Artetaball Tactics Thread: Page 16 - The Arsenal discussion community: One More in the Tolly

Artetaball Tactics Thread

flobaba

RocktheCasbah it's obviously unsustainable. Yes we are more solid defensively. But is the trade off worth it? And does it really have to be a trade off?

I just saw Arteta's post match and one of his comments in response to the interviewer giving us the backhanded cliche compliment of "mark of champions is winning when you're not at your best", was "I think we were at our best today", and that we can't (and no one can) play fluid football against a team that sets up low block like Brentford does.

Is this really true? We are the ones who basically force teams into a low block. What should they do? Just allow Martinelli / Saka rip them a new one? Of course they need to double up. What we need to do which we are not doing is find the resultant spaces elsewhere and exploit them. It would involve taking a few passing risks, doing things a bit faster, creating (and actually using) overloads. And that's what we are unwilling to do now.

banduan

flobaba there are definitely strategies to beat a low block but it involves changing the team roster significantly. E.g., Newcastle thrive against teams that don't press.

It should not be a surprise that Pool and Citeh both struggle against low blocks as well. At least Pool has Salah to work with.

RocktheCasbah

flobaba I guess I just think you're being incredibly harsh about a team who, whether you like the style of football or not (obviously, not) are sitting top of the league with the best defence stats in said league. And are there despite the season long absences of Timber and, essentially, Partey. Despite Declan Rice being new to the team, despite the fact our preferred front three have started, what, three league games together all season.

None of what you've said can really be argued with, but I think it lacks the context of an incredible amount of change from last season's XI which essentially picked itself, until the injuries came.

goon

flobaba What we need to do which we are not doing is find the resultant spaces elsewhere and exploit them. It would involve taking a few passing risks, doing things a bit faster, creating (and actually using) overloads. And that's what we are unwilling to do now.

You make it sounds so easy!

MistaT

Players who pass and move (like ESR) are made for beating low block teams. The issue then becomes is Arteta willing to give up control of the game (inevitable with those players) to utilize them?

banduan

MistaT Players who pass and move (like ESR) are made for beating low block teams.

only if it's not a very good low block. It's not like Saka and Ode can't do pass and move either.

Qwiss

I think it's as much a personel issue as a tactical one. We need a much better centre forward. Jesus is a good player but he's not a good centre forward.

flobaba

Qwiss While I don't disagree, I think he's adequate. He's levels above what our opponents yesterday had on the field. Individually, for the most part, our players shit all over Brentford's players from a great height.

I think we make this football thing harder than it has to be.

flobaba

If you have an attacking footballing philosophy, it is.

Again, we are playing like this by choice.

RocktheCasbah

flobaba Again, we are playing like this by choice.

If you're right, do you mind me asking how you're planning to cope with watching us this season? It could be painful!

goon

flobaba

I mean if you attack and give no real consideration to winning and not conceding, sure. You'll be able to create chances with 9 men with that attitude, you'll just happen to lose 4-1 in the process to a wasteful opposition. Just don't expect to win the league.

We played with two 10s yesterday, played a high line that meant every player was in the opposition half and have had more touches in the final third and opposition box than any other team in the league this season. Our defensive midfielder was camped just outside the opposition box. It's a style that want's to kill the opposition in every aspect of play. But just like how goal line clearances and cheap goals are not a part of the plan, neither is the struggle to break teams down.

flobaba

RocktheCasbah it will be. It already is, and that's why I'm on here moaning about it every week - I'm sorry, it's my release. 🙂

I hope (believe) we get better once Partey returns, but if we don't then for me, this style of play is only justifiable if we win the league/champions League.

QuincyAbeyie

Fans cope with their teams not playing the way they want all the time.

RocktheCasbah

QuincyAbeyie yes, but I'm not asking the "fans", I'm asking flobs - who has been pretty clear about his disdain for our game so far this season.

RocktheCasbah

flobaba to be fair to you, you're not saying anything my uncle isn't, so I am well versed in this particular conversation. And as I've said before, I'm not completely unsympathetic to your point of view. 😉

As it happens, I do think you might be right and Partey coming back may unlock us, but of course we all know what the issues are there. If not him, then perhaps big Dec can learn about vertical passing from the base - I don't think it's beyond him but it might take a bit of time. Certainly, if he's going to be the long term six, then it is something he'll need to develop.

Meatwad

we don't play unattractive, we're just impotent in front of goal. if we had a goal scoring forward it would be a different story. and that's arteta's fault because he seems to be obsessed with eunuchs.

Burnwinter

Think we might be in the market for a striker in winter for what it's worth. Trossard was an incredible acquisition.

I think the proof of these tactics will be in the top table away ties, like Villa Park and Anfield upcoming, and by endurance and energy levels through the back half of the season. I believe the tactical switch has been driven by the huge collapse in results we experienced after March last season which cost us the title.

If we get results in those matches and we carry on at the top, we're absolutely doing it right, especially if you believe we do have some improvement left offensively. It's not as fun to watch as "basketball Arsenal" from last season but it's proving itself so far.

RocktheCasbah

Brief, but to the point

Don Pacifico

RocktheCasbah I'm still not sure I agree. All the stats I've seen this season suggest weaker productivity coming from our midfield and looking at the way we play on the pitch, that's largely a function of (a) slow transitions and (b) ineffectiveness from key midfield personnel (particularly Xhaka 2.0 and Ode).

Qwiss

RocktheCasbah I watched him last night, he was sort of full of shit. Said we hadn't been having any injury issues apart from Smith-Rowe.

JazzG

Last season we also had our first XI mostly fit right up until the world cup, this season it could be argued pre-season aside we haven't played our first XI in a single game.

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