arsenal finances thread: Page 32 - The Arsenal discussion forum and community: One More in the Tolly

arsenal finances thread

Qwiss

Its good but it needs to go back up again. New contracts for Saka, Saliba and Martinelli should do some damage but thats exactly why you cut the wage bill. Now we have scope to keep the youngsters happy.

goon

Good thread showing we’re basically pushing FFP to the brink.

We are basically banking heavily on getting back into the CL and I’m assuming some big commercial deals in the next couple of years.

Burnwinter

Little bit cheeky (as he admits) since Chelsea and United are probably about to blow another £100m in the next week or two.

At the moment the risks in our strategy are apparent, but some of the rewards look plausible. And at least even if we had to stop spending or even cash in on a star or two, we'd still have the bones of a competitive squad.

On the face of it I would guess we'll have to sell someone we all love before all's said and done.

jones

FFP was done last April and replaced by a much weaker regulation, don't think we're anywhere close to violating that one or the PL sustainability rules. We're a sugar daddy club for a minute now, not worried we'll sell anyone we don't want to.

goon

Did you read the thread? It goes into a lot of detail about how we are very close to the current PL (and moreso UEFA) limit even with the COVID relaxation and that's only after a lot of creativity.

I don't think we'll have to sell anyone mind you, but it does most likely mean spending will be limited in the next couple of windows. I'm guessing we're going with the Liverpool model of investing heavily in building a squad before settling down and reaping the rewards. The age profile of the squad make that a pretty sound/viable strategy.

jones

Twitter didn't load until now, not sure why that is but happens in every other thread these days.

Read it now but I don't think anything will come off it, for one we're back in Europe which we weren't last season plus they'll just find some other loophole to use if push came to shove. Other clubs done a lot worse than us

jones

😆

Mirth

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goon

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est

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Anzac

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/62771118
Uefa: Paris St-Germain one of eight clubs fined for breaching Financial Fair Play rules

"Paris St-Germain is one of eight clubs to be fined by European football's governing body, Uefa, for breaching Financial Fair Play rules.

PSG have been ordered to pay an unconditional 10m euros (£8.6m) for not complying with "break-even" rules and could pay as much as 65m euros (£56.3m) depending on future compliance.

The break-even requirement is where clubs are ordered to not spend more than the income that they generate, and that they must balance their books over the course of three years.

Uefa told 19 other clubs they will be "monitored closely" in coming years.

They include Chelsea, Leicester, Manchester City, West Ham and Rangers.
The sanctions applied to clubs who played in Uefa's 2021-22 club competitions and came after analysis of the financial years 2018, 2019, 2020, 2021 and 2022.

The other seven clubs required to make financial contributions are AC Milan, Inter Milan, Roma, Juventus, Besiktas, Marseille and Monaco."

No mention of us at all despite the recent talk of a need for caution.

Further to that the fines etc are a joke & slap on the wrist as they would be covered by UEFA Group Stage prizemoney, particularly for those clubs participating in the UCL. What makes this even more pathetic is that for a number of these clubs it is not the first time they have been investigated and/or found in breach of FFP/break even.

I posted some time ago that IMO it is worth it to break UEFA FFP if you have a plan in regards to the extra expenditure, and you achieve those objectives. For instance IMO last season (and this) are prime examples of taking the initiative to regain top4 whilst other clubs such as CFC and MU are still in transition (let alone that we have done as much to our selves either in not signing players and/or not registering a full 25 man squad). Nothing about this changes my mind about NOT deliberately breaching FFP, let alone IF the club & KSE ARE serious about regaining top4/UCL or even Arteta's 25 man squad requirements.

On a seperate note saw a comment in another article (which I now cannot find despite revisiting my browser history), that suggested our spending has been financed by KSE, however it is NOT 'Mad Walmart Money' but has been provided via loans (as was seen initially in COVID). If so then we have basically doubled our debt to being something over 5-600m? Not sure what the SwissRamble figures are and what period they cover (would not include this summer spend at least).

Claudius

We weren’t sanctioned because we aren’t in Europe. We are comfortably the worst performing of the big six financially. Combination of bad player trading, lack of champions league money while paying excessive wages to non contributing players. Hopefully, all three are being addressed with the rebuild. But our trajectory was unsustainable

Burnwinter

As far as FFP is concerned we weren't sanctioned but I've read we're on some sort of watchlist.

