UK Politics Omnishambles: Page 137 - The Arsenal discussion forum and community: One More in the Tolly

UK Politics Omnishambles

JazzG

Burnwinter If there is to be a public enquiry then it should take into account the factors that caused this crime to become a week long, nationwide spectacle of race riots.

I agree that it should be looked at how they hijacked these murders to push their own views. I don't disagree with much of your post either but my point is when the murders happened there was imo an information vacuum which these groups you listed then exploited. The independent terrorism watchdog has said similar. I hope this inquiry does look into this point as well.

Mirth Spot on and I think another issue which people don't realise is how the big name developers game the system. Smaller developers end up getting stuck in the planning system, delays and planning inspectors who literally don't give a flying fuck. The big guys have a direct line to the main council bosses, so when they want to put pressure on planning inspectors and the planning committee these big bosses do that job for them. Some of their garbage bigger schemes get a fast VIP lane to approval. Whereas smaller developers end up getting chewed apart by the system which has been weaponised by NIMBYs. The whole planning system is completely rotten and needs a complete overhaul.

JazzG

I really like some of the things on this thread and Labour have got the numbers to do many of these things. Whether they have the will is another matter.

JazzG

Labour government have been doing most things wrong but this much more like it. These stations needs to be fast tracked and built like it is a national emergency, that is our pathway to clean and cheap electricity not these wind and solar farms, those are just bonus extras.

Cheap energy is how we can attempt to alleviate the huge energy bill costs that consumers pay and hopefully recover and bring back all the industrial sector losses.

JazzG

The budget has been a complete disaster, growth will probably be non-existent, businesses will be feeling the pinch and laying off staff and stopping expansion, benefits will probably go up as people are laid off and a large chunk of the extra money raised has already been wiped out with borrowing cost. I'm not entirely sure these tax increases will even generate the kind of money they thought they would, as growth grinds to a halt tax revenue will also drop.

The surprising thing is a very hawkish member of the panel who usually doesn't vote for cuts was calling for 0.5%. Things are not healthy or well in our economy.

awooga83

JazzG the UK economy has been in a bad place since 2008 with trends of poor growth throughout with headwinds that were never realistically going to be able to be addressed with one budget. If you think you are going to be able to course correct 15 years worth of under investment with 1 budget you probably need to manage your expectations.

Add into that mix a new US administration potentially looking to initiate trade tariff and unknown impact to the economy everything gets a lot more volatile and uncertain on a global scale. 1 budget from the government is a drop in the ocean in the scheme of things and unlikely to change much shorter term. To achieve real improvements will need medium to longer term strategy and commitments and the ability to see it through otherwise you'll just continue on the path we've seen in the last 15 years.

JazzG

I agree the economy has been in a bad place and I'm not saying this budget has put it in a bad place. This budget has however made things worse and every bit of economic data and most economists agree with that. I've seen it described as being like chloroform on the economy.

One budget won't fix anything but a coherant economic policy might. Labour have been a shambles on this. They have been going on about growth is their No.1 mission and then put out a budget which tanks that growth and will restrict it for a while. You can't whack £40b worth of taxes on business and then be shouting about growth. Similar Starmer said he wants to free us Japanese knot-weed of red tape, again which is a valid point but then Angela Rayner is about to whack these business with a whole set of new regulations. They want Heathrow and other airport projects but they also want Net zero. You can't have it both ways. He spent his whole time in opposition sitting on the fence, they've come in and now they are putting out policies which contradict each other. The education bill is already being watered down after the backlash it received.

It is clear they did not think this would be the fallout of their budget, in my eyes they'd have more credibility if they just scrapped it and started again. We get stuck with politicians who fuck up, realise they've fucked up and spend time fucking up even more to clear up their previous fuck ups! Would be quite refreshing for them to hold their hand up, say they got it wrong and will fix it.

Mirth

Genuinely a big deal if waiting lists are coming down over the winter months which usually see a spike at the best of times.

banduan

Mirth Genuinely a big deal if waiting lists are coming down over the winter months which usually see a spike at the best of times.

apparently due to a bit of window dressing?

JazzG

Good to see some progress being made, I don't know how it works but on Reddit some were saying that the waiting lists usually fall over the winter months? Someone linked an article to Feb 24 and NHS said waiting lists were down for 3 consecutive months. I wonder if the the private sector is a lot more involved now which is helping cut the waiting lists, I know some feel strongly against that.

Wes Streeting out of all the cabinet has come across as the most impressive to me, many of the others seem to be a shambles and I think a some are probably on the chopping block for the next reshuffle.

JazzG

Kim Leadbeater is pretty much admitting here people could end their life solely because they believe they are a financial burden, that is simply not on. They've already announced the high court sign off aspect will be removed which has worried some MPs who supported. Seems to have united some right wing MPs and left wing MPs in opposition against this bill. Diane Abbot has made some very strong arguments against it and it not often I agree with her! Rumours among journalists are that Keir Starmer is pushing hard for it behind the scenes and is basically his bill.

The way this bill has been rushed through has not been right and Kim Leadbeater has not gonna out looking very good either, this is a very serious and non partizan matter and you can't just try to force it through without proper and robust debate. If anything there should be royal commission and if there is strong cross party support it might pass but as it stands you basically have state sponsored suicide without enough robust measures. It looks half baked and as soon as stories start coming out of people being pushed into this this will turn into a scandal for the government.

Personally I am against this but I do appreciate and understand there are very strong arguments for it as well, especially as I have seen some people go through horrific pain when they die.

JazzG

Thames Water should be allowed to go bankrupt, it should go into liquidation and it will probably emerge out a more leaner company. This is how capitalism should work, if the shareholders have taken out too much money, then they should face the consequences for that. Considering these are the same people who got Thames Water into this mess I struggle to see how they'll be the ones to turn it around.

Burnwinter

Just a thought, but maybe monopolies on the provision of goods at the bottom of Maslow's hierarchy ... shouldn't be privately owned?

JazzG

Burnwinter I think that is a fair comment, whether the state would want to take it on now might be a different matter. A lot of investment required and not much money around!

Mirth

AFAIK England (not even the rest of the UK) and Chile are the only countries to entirely privatise their water supply.

Another Tory special from the 80s.

JazzG

Ed Milliband ideological obsession is gonna end up costing consumers and killing off any remaining industrial capacity we have.

Mirth

JazzG You can't be blaming renewables for the price of electricity.

Qwiss

JazzG its called merit pricing. Gas is keeping the prices up.

JazzG

Mirth Certainly not bringing the price down either. Tony Blair Institute with interesting views on our current green push.

Qwiss We should be producing much more of our gas and oil but the way things are priced also needs a major overhaul.

JazzG

I don't think Apple has done this in any market. A very authoritarian move by our government to force Apple into this position.

Mirth

JazzG Certainly not bringing the price down either.

Well, why would it?

Energy is priced at the highest marginal cost of input then it doesn't matter what the price of wind, solar or even coal is.

As for the Tony Blair Institute, why conflate the discussion? They've said nothing on energy pricing.

JazzG

Mirth Well, why would it?

What is the point then if it isn't going to bring prices down? Surely the government should be working on major market reform to address the current pricing structure? We are pouring money into intermittent energy sources and this winter has shown that isn't the best idea without a stable base load.

The way we are going every bit of industry in this country is gonna be killed off. Different pricing mechanisms not on the top of the agenda when it comes to market reform. I don't see how this current situation is sustainable long term. This is not me putting the blame on Labour but they have the numbers behind them to actually make a meaningful change.

I'm not conflating anything nor did I say their report talks about energy pricing. I just generally mentioned that because they talk specifically about the push towards net zero.

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