Claudius wrote:

A few more thoughts the day after watching it

• The Arya scene. I assume that was her wolf. When she says "it's not you" at the end, is she referring to the wolf or herself; and if the latter, does that have an impact on her journey to Winterfell. Maybe the wolf's rejection points to her that she is no longer Arya. She is nobody now

Thats how I read it too.

Claudius wrote:

• The wry smile on Lord Baelish after he's pushed by Jon Snow is probably because it's a reminder of Ned Stark pushing Baelish in season 1. He probably assumes that Jon is as easy to manipulate into an unfortunate end as his old man. Hopefully, Jon proves otherwise, but I suspect Jon will go down before he goes up again

That would be a poor end to Jon. And given his resurrection, etc I expect them to be a bit less boring than "oh he died cos he's good and naive. Just like Rob and Ned".

Claudius wrote:

• The sea battle. I loved it. But I'm still wondering, what kind of large ship fleet sails at night with everybody drinking and conquering vaginas below deck instead of keeping a lookout for enemies. That an entire fleet was surprised by Euron is the one big hole in the episode. Anyone else still wondering about that?

I'd allow that, it was very foggy and the boats were dark. They seen the fireballs before the enemy ships.

Season 7 Episode 2

Euron Greyjoy — lots of energy, but never seems like he's going to learn his position. 7
Sansa Stark — competent without having much to do. 6
Jon Stark — provided one of the episode's decisive moments. 8
Lord Varys — poised under pressure. 7
Daenerys Stormborn — a little pedestrian, but consolidating on a solid season. 7
Tyrion Lannister — lacking in conviction. 5
Theon Greyjoy — let the defence down badly at a key moment. 2
Samwell Tarly — great creativity and endeavour. 9
Jorah Mormont — deeply unattractive, but not awful performance. 6
Jaime Lannister — flashes of guile without any end product. 5
Arya Stark — a luxury player at this point. 4
Yara Greyjoy — decent hustle let down by poor attention to the play. 5
Missandei, Grey Worm — forgettable. 3
Ellaria Sand — a lacklustre send-off. 5

Euron Greyjoy needs to be dropped. He's ridiculous.

Honestly a good old fashioned ratings thread after each episode seems like the best way to discuss this show.

I don't see the point of introducing Euron this late either. In the books he has a dragon horn. On the show he doesn't even have that; they gave Cersei a massive crossbow instead.

Probably a sign not enough villains are going to die this season. Those sandsnakes and the whole Dorn side story has been an unbelievable load of shite too, not the stupid sandsnakes are dead and they did nothing.

Yeah, the whole Dorne storyline has been truly awful. It should have died with Oberyn. I think they knew that they screwed up with the casting of the sand snakes too. They were the worst actors on the show bar none. It feels like an incredible thing to say since one of the actresses apparently got nominated for an Oscar a while back, but they were so bad that I genuinely found myself wondering if they had just lifted a bunch of people off a convention floor.

The mother was good in Luther as his wife. Making them all do silly accents doesn't help.

Considering that one has been nominated for best actress in a leading role and Henwick was one of the few non-awful things in Iron Fist, I'm willing to believe that what they've been given is more of an issue than the actresses themselves. I mean, just read out loud "a foreign invasion is underway". Absolutely cringeworthy. Not sure if there even was a good way to act the "mama mama mama" scene either.

Yeah, the dialogue is worse than the acting, though I don't think the accents help either.

I quite like OTT, ridiculous nature of Euron.

I love Euron. It's like he's been lifted out of an 80s rock band and placed and Westeros. Great revectoring of his character. If you're going to be a minor character, at least be fun. Unlike the sand snakes

And why do people keep saying they are dead? Ellaria and the pretty sand snake are alive, going to Cersei as gifts along with Yara.

The mama sand snake was the wife of Lucius Vorenus in Rome too. If you haven't watched Rome, go and watch it now.

No.

Tomorrow?

