Has Arteta Truly Turned it Around?: Page 114 - The Arsenal discussion forum and community: One More in the Tolly

Has Arteta Truly Turned it Around?

goon

Quincy Abeyie wrote:
The idea that Arsenal fans are supposedly different from fans of every other club is just weird to me.

Fans do differ quite significantly from club to club to be fair. Not convinced we are especially negative though, there’s just been A LOT of negativity to contend with, hence why it’s mostly negative.

speedy

goon wrote:
Quincy Abeyie wrote:
The idea that Arsenal fans are supposedly different from fans of every other club is just weird to me.

Fans do differ quite significantly from club to club to be fair. Not convinced we are especially negative though, there’s just been A LOT of negativity to contend with, hence why it’s mostly negative.

Each club has issues, real fans are ultra shit at times they were really harsh on bale initially. He's fully repaid them now though he doesn't give won't Fook. He's completely****** them over in return.

They used to racially abuse other teams black players and Brazilian Ronaldo would stop trying in games when it happened. But they never learned.

The endless unnecessary hysterical nature of the critism is unique to arsenal.

Ricky1985

Arsenal fans have had it bad in the last decade or so, it's not surprising that at some point patience ran out. A bad combination of extreme success achieved by a near perfect team, the move from Highbury to our corporate bowl,the rapid loss of all those great players and a transition to much inferior players that year by year get worse. And then the groundhog day theme to most of our last 15 or so seasons is enough to make any fan, anywhere go mad.

Also, abuse of players on social media is a bullshit thing to aim at the fans of the club. If players think the 12-year olds or weirdos that post abuse online are the same as fans that go to games or support here locally then they're idiots.

jones

speedy wrote:
goon wrote:
Fans do differ quite significantly from club to club to be fair. Not convinced we are especially negative though, there’s just been A LOT of negativity to contend with, hence why it’s mostly negative.

Each club has issues, real fans are ultra shit at times they were really harsh on bale initially. He's fully repaid them now though he doesn't give won't Fook. He's completely****** them over in return.

They used to racially abuse other teams black players and Brazilian Ronaldo would stop trying in games when it happened. But they never learned.

The endless unnecessary hysterical nature of the critism is unique to arsenal.

How many clubs' fanbases do you compare our fans to? There's absolutely no reason to think we're anything special, we're a massive club with a huge global following, a lot more fans have only an online relation to the club than with other more local clubs in Europe. No difference whatsoever to other EPL clubs who have also become corporate assets with fans changing allegiance, wearing double kits etc, many of them are plastics who just love to bitch and moan because it makes them look critical. For example Eintracht Frankfurt are known for the most vocal support in the German top flight in the ground, 50k lunatics intimidating opposition in the stadium etc but even with them when you go on football boards you see a lot of morons who love to complain even though the club is doing better now than it has in almost 30 years.

Kel Varnsen

@lorddulaarsenal wrote:
I’m one of the few Arteta backers here. Slowly but surely making additions to suit his style. Optimistic we’ll get top four this season.

The problem with Arteta isn't team selections and player signings. The problem is that he's a massive coward and he has the team playing god awful, boring, shit football.

speedy

Ricky1985 wrote:
Arsenal fans have had it bad in the last decade or so, it's not surprising that at some point patience ran out. A bad combination of extreme success achieved by a near perfect team, the move from Highbury to our corporate bowl,the rapid loss of all those great players and a transition to much inferior players that year by year get worse. And then the groundhog day theme to most of our last 15 or so seasons is enough to make any fan, anywhere go mad.

Also, abuse of players on social media is a bullshit thing to aim at the fans of the club. If players think the 12-year olds or weirdos that post abuse online are the same as fans that go to games or support here locally then they're idiots.

Elneny isn't asking the fans on twitter to go easier on him he's asking the fans in the stadium to go easy on him when they come back. Xhaka didn't just tell the fans on twitter to **** off he told the ones in the stadium to after years of abuse. The invincibles is almost 20 years ago if fans are still angry about not having those guys they would probably benifit from having therapist.

speedy

jones wrote:
speedy wrote:
Each club has issues, real fans are ultra shit at times they were really harsh on bale initially. He's fully repaid them now though he doesn't give won't Fook. He's completely****** them over in return.

They used to racially abuse other teams black players and Brazilian Ronaldo would stop trying in games when it happened. But they never learned.

The endless unnecessary hysterical nature of the critism is unique to arsenal.

