Wilfried Zaha: Page 5 - The Arsenal discussion community: One More in the Tolly

Wilfried Zaha

Mirth

Claudius wrote:
Did you guys watch Barca Cesc? The guy was butter. He just had issues owning a position amongst Iniesta, Xavi and Messi. But within those constraints he was every bit as good as the player we saw here. This Cesc sucked at Barca narrative belongs on Fox News.

In my opinion, Cesc peaked in 2006-2008 - even by the time he left Arsenal, we'd fashioned him into a number 10 hybrid that made him a match winner but a lesser footballer. Maybe it's a personal preference but for those two years prior to Hleb and Flamini leaving, Fabregas pretty much dominated every single midfield through pure technique. I haven't seen many players do that at such a young age.

Moving him further forward made him lose that side of his game (although he briefly recaptured it for a few months at Chelsea).

Anzac

Mirth wrote:
Claudius wrote:
Did you guys watch Barca Cesc? The guy was butter. He just had issues owning a position amongst Iniesta, Xavi and Messi. But within those constraints he was every bit as good as the player we saw here. This Cesc sucked at Barca narrative belongs on Fox News.

In my opinion, Cesc peaked in 2006-2008 - even by the time he left Arsenal, we'd fashioned him into a number 10 hybrid that made him a match winner but a lesser footballer. Maybe it's a personal preference but for those two years prior to Hleb and Flamini leaving, Fabregas pretty much dominated every single midfield through pure technique. I haven't seen many players do that at such a young age.

Moving him further forward made him lose that side of his game (although he briefly recaptured it for a few months at Chelsea).

Point being that he did so as a CM and not as CAM.
Whilst his goals as CAM were invaluable the reality was that by moving him AW undermined the midfield and team for the next decade as he never got it sorted. IMO the perfect opportunity to rectify that error was when he signed AA, but he then played him wide instead of CAM and moving Fabregas back to CM. The issue could/should have been sorted within the first season but AW knew better.

Klaus

Mirth wrote:
Moving him further forward made him lose that side of his game (although he briefly recaptured it for a few months at Chelsea).

I don't think we wanted to do it to be fair. Cesc just evolved that way as a footballer and you couldn't really shoehorn him into a midfield base after a certain point. Guardiola and Mourinho failed to get him to play in central midfield too. They couldn't use him there in the national team either.

To be honest, bloke had one of the best final balls in the world so I get why he wanted to play further forward. I never thought it made him a lesser player. It made him a lesser midfielder for sure, but he was effectively a forward and not a CM from around 2009 and onwards - and a good one too. Like most special players he needed special partners though. Matic at Chelsea worked out for a brief time. This was back when Matic played like Ngolo Kante with the technique of De Bruyne despite being built like Sol Campbell. He was absolutely unplayable the year Chelsea won Premier League with Mourinho.

Mirth

Yep, and in fairness, Barcelona went with that approach as well to the detriment of their own team.

Bring Back Kerrea Gilbert

Absolutely. Wasn't a fan of his game from 2009 onwards.

Clrnc

The way Mourinho used him the first year he went back to Chelsea was perfect. Sitting deep and spreading passes around while having another DM cover your ass. He is best as a DLP, average as a number 10 and ineffective as false 9.

I agree that the fee we got for him is pathetic though considering he was one of the best out there. Not to mention we allowed Barca to pay in installments.

Rohit

Calling Cesc an average player in his time with us in which ever position is a bit much in my opinion. He moved further up to cover for his defensive weakness, harness his goal scoring potential and take full advantage of his final ball. We did all of that. It's not his fault that we persisted with Denilson, Diaby and Song behind him.

Ray

Modric went to Madrid a year later for more or less the same fee.

ohboy

Ray wrote:
Modric went to Madrid a year later for more or less the same fee.

Yes, but you couldn’t compare Cesc and Modric at all. Modric has been a good player, but he never dominated big games for Spurs, never ever was anyone scared of him running a match.

Cesc ran games for us regularly.

At both of their times of leaving, Cesc had done far more in the Premier League than Modric.

naz

fresh off the presses: https://www.skysports.com/football/news/32461/11752748/arsenal-launch-40m-bid-for-crystal-palace-forward-wilfried-zaha

Clrnc

Hahaha great banter of a bid

Don Pacifico

I'm already getting WhatsApp trolled over this...

Embarrassing unless Raul knows something we don't about Palace's willingness to sell. Would worry that even at this price, we're looking to shift one of our big players (ie. Aubameyang or Xhaka).

Gunner89

If a fair valuation is 60m then 40m is a decent base to start from.

ohboy

Don Pacifico wrote:
I'm already getting WhatsApp trolled over this...

Embarrassing unless Raul knows something we don't about Palace's willingness to sell. Would worry that even at this price, we're looking to shift one of our big players (ie. Aubameyang or Xhaka).

I have been murdered on WhatsApp before I even knew we made the bid 😆

Xhaka out is fine, but if we sell Aubameyang to bring in Zaha, then we might as well give up now.

goon

I actually think £40m is closer to being a fair valuation than 60m. I'm not sure I'd even go for Zaha at that price, but I certainly wouldn't go any higher unless it's in the form of performance related add-ons. If Palace don't want to sell for less than £80m or something equally ridiculous that's on them.

mdgoonah41

maybe they want mkh and mustafi too in a player swap? those 2 are valued at £60m*

lmao

Bring Back Kerrea Gilbert

Porny has spoken.

Gazza M

Don Pacifico wrote:
I'm already getting WhatsApp trolled over this...

Embarrassing unless Raul knows something we don't about Palace's willingness to sell. Would worry that even at this price, we're looking to shift one of our big players (ie. Aubameyang or Xhaka).

Looks like we're banking on zahas camp to force palace to the table. Could work, or could backfire hugely

Give them mkhi, musti, + 40m

QuincyAbeyie

Bring Back Kerrea Gilbert wrote:
Porny has spoken.

And..?

goon

Gazza M wrote:
Don Pacifico wrote:
I'm already getting WhatsApp trolled over this...

Embarrassing unless Raul knows something we don't about Palace's willingness to sell. Would worry that even at this price, we're looking to shift one of our big players (ie. Aubameyang or Xhaka).

Looks like we're banking on zahas camp to force palace to the table. Could work, or could backfire hugely

Classic Sanllehi Barca tactics. Just need Auba and Laca to force an Arsenal shirt on him.

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