Has Arteta Truly Turned it Around?: Page 242 - The Arsenal discussion forum and community: One More in the Tolly

Has Arteta Truly Turned it Around?

goon

Clrnc wrote:
deardevil wrote:
Arteta inherited the worst squad in memory and it was bolstered by Raul/Kia's signings until we broke that relationship. One that was bad enough to flirt with relegation even if he oversaw that shit show himself. I called it at the time that our squad was shit when people were giddy at signing Willian and pinning their hopes on Pepe.

The point is, the others could easily say the squad inherited the worst manager in memory blablabla. It takes 2 hands to clap. A manager job is to get the best out of the players he has on hand.

Fwiw, my opinion lies somewhere in the middle and not these extreme ends.

When Arteta joined that squad had won something like 6 of it's last 24 league games though, so they wouldn't really have a leg to stand on.

This is what Unai had to say about it:

“But we lost our four captains: [Laurent] Koscielny, [Petr] Cech, [Aaron] Ramsey and [Nacho] Monreal. They were personalities that we missed this season to stay on the right track, and some stars did not have a good attitude and asked for more than what they were giving back.

“Taking all of that into account, we needed time to succeed with our transition to a new Arsenal, which is what I wanted.”

There were reports that Freddie had very similar sentiments.

But you're right, a bit of nuance is required and there's nothing wrong with saying that Arteta under performed which a trash squad. But he's (combined with Hale End) is a big reason why we don't have a trash squad - and he's now performing in line with expectations with it so far.

Mirth

Clrnc wrote:
Think the last few pages has easily the 4 of the top 10 longest posts I have seen on this forum. 😆

😆 If everyone could sign their message with Arteta Good and Arteta Bad it'll be easier for me to keep track what the tone is, particularly when I check in during work

deardevil

goon wrote:
mdgoonah41 wrote:
you keep saying this and i still find it hysterical. all of the non-arteta pets were "jokers" and we had a relegation level squad before arteta started cleaning everything up. its hilarious

Right, I'm sure you thought success was around the corner with Bellerin, Mustafi, Sokratis, Kolasinac, Xhaka, Laca, Luiz, Holding, Ceballos and Ozil before Arteta came and ruined it all.

It's shocking that this is still being contested. Clear proof that the critics are being obtuse and don't have the dignity to admit they got it wrong.

Who in that list are people wishing was still here? Aside from Aubameyang and Ozil in their primes, the rest were trash. Our recruitment between 2015-2020 was the worst I've ever seen. It saw the end of Wenger, Emery and almost Arteta.

Coombs

The Artetahaters are hell bent on being right about something or other. I'm genuinely not sure what they're meant to be right about. The rest of us just want to enjoy our past time despite Arsenal's many failings over the better part of two decades.

At least I can be secure in the knowledge that we're all wrong. Maybe I won't get baited so easily anymore, but I doubt it. I'm writing this stupid post ffs.

Ray

goon wrote:
mdgoonah41 wrote:
you keep saying this and i still find it hysterical. all of the non-arteta pets were "jokers" and we had a relegation level squad before arteta started cleaning everything up. its hilarious

Right, I'm sure you thought success was around the corner with Bellerin, Mustafi, Sokratis, Kolasinac, Xhaka, Laca, Luiz, Holding, Ceballos and Ozil before Arteta came and ruined it all.

We had Leno, Sailba, Tierney, Douzi, Torreira, Martinelli, Saka, Pepe, Auba

These were all high performing or young players we had heavily invested in.

You could literally replace them now with White, Ramsdale, Gabriel, Tomi, Martinelli, Ode, Saka, and they'll go down the same route if we don't deliver results.

The problem has been the results, and unless Arteta delivers top 4, he is in the same bracket (if not worse due to the amount he has spent) than Emery and late year Wenger.

jones

goon wrote:
mdgoonah41 wrote:
you keep saying this and i still find it hysterical. all of the non-arteta pets were "jokers" and we had a relegation level squad before arteta started cleaning everything up. its hilarious

Right, I'm sure you thought success was around the corner with Bellerin, Mustafi, Sokratis, Kolasinac, Xhaka, Laca, Luiz, Holding, Ceballos and Ozil before Arteta came and ruined it all.

Yes, they were all utter shit and if Arteta had not come in to save us from their shitness Arsenal would be playing in League One by now. Managers make no difference to players performances whatsoever, they're just well paid mascots. Pure coincidence that Chelsea last season turned their season from midtable to 4th and CL winners just when Lampard was replaced by Tuchel.

banduan

My mind boggles when comparison is made to Chelsky, who spent a fuckload of dosh onto guys who were already winners before. Sure, I get it, managers matter, but it's not like they're competing in the league right now despite having Ziyech, Lukaku and Saul as benchwarmers,nevermind Werner and Kovacic.

jones

Well how come the same argument isn't made for us who finished on 70 points just months before Emery was sacked?

Mirth already said it, no point in taking this much further. There are two extremes of the manager being absolutely inept and the squad fantastic and vice versa, people including myself are moving on the spectrum sometimes even varying in their own views depending on the point. I think I've watched enough football to say that I've not seen nearly enough attempts to get good football out of the players who were here two years ago but if others think otherwise and there was nothing to salvage fair enough. Moving on

deardevil

Coombs wrote:
The Artetahaters are hell bent on being right about something or other. I'm genuinely not sure what they're meant to be right about. The rest of us just want to enjoy our past time despite Arsenal's many failings over the better part of two decades.

