• The Arsenal

  • Issa Partey (Might be 'unavailable' for next season)

jones wrote:

Agree the club had no grounds to suspend or sack Partey, people might dismiss this as legal implications but imagine a world where employers are allowed to act on the information provided to them by complete strangers, horrible thought. Also while I've no time for Arteta there's really nothing that links this crime to behaviour the manager asks of his players ie employees of the football club that's paying them.

Footballers aren't really employees, though. They are more like contractors and they have expectations of maintaining a certain profile because they are entertainers who rely on audience support. Partey has become a liability in that regard, and I am sure there are clauses in footballers' contracts addressing that sort of thing. There is no way in which it makes sense to play him, for me.

Most people in this world can be fired on a rumor and a whim. This isn't a house cleaner being falsely accused of stealing or Mads Mikkelsen in that Vinterberg film. It's not such an injustice for this guy, who is getting away with this one on a technicality, to be released from his very lucrative and highly protective contract. Indeed, I would say it's probably the least he deserves.

I'm not suggesting that the club do anything out of the proper order of things, but I do expect them to begin pulling the levers they have available to move things along. That starts with dropping him.

The evidence presented, while not entirely conclusive paints a not-so-good light on Partey really. That's the best I can give him.

While I agree with Jones, especially that the club really have no strong reason to suspend Partey last year, they might need to act now. Before the 2nd victim's allegation is conclusive because we are Arsenal and we do things the right way. It's not very very different from the text messages of Greenwood's missus (minus the voice recordings). Sacking is probably too strong and that goes with the formal charges levied, but suspending or dropping is not that difficult.

If we don't do anything, and also don't sign a CM and the inevitable happens then we deserves everything we get by the end of the season.

You have to assume the club have sought legal advice from lawyers and are just following their guidance.

Just went and read some of her messages today, haven't gone through them all yet but damn, provable or not, it looks really, really bad. The way she is posting feels she's been properly traumatised and I believe what she says happened. At the minimum I have no doubt she believes it, doesn't feel like someone making something up. Partey should be kicked to the kerb, no matter what it means for us.

I’ve been reading the tweets on that account and honestly, if we keep playing this guy I really don’t know what to say. There’s just too much for this to be made up or him being “painted in a bad light”. It’s just shocking, if a guy gets sent away for turning up late a guy who does this should never play for us again.

Yeah, a couple things I read yesterday after the first set of posts from the woman seemed to suggest the matter is a little complicated. I read more of her posts today after she returned to post sober (apparently she said she was posting drunk oast night) and you can't read those posts and not feel the despair and anguish coming out though her words.

Plus there are texts where he quite simply admits what he did. To claim all of this is doctored seems a real stretch to me, especially if she really stands to lose the settlement money by speaking out. If the club knew about all this evidence and did nothing, it’s really disgusting.

JazzG wrote:

Sounds like Arsenal are still backing him, surely they will have looked into these claims and must be confident the charges will be dropped. Or maybe until charges are bought on him the club legally can't suspend him?

The club can suspend or drop him for whatever reason they make up and see fit. This isn't about legal sentencing, it's about morals. Every club gets to choose which values they stand up for. We do it all the time. We draw these silly little lines in the sand that dictate which kind of behaviour is acceptable to us, but when it really comes down to it we won't lift a fucking finger if it might cause economic damage.

We absolutely don't have to be the kind of club that suspends our captain, a bloke who had done more for the club than anyone else on our payroll, simply for arriving on a different time than agreed on to England after visiting his sick mum, while we continue to play and back a rapist just because he got off on a technicality.

We don't have to be the kind of club that sacks 50 people during a pandemic while our owners wealth increase at a higher rate than ever before.

We don't have to be the kind of club that tries to break away from English football by being a driving force behind a European super league.

We don't have to be the kind of club that claims to support human rights but refuses to back Özil when he criticises China's treatment of the Uyghurs, or Elneny when he stands up for the Palestinians. Anything more than a token bent knee before the match whistle and we put out statements to make sure everyone knows that the players views don't align with the club's values.

We don't have to be a lot of things that we currently are. But we choose to be them, and in this case it makes it downright impossible to keep supporting Arsenal at the moment.

There was actually a time when I was proud to support Arsenal because we embodied so many values both on and off the pitch that most other clubs did not. That time is long gone though. The goblins are running the show now, and Arsenal perfectly reflects their image.

Those tweets make me really sit and think about being a football fan in general. With that much money, fame and power, you dread to think how many of them are so narcissistic and dangerous, and get away with the shit Partey is being accused of.

