I'm on board. He's talented and can plug the ramsey void. We need dynamism and sm technical ability through the middle. Maybe he sticks around ala kovacic

Gazza M wrote:

I'm on board. He's talented and can plug the ramsey void. We need dynamism and sm technical ability through the middle. Maybe he sticks around ala kovacic

I agree.  He gives us what our other midfielders do not have - good close control, and an ability to carry the ball. Also a really good passer of the ball. Can also potentially strike the ball from range. I loved his goal early on from outside the box against Italy in the U21s 

Ornstein reckons we're after a box to box, does he fit that profile?

goon wrote:

Ornstein reckons we're after a box to box, does he fit that profile?

He's an 8, not a box-to-box. He's a very technically gifted player. Even though I mentioned Ramsey, he's not going to replicate some of Ramsey's attributes of getting into the box and scoring. He didn't score tons of goals before but that might be a result of not playing as much.
Rather, he is going to get on the ball and dictate play. He is a very good passer with an extremely high passing percentage, and a very high number of completed passes into the final third. So he's a proper playmaker, the kind we haven't had since Cazorla maybe. If you look at our midfield and its inability to retain the ball or to distribute from the middle, this is the guy who would solve this. So the type of role people were saying Iwobi should move inside and do, he would do much better.

Sort of I guess. He plays like Fornals but he is the better player. By the way he is definitely an upgrade on Ramsey and fits Emery's style.

Wonder if we can ask Madrid for Jesús Vallejo while we are at it.

That sounds really positive actually, hopefully that means we're planning to play with the ball a little more this season.

He's a Falangist little piece of shit Iniesta clone. I'd knock his teeth out in the street but if he wears red and white next season I'll be Roman saluting him from the stands

i'll be honest, ive never really watched him play because i dont watch real madrid. but heres his welcome to arsenal video on the tube

looks like a rich man's denis suarez

Plays nothing like Suarez, far more risk taking and direct. Different level talent wise too

Denis Suarez was an abomination

mdgoonah41 wrote:

i'll be honest, ive never really watched him play because i dont watch real madrid. but heres his welcome to arsenal video on the tube

I've also only watched his highlights so this does not carry much weight but i hope Emery removes some playmaking duties from Xhaka by playing him centrally.

------Ceballos-Torreira-Guendouzi
Malcom----------------------------Everton

Completely new midfield.

jones wrote:

Plays nothing like Suarez, far more risk taking and direct. Different level talent wise too

tbh i just wanted to mention denis suarez so no one forgets that arsenal legend

might as well mention Kallstrom while you're at it

Mariano Diaz can be our Origi

Claudius wrote:

might as well mention Kallstrom while you're at it

much respect for the swede

Good player but we still need a Docoure

Almost a carbon copy of Ramsey except a better striker of the ball.

I just watched that highlight reel that MDGoonah posted. The video is deceptive and overweights the goalmouth action.
Typically in La Liga, he's a playmaking hub. He was used sparingly by both Solari and Zidane, starting about 1 in 3 games. But he still managed to average about 45 passes a game versus 55 a game for Modric. He was constantly getting past men with the ball and making penetrative passes but rarely looking for the shot.
In the U21 Euros, however, where he was Alpha male, in all the games he played he led in most offensive categories (completed passes, shots on target, etc).
The question I have is how do you deploy him when you have Ozil? Ceballos is not a traditional 10. He plays deeper. Do you play them together and then only have Torreira? A better balance might be Torreira, Guendouzi, Ceballos

What's funny is old Tottenham would've sold Eriksen to Madrid and tried to take this guy as part of the deal. Now they probably feel above it. We need to put them back in their place.

He’d be a good addition. I’m sure if he does well he’d be up for signing for us. Madrid will want a glitz n glamour midfielder instead anyways

Claudius wrote:

I just watched that highlight reel that MDGoonah posted. The video is deceptive and overweights the goalmouth action.
Typically in La Liga, he's a playmaking hub. He was used sparingly by both Solari and Zidane, starting about 1 in 3 games. But he still managed to average about 45 passes a game versus 55 a game for Modric. He was constantly getting past men with the ball and making penetrative passes but rarely looking for the shot.
In the U21 Euros, however, where he was Alpha male, in all the games he played he led in most offensive categories (completed passes, shots on target, etc).
The question I have is how do you deploy him when you have Ozil? Ceballos is not a traditional 10. He plays deeper. Do you play them together and then only have Torreira? A better balance might be Torreira, Guendouzi, Ceballos

If he is as good in the premiership as he is in those highlights Ozil and Mkhi are not needed.
I also agree that we would need someone who can defend in Xhaka's position but i would prefer someone who doesn't flop all the time like Guendouzi.

I think we'll continue to see a 3-5-2, with Xhaka anchoring a midfield while two of Douzi, Torreira, Willock and (potentially) Ceballos play ahead as CMs.

Claudius wrote:

The question I have is how do you deploy him when you have Ozil? 

On the pitch. Unlike Özil who will hopefully be in a different country.

