Premier League 19/20: Page 33 - The Arsenal discussion forum and community: One More in the Tolly

Premier League 19/20

Qwiss

Klaus wrote:
Qwiss! wrote:
BTW are we at the point yet where people will stop pretending DeGea is something special?

You wonder if giving him that massive contract is gonna turn out to be another Sanchez mistake by them. I don't think I've ever seen a goalkeeper just drop two levels like that before.

I always thought he was overrated, not that he wasn't really good but he was treated like a once in a generation talent when he probably shouldn't have been, its a lot of pressure and keepers deal badly with that much scrutiny. Just look at how badly most England keepers drop after they get a run in the national team.

Meatwad

i should be enjoying that crystal palace winner, but all it did was traumatize me because i got flashbacks of almunia against eto'o.

Klaus

Qwiss! wrote:
Klaus wrote:
You wonder if giving him that massive contract is gonna turn out to be another Sanchez mistake by them. I don't think I've ever seen a goalkeeper just drop two levels like that before.

I always thought he was overrated, not that he wasn't really good but he was treated like a once in a generation talent when he probably shouldn't have been, its a lot of pressure and keepers deal badly with that much scrutiny. Just look at how badly most England keepers drop after they get a run in the national team.

Yeah I agree, I thought he was a bit overrated too, but still you'd have him as one of the 2-3 best in the league and among the 10 best in Europe on most days. Would he have gotten into Palace's team on merit today though, considering his performances over the last 8-10 months?

MistaT

Klaus wrote:
Bosscielny wrote:
😆

Well played. Bring on next season

😆

More of the same as last year then. The moment we can't hit a team on the counter, we struggle to score. Then a few moments of poor defending and we gift them the game.

jones

United are dogshit, cant stress it enough

They have one quality player in Pogba who their ex players are doing their best to ostracise. Maybe Martial but he looks washed up too and is a sulking dickhead anyway

Then a bunch of non discernible wastemen everywhere, half from their famed horseshit academy which produces these FM regens with literally no remarkable qualities. The other half bought for 50m a piece

To round it off they have an ex-hobbit in charge, easily the league's worst manager and this is a league where somehow Steve Bruce managed to stumble into a job by accident

Glory glory Man United

Ricky1985

City are such a yawn fest

dreamlord

They're pretty damn good.

dreamlord

Sweet freekick

Ricky1985

dreamlord wrote:
They're pretty damn good.

Meh. They're weak in defence and powder puff in midfield, but they have some seriously good/dangerous players in midfield/attack.

Mirth

Ricky1985 wrote:
dreamlord wrote:
They're pretty damn good.

Meh. They're weak in defence and powder puff in midfield, but they have some seriously good/dangerous players in midfield/attack.

But more importantly they're drilled to within an inch of their lives. City over the past couple of years is up there within one of the best Premier league teams of all time.

dreamlord

Ricky1985 wrote:
dreamlord wrote:
They're pretty damn good.

Meh. They're weak in defence and powder puff in midfield, but they have some seriously good/dangerous players in midfield/attack.

They're a bit like the Guardiola Barca in that sense, but like Mirth said, incredibly well trained. Just look at Sterling's goal as an example - he was making his run 2 passes before the ball was even played to him.

Ricky1985

Mirth wrote:
Ricky1985 wrote:
Meh. They're weak in defence and powder puff in midfield, but they have some seriously good/dangerous players in midfield/attack.

But more importantly they're drilled to within an inch of their lives. City over the past couple of years is up there within one of the best Premier league teams of all time.

I've had this debate a thousand times on here, so I don't want get into it again, but, no, I don't agree. They have an incredible squad, the deepest by far that the Premier League has ever seen, and I think people confuse record points totals with having a great XI or them being a great team.

In my opinion, Liverpool's best XI plays Man City's best XI, and Liverpool win more out of 10 than they lose.

goon

Agree to an extent, but you can’t argue with how well drilled they are, just watch them off the ball, it’s unreal. Theres a reason why despite having a shit defence and an attack minded midfield they rarely concede chances.