@deffonotchaur

Klaus wrote:

The club can suspend or drop him for whatever reason they make up and see fit. This isn't about legal sentencing, it's about morals. Every club gets to choose which values they stand up for. We do it all the time. We draw these silly little lines in the sand that dictate which kind of behaviour is acceptable to us, and that which is not, but when it really comes down to it we won't lift a fucking finger if it can cause economic harm.

We absolutely don't have to be the kind of club that suspends our captain, a bloke who had done more for the club than anyone else on our payroll, simply for arriving on a different time than agreed on to England after visiting his sick mum, while we continue to play and back a rapist just because he got off on a technicality.

We don't have to be the kind of club that sacks 50 people during a pandemic while our owners wealth increase at a higher rate than ever before.

We don't have to be the kind of club that tries to break away from English football by being a driving force behind a European super league.

We don't have to be the kind of club that claims to support human rights but refuses to back Özil when he criticises China's treatment of the Uyghurs, or Elneny when he stands up for the Palestinians. Anything more than a token bent knee before the match whistle and we put out statements to make sure everyone knows that the players views don't align with the club's values.

We don't have to be a lot of things that we currently are. But we choose to be them, and in this case it makes it downright impossible to keep supporting Arsenal at the moment.

Yeah there are a lot of things wrong with football clubs and Arsenal aren't alone there.

I'm not a lawyer but I think we would open ourselves up for all kinds of trouble if we suspended a player based on an allegation. What if all our players suddenly get accused, do we suspend the whole lot? Do we even know whether the club has carried out any investigations into this?

With all due respect just because you say he's a rapist and think he is one that doesn't make it true. Nor are any of us in any position to pass that judgement on anyone based on the girls tweets.  Has the police confirmed he got off on a technicality or are we taking her words as facts?

What I find quite disturbing is the amount of people who have decided he's either guilty or not guilty. Why don't we let the people who have all the facts at hand decide? As we found out with Depp/Heard recently, trial by social media is not the right way forward.

Shady wrote:

Those tweets make me really sit and think about being a football fan in general. With that much money, fame and power, you dread to think how many of them are so narcissistic and dangerous, and get away with the shit Partey is being accused of.

I remember reading about Fergie encouraging his players to marry and have kids. The more I think about it, he was probably trying to protect his players from this kind of life. In some cases (coughGiggscough) hasn't quite worked out though....

I don't go clubbing but my mates have been out near some PL footballers and they say it is shocking the amount of girls who are willing to throw themselves at these guys. I can imagine for some it creates quite an ego, a feeling of power and entitlement. So it wouldn't surprise you if these guys to abuse their position but on the other hand there are girls who are more than happy to exploit this for fame/money.

Partey was known to be out clubbing a lot in his early days for us, he sure as hell wasn't going out to hook up for a coffee.....With all due respect to Partey, he wasn't gonna pull a girl like that if he wasn't a rich and famous footballer! 

Shady wrote:

Those tweets make me really sit and think about being a football fan in general. With that much money, fame and power, you dread to think how many of them are so narcissistic and dangerous, and get away with the shit Partey is being accused of.

Mourinho said it best. Don’t become a footballer, they’re mostly terrible people.

If she's posting her story on social media whilst the allegations are still being investigated, then it's almost a sure fire way to negate any possibility of any subsequent criminal changes going to trial as a result, because of the same reactions seen here.

Shady wrote:

Those tweets make me really sit and think about being a football fan in general. With that much money, fame and power, you dread to think how many of them are so narcissistic and dangerous, and get away with the shit Partey is being accused of.

I guess due to their sporting talent most of these guys live the kind of lives where from a young age they have never been told "no" to anything. When it happens some of them clearly can't handle or accept it. They just aren't in situations where they get told they can't have what they want.

What Gurgen and Klaus said is pretty much it. We banish arguably a club legend who has done more for the club in recent times than anyone else for arriving back from visiting sick family a bit later than expected even though I understand was still on time for training and any club engagements. Yet still come out today saying this player will continue to be selected. Who is this guy to us anyway? He's had maybe 3 decent games in 2 years and spent most of the rest of that time either in the treatment room or spraying the ball into row Z. His contribution would neither be missed nor even remembered.

We used to be a club with class. Victoria Concordia Crescit and all that.

Come on invis, your claim that 3 of his games for us in his career gave been decent and the rest have been below that is quite frankly ridiculous and you don't usually do those kinds of claims so you probably know this yourself as well.

That being said, excellent as he is, that is irrelevant. These tweets are shocking and as other are saying I hope he's done for us (and that we sign a new midfielder of course). Ricky, I like you as a poster and I hope you read more about this case and come back here with new opinions on the matter because that's what I'd expect from you.

