General Football 16/17: Page 35 - The Arsenal discussion forum and community: One More in the Tolly

General Football 16/17

goon

If it's being observed it should be observed properly.

I kinda agree with Jones though, football only seems to want to show solidarity for these events when they occur in the West. It's understandable to a large degree for various reasons. But if you're an Arsenal fan in Iran, Iraq or Afghanistan and witness hudnrends of your people die in a terror attack and no one even blinks, yet he moment someone dies in the US or France you see a mins silence being held, how do you feel?

flobaba

Exactly what I'm talking about in the Manchester bombing thread goon.

jones

I don't care why the Saudi players didn't do it. Some might fear the public repercussions back home of joining the "enemy" in their prayers, some others might not have known what it's for as van Marwijk claims and some actually might simply be cunts who don't value Australian lives. None of it matters.

It's not wrong of course to show respect but it's inherently politicising the dead. It's tragic that two Australians died in the UK but there's a very specific reason for the minute of silence for them and it shouldn't involve football.

Ray

UEFA set the precedent when they refused a minutes silence for the attack in Istanbul, because it wasn't "directly related" to football.

arsedocmd

pretty sure it's cos they all rich dudes with zero concept of these token minute silences for respect or whatever. You wouldn't do something you don't understand.

Asterix

The Aussies asked the Saudis to participate before the game and they apparently agreed, but it seems they don't culturally line up and stand still. Nearly all players at least stood still. Saudi supporters in the crowd stood up and observed the silence.

http://www.smh.com.au/sport/soccer/socceroos-vs-saudi-arabia-minute-of-silence-before-world-cup-qualifier-not-in-keeping-with-saudi-culture-20170608-gwnphs.html

http://theworldgame.sbs.com.au/article/2017/06/09/saudi-arabia-causes-controversy-appearing-ignore-minutes-silence

The Saudi FA has also apologised for seeming to give offence.

However I've also seen articles showing the Saudis observing a minute's silence at football games to mark the passing of members of their royal family.

A bit of a storm in a teacup, fuelled by self righteous media looking to stoke up some ratings. Shocking.

Asterix

Anyway, of more interest to me was how shit the Aussies were in the first half before getting their act together. The Saudis were excellent technically on the ball but had some horrendous moments in defence. The Aussies had leaden first touches and no awareness in passing the ball, but luckily our "star" players stepped up when needed.

Check out the first goal below. The poor keeper will be having nightmares.

http://theworldgame.sbs.com.au/video/962697283910/Australia-v-Saudi-Arabia

Japan, Saudi and Australia are now all equal on 16 points in the group, with the Aussies third on goal difference. We were denied as nailed on a penalty as you'll ever see in the second half which, if scored would have put us second on goal difference. But we have ourselves to blame due to going to sleep defensively in this game and others. We drew with Thailand for goodness sake.

This group will go down to the wire. We need a point against Japan in Japan at the end of August, and to then thrash Thailand in early September. The Saudis travel to the UAE and then host Japan, who may well be qualified by that point and will wilt in the extreme heat of a late Saudi summer.

arsedocmd

Thanks for clearing that up Asterix. Didn't seem much of an issue on first viewing anyways, they did seem quiet and still, just not in a huddle.
If you don't mind me asking, who are the big players in Aus team these days? I mean, someone playing in europe. Is Mark Viduka still playing?

Gazza M

arsedoc md wrote:
Thanks for clearing that up Asterix. Didn't seem much of an issue on first viewing anyways, they did seem quiet and still, just not in a huddle.
If you don't mind me asking, who are the big players in Aus team these days? I mean, someone playing in europe. Is Mark Viduka still playing?

we don't have many household names. probably rogic, mooy, jedinak, and the aged husk of tim cahill. the days of kewell and viduka are long gone

asterix - how terrible was jedinak? he looked drunk out there. the saudis ran rings around us at times

Asterix

We don't have much really. Tom Rogic is at Celtic and scored a last minute winner for them in the FA Cup Final against Aberdeen. Aaron Mooy is on the books for Man City but spent the season on loan at Huddersfield. he was voted their player of the season in helping them to promotion. his future is uncertain, but several lower table Premier League clubs are interested. He is a play making central midfielder from a bit deeper.

We also have Jackson Irvine who has had a great season in midfield for Burton Albion - I think he might have been their top scorer with 10 or 11 from midfield and helping them stay up. Some of the bigger Championship clubs are interested in him. Mile Jedinak is at Villa now, and we have a central defender - Bailey Wright - at Bristol City. Massimo Luongo is at QPR and played most of the season. A couple of Premier League clubs are supposedly interested.

Tim Cahill is still in the squad but not playing much any more at age 37. Our best striker at the moment is Tomi Juric. He's at Luzern and has just had his first decent run without injuries for a while. He's a natural finisher who can head and shoot well, but lacks a bit of pace.

