Has Arteta Truly Turned it Around?: Page 51 - The Arsenal discussion forum and community: One More in the Tolly

Has Arteta Truly Turned it Around?

awooga83

Emery's lack of English and therefore ability to communicate with fans and media cost him. It meant it was easy to dismiss him from I don't understand what he's saying through to clearly he doesn't know what he's doing and the players can't understand.

Arteta can talk a good game which lots of people and the media love so they impose that he says they right stuff so it can't be his fault things don't work on the pitch it has to be other factors like the players.

Alot seem to have loved the idea he's going to be Guardiola and taken out as guaranteed if you stick with him long enough he will become that.

The reality is he isn't better then Emery and I think the majority concluded we weren't making progress with him. I don't know why the same conclusion isn't being drawn with Arteta. Finishing outside the top 6 for a second season under Arteta should really be the end of the line.

But knowing how Arsenal has been run their is no limit to how much failure at tolerate. It's why we are in the position we find ourselves as a club.

Mirth

jones wrote:
Emery spoke shit English and made funny faces during games, he's a smart man but not exactly charismatic especially if you can't understand him. Stuff like good ebening literally ruins careers if you're not successful. With Arteta you have a young bloke who knows the league and who many fans still remember as a player, who's carried Guardiola's water for a couple years too. People are in love with the idea of him succeeding, if you had the exact same results and performances under Emery he'd long been ungraciously sacked.

I think that's a factor. Arteta sells the dream of an ex-player returning to their old club and turning things around. It's an easy narrative and it just takes a little bit of charisma to get the media onside. Lampard, Henry, Gerrard and Ole enjoyed a similar bounce till we realised they were frauds. Moreover, Arteta has been around in the PL for nearly 2 decades now so is considered an 'insider' by the media.

GooneriC

What's disappointing is that we've had two managers in a row and the players we have ( including the newer players brought in ) don't seem to be on board with whatever style of play they want to implement. Everyone's playing cagey and there seems to be a general lack of confidence and care with the ball . It's gone on too long .

Ray

Three reasons Arteta should stay:

Improved us defensively, if I were to say “he is the next” then it would be Arteta is more Simeone than Pep. He will adjust the team to deliver based on what he has, putting defence first. Arsenal have not put defence first since the George Graham days.
We can go into big games with the confidence that we may get a result here. Which hasn’t been the case for at least a decade.
Convincing players to buy into his project and the type of players he has targeted have been good. He convinced the likes of Auba, Partey, Ode etc that Arsenal is a club to play for.

Personally couldn’t give two hoots about if he was ex Arsenal, that is reserved for guys like Vieira / Henry. From a coaching point of view, there’s a lot to work with.

Claudius

Ray wrote:
Three reasons Arteta should stay:

Improved us defensively, if I were to say “he is the next” then it would be Arteta is more Simeone than Pep. He will adjust the team to deliver based on what he has, putting defence first. Arsenal have not put defence first since the George Graham days.

We can go into big games with the confidence that we may get a result here. Which hasn’t been the case for at least a decade.

Convincing players to buy into his project and the type of players he has targeted have been good. He convinced the likes of Auba, Partey, Ode etc that Arsenal is a club to play for.

Personally couldn’t give two hoots about if he was ex Arsenal, that is reserved for guys like Vieira / Henry. From a coaching point of view, there’s a lot to work with.

Feel the same for now Ray.
I’m also not going to be overly moved by the Liverpool result because we were missing several important players (even those our fans refuse to acknowledge as being the best of this mess).

We are in a rebuild. Expecting quick results while we are getting rid of players and changing culture seems unfair on the manager and the club. This is the process we should’ve undergone with Emery, instead of trying to polish the turd one more time. It actually makes me sympathetic to Emery that he he didn’t get a full rebuild mandate and had to straddle his way to an unfortunate exit

Mirth

Emery was a victim of office politics to an extent. New guy wanting to make a mark etc.

mdgoonah41

weve conceded the 7th fewest goals in the division this season. is that a big defensive improvement? in emery's full season in 2018-2019, the team conceded 51 goals in the league. we still have 8 games left and we've conceded 35 so far this season. that emery team also scored 73 goals in the league, we're not going to get even close to that number.

as for the big games

@ liverpool = 3-1 loss
@ man city = 1-0 loss
@ man united = 1-0 win
@ spuds = 2-0 loss
chelsea home = 3-1 win
man united home = 0-0 draw
man city home = 1-0 loss
spuds home = 2-1 win
liverpool home = 3-0 loss

i guess that is modest progress

him "convincing players of the project" worked because he had a half season to his name, a covid season, and he won the FA cup. now we are 10th in the league, and unless we win the europa league, i have a hard time imagining players will be buying his vision. its easy to sell something when its theory and there arent real results. he actually has real results now that he needs to justify.

goon

It’s true, I’m one of his biggest backers on here but I’ve always said if he wants more time he needs to produce. I’m certain he’ll start next season but how much time he gets will depend on how this one goes.

swider

Hopefully he leaves at the end of the season, I was relatively happy with him becoming our manager, but he proved me wrong.

Claudius

The champions league games last night were disheartening. Two things. First was the bravery that Dortmund showed in going after Manchester City. Dortmund have a 17 years old CM. He is good but I wouldn’t call him Fabregas. They were outmatched all over the field but they managed to play a brave, progressive football that I think can be achieved even with the inferior goods we have at our disposal.

Second was just absolute quality. Seeing Thiago taking on an imperious Kroos and Modric just felt like I was watching a different sport.

Coombs

Not sure about that assessment. I saw a Dortmund team mostly camped in their own half playing on the counter, with a couple of brief spells on the front foot they couldn't maintain. If Arteta oversaw that performance he'd be slated.

Claudius

They lost the possession game 38% to 62% but the shots were decent 7:11. And they had a very good goal ruled offside. They made some good forays into the final third early on. And this is without their trickiest attacker.

goon

Any game is always going to be disheartening after a performance like Liverpool on Sat anyway. How would have those performances looked after the Tottenham or Chelsea victories?

Coombs

Those are all just excuses, though. They should have lost by far more than they did, they were battered. If people want us to be like Dortmund, that game showed me that we already are.

jones

You're off your rocker Coombs. City dominated possession and were overall better but every time Dortmund came forward they looked dangerous. Plus the ref massively bailed out City by calling off a perfectly good goal, no idea how you decide they "should" have lost by far more than they did

Coombs

City's poor finishing was the only thing keeping that scoreline respectable. Yes, they had a goal disallowed, and yes, their world-class forwards look dangerous going forward, but that's not exactly surprising. Dortmund have a better team than Arsenal, and yet they still got soundly beaten. Not the other way 'round.

Clrnc

They probably would have needed a last minute goal to salvage a draw at home if the ref didn't fuck up.

Soundly beaten lol

Claudius

LOL

Jed

Claudius wrote:
The champions league games last night were disheartening. Two things. First was the bravery that Dortmund showed in going after Manchester City. Dortmund have a 17 years old CM. He is good but I wouldn’t call him Fabregas. They were outmatched all over the field but they managed to play a brave, progressive football that I think can be achieved even with the inferior goods we have at our disposal.

Second was just absolute quality. Seeing Thiago taking on an imperious Kroos and Modric just felt like I was watching a different sport.

Arteta could have Messi, Ronaldo and Mbappe and his first instinct would be to respect the opposition. He’s turned us into Everton.

mdgoonah41

posting while it is still 0-0 so i cant be called a reactionary

hes got to fucking go

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