Ricky1985

dreamlord wrote:
Ricky1985 wrote:
Meh. They're weak in defence and powder puff in midfield, but they have some seriously good/dangerous players in midfield/attack.

They're a bit like the Guardiola Barca in that sense, but like Mirth said, incredibly well trained. Just look at Sterling's goal as an example - he was making his run 2 passes before the ball was even played to him.

I agree they're well coached, but good players like Sterling and Silva will do that in their sleep regardless.

At one time, no one would have had the temerity to argue against Wenger being an incredible coach based on the combination football the Invincibles produced. It turns out those amazing patterns we saw were produced spontaneously by players with superstar technique and awareness. Wenger's genius was in enabling the players to express themselves.

Guardiola has always said his job is to get the players to the final third and then it's over to them. So I'm not sure he's a million miles from Wenger in that respect.

Ricky1985

goon wrote:
Agree to an extent, but you can’t argue with how well drilled they are, just watch them off the ball, it’s unreal. Theres a reason why despite having a shit defence and an attack minded midfield they rarely concede chances.

They should have conceded about 3 or 4 to a nothing Bournemouth side today.

But, yes, their tiki-taka, put you to sleep, sideways possession that makes up 85% of what they do, does reduce the strain on their shakey defence.

dreamlord

Ricky1985 wrote:
I agree they're well coached, but good players like Sterling and Silva will do that in their sleep regardless.

Yeah but Sterling wasn't doing anything close to this at Liverpool. Obviously you can't quantify how much of his development is just natural or due to playing regularly and how much of it is coaching, but everyone credits Wenger for making Fabregas into what he was at his peak.

jones

No way does Liverpool win more games vs City than vice versa. Pool have massively overachieved last season, expect them to rack up a good ten points less this year. City have amassed 198 points in two seasons one of which they were missing their best player for like 70% of the time. Not sure how they would fare head to head against the Invincibles or 05 Chelsea but they have a very good shout of being the best ever English team.

Ricky1985

dreamlord wrote:
Ricky1985 wrote:
I agree they're well coached, but good players like Sterling and Silva will do that in their sleep regardless.

Yeah but Sterling wasn't doing anything close to this at Liverpool. Obviously you can't quantify how much of his development is just natural or due to playing regularly and how much of it is coaching, but everyone credits Wenger for making Fabregas into what he was at his peak.

Arteta has no doubt some good individual work with Sterling, but that isn't the point in question.

I also think it's under appreciated how much a good player will improve as he moves towards his peak, and Sterling was clearly a very good good player even when being fully thrown in at 17 years old at Liverpool.

Mirth

Ricky1985 wrote:
dreamlord wrote:
They're a bit like the Guardiola Barca in that sense, but like Mirth said, incredibly well trained. Just look at Sterling's goal as an example - he was making his run 2 passes before the ball was even played to him.

I agree they're well coached, but good players like Sterling and Silva will do that in their sleep regardless.

At one time, no one would have had the temerity to argue against Wenger being an incredible coach based on the combination football the Invincibles produced. It turns out those amazing patterns we saw were produced spontaneously by players with superstar technique and awareness. Wenger's genius was in enabling the players to express themselves.

Guardiola has always said his job is to get the players to the final third and then it's over to them. So I'm not sure he's a million miles from Wenger in that respect.

Sure, but it's about bringing the right type of superstar players together that compliment each other otherwise you end up with what happened at United or PSG. Guardiola's pretty much done broadly the same thing at Barcelona, Bayern and now City in terms of imposing an identity on a team and getting them to play in a particular way so I can't really agree with you. But both Liverpool and City are incredible teams at the moment

Claudius

jones wrote:
No way does Liverpool win more games vs City than vice versa. Pool have massively overachieved last season, expect them to rack up a good ten points less this year. City have amassed 198 points in two seasons one of which they were missing their best player for like 70% of the time. Not sure how they would fare head to head against the Invincibles or 05 Chelsea but they have a very good shout of being the best ever English team.

I would put my money behind this.
If you follow Guardiola for the last decade, what sets him apart despite his access to abundance, is an ability to get his teams to consistently perform at a high level.
I would be surprised if Pool repeat that 97 point total whereas near dominance is the norm for Pep.

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