Trent Sainsbury just made his debut at CB for Inter, but he's on loan from a Chinese club who own a piece of Inter. He's probably not at that level but is a decent defender.

We have a few players in Germany - Matt Leckie got relegated with Ingolstadt but has been bought by Hertha Berlin who want to convert him to a wing back. He has pace but not great technical ability. We have a pacy young striker called Jamie McClaren who has just been signed by Darmstadt for next season.

Our reserve keeper Mitch Langerak is the first choice keeper at VfB Stuttgart. Our regular keeper is Mat Ryan who is on Valencia's books but has been on loan at Genk. We also have Brad Jones who was a reserve keeper at Liverpool but has just won the Eredivise with Feyenoord. He's 35 though and isn't being picked for the Socceroos.

We have quite a few players spread across Denmark, Holland, Austria, Turkey - leagues like that.

So we have plenty of players at a second tier level but no stand out stars. Ten years ago was our golden generation with Kewell, Cahill, Lucas Neill, Brett Emerton, Marco Bresciano, Vince Grella, John Aloisi, Viduka - all playing in the Premier League, Serie A or La Liga.

if you want to read further here's how all the overseas based Aussies went this season.

http://theworldgame.sbs.com.au/article/2017/06/07/how-overseas-aussies-performed-season

Asterix

Gazza M wrote:
arsedoc md wrote:
Thanks for clearing that up Asterix. Didn't seem much of an issue on first viewing anyways, they did seem quiet and still, just not in a huddle.
If you don't mind me asking, who are the big players in Aus team these days? I mean, someone playing in europe. Is Mark Viduka still playing?

we don't have many household names. probably rogic, mooy, jedinak, and the aged husk of tim cahill. the days of kewell and viduka are long gone

asterix - how terrible was jedinak? he looked drunk out there. the saudis ran rings around us at times

My 17 year old son has better touch than him and Leckie. Our most common comment watching the game last night was "oh for fuck's sake control the ball".

Irishgunner

The match was in Australia, the Queen is Australia's head of state, and 2 Australians died. In what world is it unreasonable to ask for a minute of silence?

Clrnc

In any case, Saudi's FA has apologised and admitted as much that their behaviour was unacceptable.

Asterix wrote:
Japan, Saudi and Australia are now all equal on 16 points in the group, with the Aussies third on goal difference. We were denied as nailed on a penalty as you'll ever see in the second half which, if scored would have put us second on goal difference. But we have ourselves to blame due to going to sleep defensively in this game and others. We drew with Thailand for goodness sake.

This group will go down to the wire. We need a point against Japan in Japan at the end of August, and to then thrash Thailand in early September. The Saudis travel to the UAE and then host Japan, who may well be qualified by that point and will wilt in the extreme heat of a late Saudi summer.

It would be pretty easy against Thailand. They have lost their inspirational coach and is in shambles at the moment.

Saudi has 2 very tricky games left, if Australia don't get the automatic spot it would take a really poor effort.

y va marquer

Irish gunner wrote:
The match was in Australia, the Queen is Australia's head of state, and 2 Australians died. In what world is it unreasonable to ask for a minute of silence?

A world where these type of customs and traditions are seen as political and divisive acts.
The polarisation continues.

Been at countless games where a minutes silence has been observed for anyone from a granny of a cousin twice removed from an uncle of a county club member to a father of one of the senior team players.
It's a tradition that's endured for years, it's based on the premise that people supporting the club or county are like members of an extended family and come together in times of grief.
Maybe it's moreso a rural Ireland thing where funerals, wakes and public grieving are an integral part of daily life.
Point being it's about including people, supporting people, looking out for people as opposed to excluding people.
Supporters from other clubs or counties always observe the silence, it's not that anyone feigns grief or dismay, they just show respect.
There is something incredibly moving about complete silence in a stadium packed with people.
Though it's certainly true that it's not observed as well these days which is pretty shabby.

Point of all the above being that I would see the observation of silence at national games as an extension of this tradition.

Tony Montana

Silence at funerals/wakes etc. is a very western thing.

Irishgunner

Olly G you legend, what a strike!!

Clrnc

Giroud just missed an absolute sitter from close range, then from the next corner scored a supreme volley. 😆

Watching this match makes me agree with Giroud's comments few days ago. With Mendy and Sidibe's crossing quality he is the ideal man to have up front.

Klaus

Better quality:

Clrnc

Tiring to watch Sweden play, is like watching Burnley or something. They are so limited. Defensively decent but nothing in creativity in attack. This is probably the first time in like 30 years they don't have a single decent striker?

Klaus

There was a while when Ibrahimovic took a timeout from the national team I think, but yeah. It's right in line with the general decline of strikers in Europe.

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