At least I can be secure in the knowledge that we're all wrong. Maybe I won't get baited so easily anymore, but I doubt it. I'm writing this stupid post ffs.

They're trying to save face.

At the start of the season the critics said we'd have a shit season because we spent most of our budget on Ramsdale and White.

Now the critics are saying top four is a minimum expectation because we spent x amount of money.

Then they'll shift the goalposts again to something else so they can be appear right instead of confronting the inaccuracy of their opinions.

AAStyle

Mate I cannot talk for all who think that Arteta should not be here but I am quite sure the majority has always said that top4 is the minimum. Really.

goon

jones wrote:
goon wrote:
Right, I'm sure you thought success was around the corner with Bellerin, Mustafi, Sokratis, Kolasinac, Xhaka, Laca, Luiz, Holding, Ceballos and Ozil before Arteta came and ruined it all.

Yes, they were all utter shit and if Arteta had not come in to save us from their shitness Arsenal would be playing in League One by now. Managers make no difference to players performances whatsoever, they're just well paid mascots. Pure coincidence that Chelsea last season turned their season from midtable to 4th and CL winners just when Lampard was replaced by Tuchel.

Funny how in Arteta's case he replaced Emery who finished 5th with a Europa League final rather, but in Tuchel's case he didn't replace 4th placed Chelsea (with a transfer ban), but a midtable team 😆

Clrnc

One thing I really hate is people saying "they" and "us" instead of everyone here as a whole Arsenal fan.. Absolutely childish and add no value to the discussion.

The majority here is hoping we finish 4th and do well. The rest are just idiotic comments

goon

Agreed.

QuincyAbeyie

I agree more than Goon.

Ricky1985

mdgoonah41 wrote:
Ricky1985 wrote:
I couldn't stand most of the jokers in our squad long befere Arteta arrived. It is such a relief that we have moved pretty much all of them on.

you keep saying this and i still find it hysterical. all of the non-arteta pets were "jokers" and we had a relegation level squad before arteta started cleaning everything up. its hilarious

Whether it's hilarious to you or not, you're saying it was a relegation level squad, not I.

I think it was worth about the number of points it got, give or take for the effect of Arteta's inexperience and the culture of failure that existed at the club.

Regardless, I think Arteta has done a fantastic job of chopping those players from the squad (I don't have to list them to remind you just how many poor and overpaid players we had on our books do I?) whilst adding genuine quality. As a result, we've got a young and exciting squad, champing at the bit to play and win for Arsenal, having cut the wage bill down hugely because we don't have Wenger and his egalitarian approach to wages or amateurs running the club any more.

AAStyle

Quincy Abeyie wrote:
I agree more than Goon.

They dont get it. They are guilty.

lorddulaarsenal

Ricky1985 wrote:
mdgoonah41 wrote:
you keep saying this and i still find it hysterical. all of the non-arteta pets were "jokers" and we had a relegation level squad before arteta started cleaning everything up. its hilarious

Whether it's hilarious to you or not, you're saying it was a relegation level squad, not I.

I think it was worth about the number of points it got, give or take for the effect of Arteta's inexperience and the culture of failure that existed at the club.

Regardless, I think Arteta has done a fantastic job of chopping those players from the squad (I don't have to list them to remind you just how many poor and overpaid players we had on our books do I?) whilst adding genuine quality. As a result, we've got a young and exciting squad, champing at the bit to play and win for Arsenal, having cut the wage bill down hugely because we don't have Wenger and his egalitarian approach to wages or amateurs running the club any more.

I don’t see how people can’t be anything but pleased with the change in dynamic.

Surprised more aren’t buoyed by the recent calibre of recruitment. A few more windows adding players of the level we’ve recently seen come through the door and we’re in a very good place, both in terms of the quality and suitability of players at our disposal and of their future market value potential.

Qwiss

Whatever about if you are pro or anti Arteta I find it really weird the way people compare him positively against Wenger. Especially when Wengers very worst, resignation forcing level is now what some think is a sign of Arteta doing well.

lorddulaarsenal

Think a lot of it comes out of frustration with Wenger. Why he never returned to the Invinvibles blue print I’ll never know

jones

goon wrote:
jones wrote:
Yes, they were all utter shit and if Arteta had not come in to save us from their shitness Arsenal would be playing in League One by now. Managers make no difference to players performances whatsoever, they're just well paid mascots. Pure coincidence that Chelsea last season turned their season from midtable to 4th and CL winners just when Lampard was replaced by Tuchel.

Funny how in Arteta's case he replaced Emery who finished 5th with a Europa League final rather, but in Tuchel's case he didn't replace 4th placed Chelsea (with a transfer ban), but a midtable team 😆

In Arteta's case he replaced a manager who got 70 points and a EL final, Tuchel replaced a manager who got 66 points the season before. You think this looks better for you? Or just overall looking at what happened after those managerial changes, Emery leaving for Villarreal and winning the EL there first try, Tuchel winning the CL and establishing Chelsea as part of the top 3 in England and Arsenal fans still arguing whether the latest false dawn is a real one and why Auba leaving is a win-win situation for everyone.

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