How many clubs' fanbases do you compare our fans to? There's absolutely no reason to think we're anything special, we're a massive club with a huge global following, a lot more fans have only an online relation to the club than with other more local clubs in Europe. No difference whatsoever to other EPL clubs who have also become corporate assets with fans changing allegiance, wearing double kits etc, many of them are plastics who just love to bitch and moan because it makes them look critical. For example Eintracht Frankfurt are known for the most vocal support in the German top flight in the ground, 50k lunatics intimidating opposition in the stadium etc but even with them when you go on football boards you see a lot of morons who love to complain even though the club is doing better now than it has in almost 30 years.

Even if you campaire us to ManU who had a simular dip, United fans I spoke to oveer the years would be optomistic about the club while arsenal fans i speak to are nearly always venoms against the club.

Gazza M

the notion that Arsenal fans are uniquely toxic or hysteric is laughable. the AFTV ecosystem and its spawn have exacerbated moronic hot take culture on social media, but that's about it. go read redcafe for more than 5 minutes and you'll see theres still a hard-core 'ole out' segment despite their decent run of form under him

speedy

Gazza M wrote:
the notion that Arsenal fans are uniquely toxic or hysteric is laughable. the AFTV ecosystem and its spawn have exacerbated moronic hot take culture on social media, but that's about it. go read redcafe for more than 5 minutes and you'll see theres still a hard-core 'ole out' segment despite their decent run of form under him

Maybe all our recent managers we have just made it up? They all talk about it. Hell emery asked fans to support the players in his leaving letter. Elneny and xhaka probably made it up aswell?

jones

speedy wrote:
Gazza M wrote:
the notion that Arsenal fans are uniquely toxic or hysteric is laughable. the AFTV ecosystem and its spawn have exacerbated moronic hot take culture on social media, but that's about it. go read redcafe for more than 5 minutes and you'll see theres still a hard-core 'ole out' segment despite their decent run of form under him

Maybe all our recent managers we have just made it up? They all talk about it. Hell emery asked fans to support the players in his leaving letter. Elneny and xhaka probably made it up aswell?

https://www.arsenal.com/news/letter-thanks-arsenal

You're talking about this letter from Emery? Where does it say anything of what you're saying? If you're talking about his interview afterwards with Marca he's saying literally the same thing as Wijnaldum.

By and large Arsenal have loads of dumb fans like every other club. Many expect better and are constantly negative, many including here are making excuses to feel better about the club. Nothing remotely special or different to any other club. United fans are exactly the same. City are the most successful club in England and average 20k fans in their ground. Liverpool used to be the same when they were in their drought and are the same again, Wijnaldum was instrumental in them winning the CL two years ago and started for them for years and made half as much as Ox yet he's saying the fans turned on him. You still haven't responded why would we be in any kind or way special or different?

speedy

jones wrote:
speedy wrote:
Maybe all our recent managers we have just made it up? They all talk about it. Hell emery asked fans to support the players in his leaving letter. Elneny and xhaka probably made it up aswell?

https://www.arsenal.com/news/letter-thanks-arsenal

You're talking about this letter from Emery? Where does it say anything of what you're saying? If you're talking about his interview afterwards with Marca he's saying literally the same thing as Wijnaldum.

By and large Arsenal have loads of dumb fans like every other club. Many expect better and are constantly negative, many including here are making excuses to feel better about the club. Nothing remotely special or different to any other club. United fans are exactly the same. City are the most successful club in England and average 20k fans in their ground. Liverpool used to be the same when they were in their drought and are the same again as Wijnaldum testified. You still haven't responded why would we be in any kind or way special or different?

[font=Source Sans Pro]Wijnaldum specifically stated he had nothing but support from the fans in the stadium. That's not what elney and xhaka have received. [/font]

jones

Obviously Pool have been doing a lot better in recent years than we have. Elneny and Xhaka have played for us when we were firmly in the bottom half of the table, if there were fans in the ground last season when Pool were flirting with relegation I'd guarantee the abuse Keita Ox TAA etc have received online would have made it into the grounds.

Again answer the point, what do you think makes us special?

Gazza M

i don't buy that it's unique to arsenal. if players play shite or do daft things like throw the captains armband on the ground, there will be a fan response to it. If a coach leads a team to a horrible run of form for months on end, there will be a fan response to it. i have my own opinions about how much weight modern players put into the opinions on social media, which is a reactionary cesspool. short of death threats or racism, any worthwhile professional should take social media with a grain of salt.

there's also the fact that this club has been sliding and sliding and sliding for almost 10 years now. you wouldn't expect spurs, liverpool, Chelsea, city, united or even Leicester fans to be as chastened as arsenal fans.