Jazzg, just because he isn't convicted doesn't mean you shouldn't have an opinion about this stuff. It doesn't work that you can just be completely neutral with your thoughts until the court has decided something.

Like others have said, she literally has no reason to lie. If she's lying he can just sue her for defamation and she'll be ruined while if she's teliing the truth he can't do anything about it because of the circumstances she's mentioning about the case. That's why she's spoken up - no matter the outcome if he tries to get out it will contribute to her case in the court of public opinion, the only court that can help.

It was an exaggeration possibly due to shame in feeling in supporting the club at the moment but don't think it could be denied that given the money spent and the expectation, his career for us has been a massive disappointment so far. If he never plays for us again what match or contribution would actually be remembered 5 years from now?

In any case, as you say that's all irrelevant. It's behaviour I would expect to be covered by the "non-negotiables." Sure it didn't happen on club duty but certainly brings the club into disrepute by having its name dragged through the mud. A lot more damaging than arriving back late from visiting sick family does I suspect. Perhaps it will take a sponsor pulling money out for the club to take notice.

JazzG wrote:

@deffonotchaur

Klaus wrote:

The club can suspend or drop him for whatever reason they make up and see fit. This isn't about legal sentencing, it's about morals. Every club gets to choose which values they stand up for. We do it all the time. We draw these silly little lines in the sand that dictate which kind of behaviour is acceptable to us, and that which is not, but when it really comes down to it we won't lift a fucking finger if it can cause economic harm.

We absolutely don't have to be the kind of club that suspends our captain, a bloke who had done more for the club than anyone else on our payroll, simply for arriving on a different time than agreed on to England after visiting his sick mum, while we continue to play and back a rapist just because he got off on a technicality.

We don't have to be the kind of club that sacks 50 people during a pandemic while our owners wealth increase at a higher rate than ever before.

We don't have to be the kind of club that tries to break away from English football by being a driving force behind a European super league.

We don't have to be the kind of club that claims to support human rights but refuses to back Özil when he criticises China's treatment of the Uyghurs, or Elneny when he stands up for the Palestinians. Anything more than a token bent knee before the match whistle and we put out statements to make sure everyone knows that the players views don't align with the club's values.

We don't have to be a lot of things that we currently are. But we choose to be them, and in this case it makes it downright impossible to keep supporting Arsenal at the moment.

Yeah there are a lot of things wrong with football clubs and Arsenal aren't alone there.

I'm not a lawyer but I think we would open ourselves up for all kinds of trouble if we suspended a player based on an allegation. What if all our players suddenly get accused, do we suspend the whole lot? Do we even know whether the club has carried out any investigations into this?

With all due respect just because you say he's a rapist and think he is one that doesn't make it true. Nor are any of us in any position to pass that judgement on anyone based on the girls tweets.  Has the police confirmed he got off on a technicality or are we taking her words as facts?

What I find quite disturbing is the amount of people who have decided he's either guilty or not guilty. Why don't we let the people who have all the facts at hand decide? As we found out with Depp/Heard recently, trial by social media is not the right way forward.

Why can’t we decide that for ourselves? We make judgments all the time. It’s not like we’re sentencing him to jail by doing that. I read this evidence and I simply find it credible. Apart from the fact that I do this for a living, I think I have a right to form an opinion just as you have a right to form yours. Quite frankly I don’t understand how anyone can read this evidence and have a different opinion though. What has been produced are texts with the perpetrator, emails with lawyers, FA, Arsenal, NDAs, doctor’s reports and much more and this evidence is consistent with the story she tells. It’s not just one screenshot and her story. If I was a prosecutor presented with this I’d do a backflip of happiness. In theory it’s possible that all of this is doctored in some big conspiracy to bring him down, but I find that unlikely, especially in light of the fact that there are other allegations against him and that this behaviour does not really seem out of character based on what I’ve read on him.

What I do wonder is why, if it is indeed true that he got off because the UK authorities at the time did not have the competence to pursue crimes committed outside the UK, the case was not transferred to Spain? I understand why she reported it in the UK but you would think there is a way to get him in front of a court for this somewhere. Perhaps extradition would also have been an issue, who knows.

All this also begs the question whether we actually do any background checks before signing players. From reading about his lifestyle and the way he treats women in general, I gather he is a bit of a sociopath and wouldn’t be out of place in the Netflix documentary on Hunter Moore. Surely we could have known this and thought, maybe it’s not a good idea to spend 50m and pay someone hundreds of thousands of pounds a week when there is a significant chance that person may do something incredibly stupid at any moment?