Getting back in the Champions League would be great revenue wise, but the league's too strong to imagine we'll be there for two decades straight like before.

I sorely hope we're able to convert our current good vibes into some big sponsorships. Our brand tanking during the banter era was always held out as the reason we were behind commercially, time to turn it around.

Claudius

Burnwinter wrote:
As far as FFP is concerned we weren't sanctioned but I've read we're on some sort of watchlist.

Getting back in the Champions League would be great revenue wise, but the league's too strong to imagine we'll be there for two decades straight like before.

I sorely hope we're able to convert our current good vibes into some big sponsorships. Our brand tanking during the banter era was always held out as the reason we were behind commercially, time to turn it around.

On brand. Gazidis was a tremendously bad administrator. He was your classic accountant when the team needed to risk and vision. Coupled with the ownership battle, it meant that we lost a decade in developing this team. During that period we went from being comfortably top 6 in brand / financials, to being outside the top 12 and trailing Spurs. It’s a great case study for how to throw it all away

Burnwinter

Take your point, but you can't blame it all on Gazidis.

I remember at the time we mostly believed the Kroenkes were penny-pinchers who weren't interested in football.

Looking back now the underinvestment of the "lost decade" from 2008–18 seems partly to have been strategic by KSE to hold share prices lower while they completed a full takeover and delisting.

Controlling ownership versus growth is the most compelling explanation for why they were so "hands off" for years and are suddenly so in the mix.

Clrnc

Gazidis built from bottom and scratch at Milan and is part of the management that went from the worst milan team in history to league title in just a few years though. Not sure all our failures here can be attributed to him alone

Claudius

Burnwinter wrote:
Take your point, but you can't blame it all on Gazidis.

I remember at the time we mostly believed the Kroenkes were penny-pinchers who weren't interested in football.

Looking back now the underinvestment of the "lost decade" from 2008–18 seems partly to have been strategic by KSE to hold share prices lower while they completed a full takeover and delisting.

Controlling ownership versus growth is the most compelling explanation for why they were so "hands off" for years and are suddenly so in the mix.

I hated what Gazidis did. But you want real root causes, it is exactly the decade long ownership battle between KSE and Jabba. As long as both were in the picture, nobody took full ownership of team strategy and investment, and we wasted away our cash reserves and squad. So you have to go back to Dein as the primary villain, and then the standoff between KSE and Jabba.

Qwiss

Claudius wrote:
So you have to go back to Dein as the primary villain, and then the standoff between KSE and Jabba.

100% agree with that. He made out like a bandit though so he didn't give a shit.

Anzac

Claudius wrote:
Burnwinter wrote:
Take your point, but you can't blame it all on Gazidis.

I remember at the time we mostly believed the Kroenkes were penny-pinchers who weren't interested in football.

Looking back now the underinvestment of the "lost decade" from 2008–18 seems partly to have been strategic by KSE to hold share prices lower while they completed a full takeover and delisting.

Controlling ownership versus growth is the most compelling explanation for why they were so "hands off" for years and are suddenly so in the mix.

I hated what Gazidis did. But you want real root causes, it is exactly the decade long ownership battle between KSE and Jabba. As long as both were in the picture, nobody took full ownership of team strategy and investment, and we wasted away our cash reserves and squad. So you have to go back to Dein as the primary villain, and then the standoff between KSE and Jabba.

PHW wasn't blameless in that he created the cold war between KSE and Red & White Holdings that resulted in that stalemate, let alone for much of the inertia that has plagued the club off the pitch.

Further to that IMO the dispute over major/majority share holding was essentially about potential investment by either party, something that our BoD (who were our shareholders before hand), never did except on 1 previous occaision (when DD sold shares to Fiszman for him to then provide a loan to the club). The BoD should have had a plan to look after the club, but as Keswick said when he replaced PHW, the plan was to support AW and to be financially self sustaining.
IMO our former BoD/shareholders were little more than rats deserting a sinking ship of their own making.

Claudius

Qwiss! wrote:
Claudius wrote:
So you have to go back to Dein as the primary villain, and then the standoff between KSE and Jabba.

100% agree with that. He made out like a bandit though so he didn't give a shit.

.. and then he unleashed his son on our contract renewals. Capitalist family first and foremost

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