Bold Tone wrote:

Claudius wrote:

I just watched that highlight reel that MDGoonah posted. The video is deceptive and overweights the goalmouth action.
Typically in La Liga, he's a playmaking hub. He was used sparingly by both Solari and Zidane, starting about 1 in 3 games. But he still managed to average about 45 passes a game versus 55 a game for Modric. He was constantly getting past men with the ball and making penetrative passes but rarely looking for the shot.
In the U21 Euros, however, where he was Alpha male, in all the games he played he led in most offensive categories (completed passes, shots on target, etc).
The question I have is how do you deploy him when you have Ozil? Ceballos is not a traditional 10. He plays deeper. Do you play them together and then only have Torreira? A better balance might be Torreira, Guendouzi, Ceballos

If he is as good in the premiership as he is in those highlights Ozil and Mkhi are not needed.
I also agree that we would need someone who can defend in Xhaka's position but i would prefer someone who doesn't flop all the time like Guendouzi.

Presuming we play with 2CMs could we look to play Torreira as the deeper CM and then have Ceballos in the 2nd CM position with a role allowing him to go forward to support the attack - much like we saw from Fabregas alongside Flamini in 07/08?  Could we set up like we did then with a 442 selection playing in the 4231 configuration?  

Anzac wrote:

Presuming we play with 2CMs could we look to play Torreira as the deeper CM and then have Ceballos in the 2nd CM position with a role allowing him to go forward to support the attack - much like we saw from Fabregas alongside Flamini in 07/08?

Doubt it. There was only one midfielder last season who played all the time regardless of which formation Emery used, and that was Xhaka. We still haven't replaced him so expect him to start yet another season. Ceballos is probably being brought in to play in place of one of Torreira and Özil, depending on the mood.

Klaus wrote:

Anzac wrote:

Presuming we play with 2CMs could we look to play Torreira as the deeper CM and then have Ceballos in the 2nd CM position with a role allowing him to go forward to support the attack - much like we saw from Fabregas alongside Flamini in 07/08?

Doubt it. There was only one midfielder last season who played all the time regardless of which formation Emery used, and that was Xhaka. We still haven't replaced him so expect him to start yet another season. Ceballos is probably being brought in to play in place of one of Torreira and Özil, depending on the mood.

So essentially what Rambo did as either CM or AM?

Probably. Though if Guendouzi continues his development he should be ready for more responsibility, or rather, maybe he is ready for the responsibility he got last season.

Not sure we need this guy. Don't want him taking Willock's minutes then go back to Real Madrid.

What's the point of bringing someone on loan? Are we really that skint that we can't buy anyone? Realise the budget is lower without CL but why can even West Ham can make 45 million pound signings?

Mainly because they have more wiggle room and no single player eating up close to £20m in wages like we do with fucking Ozil. We are poorly run and have a load of under-performing assets on high wages hence our predicament.

Am interested to see how our 18/19 accounts look - not pretty would be my guess.

invisibleman18 wrote:

What's the point of bringing someone on loan? Are we really that skint that we can't buy anyone? Realise the budget is lower without CL but why can even West Ham can make 45 million pound signings?

It's the total player cost that gives a false impression.

For example, Haller will probably earn _£50k/week at West Ham. £45m + £2.5m/year wages, on a 5 year contract = £11.5m added to West Ham's annual player cost.

Whereas a free transfer earning £200k/week = £10m/year. So Dani Alves, for example, whom many want us to sign as our back-up right back, would cost us £10m for the year.

And the big problem, as we know, is we have huge annual player costs already. That of a Champions League club. Aubameyang, for example, costs the club somewhere around £30m/year.

Obviously, exactly how a deal is structured in reality is a factor, too. I doubt West Ham are paying more than £10-20m up front, though, and there's a good chance a chunk of the £45m is made up of performance related bonuses that might never be met as well.

That's a false impression Ricky. When you look at how deals are reported, that's very close to how they are often structured. It's very unlikely that the income statement amortisation reflects the cashflow. So for the West Ham deal

Income statement amortisation - will be exactly as you say. Haller will be 45m + 2.5m*5 = 57,5m. Which is £11,5m annual cost
Of that, £9m / year will face an 18-19% tax Shield. Ie., by reporting it, West Ham will save about £2m in taxes per year
This stuff above is not real money. It's for reporting purposes

Cash flow. - will depend on the deal structure.

• Salary portion will be exactly the same £2.5m per year
• Fee portion. The £45m (excluding bonuses) might be broken out in 3 years like £35m, £5m, £5m. But most of the guaranteed money will typically be upfront in most deals. It's the bonus money that typically ends up trailing.
  This is the real money. What West Ham actually pay Haller, Frankfurt and agent Jones

Jed wrote:

Not sure we need this guy. Don't want him taking Willock's minutes then go back to Real Madrid.

Lol you are taking the piss. He is 4 times the player Willock is currently as good as he was in the friendly just now. 

invisibleman18 wrote:

What's the point of bringing someone on loan? Are we really that skint that we can't buy anyone? Realise the budget is lower without CL but why can even West Ham can make 45 million pound signings?

because they don't have ozil, aubameyang, lacazette, and mkhitaryan already on their books

Clrnc wrote:

Jed wrote:

Not sure we need this guy. Don't want him taking Willock's minutes then go back to Real Madrid.

Lol you are taking the piss. He is 4 times the player Willock is currently as good as he was in the friendly just now. 

Even if he was (which I doubt), do you want to develop the guy for Real Madrid or develop our own talents instead?