Coombs

It doesn't have to be unique to Arsenal to be toxic, though. Who cares what other fans do, we're a bunch of jackals who pounce on every miniscule failing like it's a war crime. Social media has bled into the stadium at Arsenal. It's sad.

speedy

jones wrote:
Obviously Pool have been doing a lot better in recent years than we have. Elneny and Xhaka have played for us when we were firmly in the bottom half of the table, if there were fans in the ground last season when Pool were flirting with relegation I'd guarantee the abuse Keita Ox TAA etc have received online would have made it into the grounds.

Again answer the point, what do you think makes us special?

Everything listed above

AFTV
Every manager struggling to get the fans onside over the last decade and regularly haivng to talk about it.
Fans being hysterical about loaning a youth CB for him to get experiance. Genuinly hysterical.
Abusing our best midfielder for 4-5 years, who else does that?
Not being able to play or players due to the amount of abuse they get form our fans, while we were the 4th richest club coming 4th or higher every single season.
Elneny coming out to ask the fans to go easy on him when they're back, have any other prem clubs had that?

All these things are unique. You might find one or two elsewhere. But you'd struggle to find this shit tornedo elsewhere.

Ray

speedy wrote:
jones wrote:
Obviously Pool have been doing a lot better in recent years than we have. Elneny and Xhaka have played for us when we were firmly in the bottom half of the table, if there were fans in the ground last season when Pool were flirting with relegation I'd guarantee the abuse Keita Ox TAA etc have received online would have made it into the grounds.

Again answer the point, what do you think makes us special?

Everything listed above

AFTV
Every manager struggling to get the fans onside over the last decade and regularly haivng to talk about it.
Fans being hysterical about loaning a youth CB for him to get experiance. Genuinly hysterical.
Abusing our best midfielder for 4-5 years, who else does that?
Not being able to play or players due to the amount of abuse they get form our fans, while we were the 4th richest club coming 4th or higher every single season.
Elneny coming out to ask the fans to go easy on him when they're back, have any other prem clubs had that?

All these things are unique. You might find one or two elsewhere. But you'd struggle to find this shit tornedo elsewhere.

Every club has a fan channel on youtube full of fans complaining. Chelsea, Utd, Liverpool etc, we just happen to have the largest online fanbase which is why we seem the loudest.
Every big club going through struggling players has had difficulty getting fans onside. Fans booing their own players isn't unique to Arsenal, it happens at Chelsea (jorginho, Torres), Utd (Rio), Pool (Lucas, Karius) etc
Every player gets social media abuse, the booing of Xhaka came once after he threw the captains armband and told the fans to f off (not that I agree that he should have been booed). That you mention he is out best midfielder, says a lot about management.
We haven't finished 4th or higher for half a decade unless you haven't noticed. And not sure about the part where we aren't able to play our players (you could argue the same happened at Pool with Agger, Karius, Lucas etc)
Elneny didn't say that, he said he would like to be supported by fans when he has a bad game, pretty much the same thing Wijnaldum just said the other day he hated how the liverpool fans didn't go easy on him.

None of those things are unique to Arsenal.

What is unique to Arsenal is the large fan base on online presence coupled with shit performances.

Qwiss

Didn't Liverpool boo Joe Gomez recently enough? I think they did it to Glenn Johnson too. Plenty of others I'm not remembering right now as well. The idea that fans don't have a go at players at other clubs is absolute houseboat.

Clrnc

It's one of the most unreal suggestions I have seen around here. I mean you are a fan of Arsenal. Of course you can pick many instances of what is happening around us.

Ask any other fans and they can pick similar if not as much examples of it. Just take a look at twitter or red cafe when united lose for e.g. don't even need to note the other foreign clubs with fanatics that will wait outside the training ground with weapons.

Klaus

Qwiss! wrote:
Didn't Liverpool boo Joe Gomez recently enough? I think they did it to Glenn Johnson too. Plenty of others I'm not remembering right now as well. The idea that fans don't have a go at players at other clubs is absolute houseboat.

Yeah, and United fans booed everyone from Fellaini to Ashley Young. Chelsea fans booed Jorginho even though he was statistically the best midfielder in the league because they didn't like Sarri.

I agree that the fact others do it too isn't a good excuse, and there's legitimate criticism to be raised over fan behaviour. Arsenal is not unique in this though.

Qwiss

Yeah I never liked the booing of players like Song, Ramsey and Eboue. I even had a bit of sympathy for Xhaka although throwing the arm band wiped most of that away.

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