether there's element of not going full throttle so early given the amount of high intensity games we'll likely face this season (ie. pacing ourselves). I suspect it's a bit of both - we've certainly not got the right balance yet but one draw, whilst providing a warning signal, doesn't precipitate a massive departure from our ambition for the season.

QuincyAbeyie

Don Pacifico in that case I'd almost hope it was the former, because pacing ourselves to the point where we drop points would be ridiculous.

awooga83

I think we'll have an idea about what we really like like after 10 games but I do see that dropping points to 10 man Fulham at home is pretty bad. If we see the city that has dominated the league for the past 6-7 years you know you don't have much room for error and using up some of that in Fulham makes it harder for sure.

For me the challenge of this season is always can we replicate the level we saw last year as close as we can to try show it is repeatable and we didn't just get lucky with a great season. We had lots of our players doing exceptional things but as young players can do they can be inconsistent so what happens if Martinelli, Saka or Odegaard aren't quite upto the same level this season how do we manage that

Sicario2 - Tier 1

Teams with extra expectations plus playing Europe could struggle this season - Newcastle, Man Utd, Us and Brighton spring to mind.

Spurs and Chelsea are not a threat but we have to be conscious they could go under the radar with no Europe and playing once a week.

JazzG

Sicario2 - Tier 1

JazzG

We already nearly beat the Pep machine just last year, we don’t need to wait until he leaves.

We are year 4 of the Arteta project, how many years are we going to wait, till year 7? We’ve already had ‘trust the process’. Is this trust the process 2.0? What if Pep stays another 10 years?

This season is about building on last and going again. You don’t stop, re-build again and hope for the best. That’s wasting everything we did last year.

The strategy Le Grove is suggesting is so risky as it’s not guaranteed. You also only get a certain amount of good will.

JazzG

Sicario2 - Tier 1 Key word being nearly, in the end we fell comfortably short.

I don't actually agree with Le Grove fully here, his point about having different formations and ways of setting up is valid though. We need to be less predictable and tactically more flexible. Different players have different strengths so need to be able to make sure we can make tweaks and remain at a high level.

City have not had a great window by their standards so there is a chance they might not be able to hit the levels they have in past years.

Also we need to make sure we peak around March time, two seasons in a row we have peaked too early and for a variety of reasons fallen short at the end. Squad rotation but also having different set ups is key to that.

awooga83

I also think football doesn't work like that. You don't get to choose when the opportunities are presented to you. The idea we have the control when pep goes out whatever to me it's rubbish. We are 4 years into Arteta's run he needs to be heading towards delivering something. Klopp did it why can't Arteta if he's as good as people have suggested.

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