Burnwinter wrote:

Season 7 Episode 2

Euron Greyjoy — lots of energy, but never seems like he's going to learn his position. 7
Sansa Stark — competent without having much to do. 6
Jon Stark — provided one of the episode's decisive moments. 8
Lord Varys — poised under pressure. 7
Daenerys Stormborn — a little pedestrian, but consolidating on a solid season. 7
Tyrion Lannister — lacking in conviction. 5
Theon Greyjoy — let the defence down badly at a key moment. 2
Samwell Tarly — great creativity and endeavour. 9
Jorah Mormont — deeply unattractive, but not awful performance. 6
Jaime Lannister — flashes of guile without any end product. 5
Arya Stark — a luxury player at this point. 4
Yara Greyjoy — decent hustle let down by poor attention to the play. 5
Missandei, Grey Worm — forgettable. 3
Ellaria Sand — a lacklustre send-off. 5

Yes, this is good. More of this each week please Burnsy. You've create a job for yourself mate - well done.

sansa is still being a turd. the way she immediately piped down the moment jon told her he was leaving her in charge of the north was icky

That was beautifully acted. Her face in that scene. That look of "it's all mine!" And Baelish took great joy in the moment as well

Ah Baelish, season 7 and Aiden Gillen still hasn't settled on one accent for him.

"Ah shappose Harrenhal's aff the table ash well."

Shady wrote:

"Ah shappose Harrenhal's aff the table ash well."

Thasrightthasrightthasright.

show hit the warpspeed button with casterly rock and highgarden falling in the space of 15 minutes

that was the first real sighting of casterly rock right? expected something a bit more imperious

Gazza M wrote:

that was the first real sighting of casterly rock right? expected something a bit more imperious

They are taking some serious liberties with GRRM's world at this point.

To get back to the discussion about Dany's motives, they addressed the issue of her birthright in this episode. She came off as petulant, self-mythologising and power hungry in that scene at Dragonstone which I'm sure is not a coincidence. It contrasted nicely to the unassumingness of Jon. The way Missandei recited all of Dany's titles, "breaker of chain, mother of dragons, reightful heir to the iron throne, the unburnt, the khaleesi of the great grass sea", and-so-forth, only to then have Davos going: "This is Jon Snow, and we drove here", was one of the funniest moments this season.

There was clearly a lesson in there about how Dany is viewed by the people in Westeros. Jon points out that there is no birthright; that Ned Stark and Robert overthrew the mad king who would have otherwise burned the seven kingdoms. The irony of Dany coming to Westeros with three dragons and a vast foreign army and, in so many words, calling Jon a traitor to the North is kinda beautiful. ”I was born to rule the seven kingdoms, and I will” is the kind of attitude towards power that is almost certain to see her end up on the wrong side of the history GRRM is writing.

Yeah that bit was great

I'm glad they're skipping the battles, I always find them incredibly tedious watching unless it's done properly. Has Dany basically lost the bulk of her army?

Feels a bit too easy for Euron to just keep popping up with his ships and trolling Dany too. You didn't get any sense of the Iron Islands being remotely relevant in the past.

Funniest bit was "does she like a finger in the arsehole".

I don't like that they're making Tyrion wrong about everything. It's probably to push Dany towards what Olenna was telling her, but Tyrion has always been smarter than both Jaime and Cersei, and even Tywin whose strategic mind they don't seem to miss at all for some reason.

Quincy Abeyie wrote:

I don't like that they're making Tyrion wrong about everything. It's probably to push Dany towards what Olenna was telling her, but Tyrion has always been smarter than both Jaime and Cersei, and even Tywin whose strategic mind they don't seem to miss at all for some reason.

it does seem convenient to have him be badly outsmarted twice in the space of 2 episodes

They're just making Dany look vulnerable before she demolishes them. I mean she has 3 freaking dragons, it's ggwp the second they enter the war along with the thousands of dothraki's.

It would've been too easy if she just swooped in and everything worked according to plan.

Good to see Bran arrive at Winterfell. he's the only one who knows about Jon's parentage yeah? And he has said he needs to speak to Jon. I wonder if he'll get that message through though this season, or if lines of communication will go bad and we'll have to wait until next year?

Olenna's revelation and summation of Joffrey was classic. I really thought she'd already poisoned the wine and that Jamie was a goner, but I was wrong.

Arya has to turn up at Winterfell soon too doesn't she?

Asterix wrote:

Arya has to turn up at Winterfell soon too doesn't she?

If she didn't change her plan after she met the wolf.

There's a theory that Arya is the banker in King's Landing. The obvious argument against this is the amount of time it would take her to get there, but then we know D&D don't give a shit about any of that.

Arya could get very annoying if they start just having her be anyone at any time and then conveniently killing people without much hassle.

Yeah, there needs to be some checks and balances, I don't know if there are any limitations to her power but if not it's just far too easy.

Why would she pose as the banker? Surely she'd just go with Jamie. Someone who carries a weapon and can get very close to her.

Better episode.

Some things struck me as stupid.

The extreme failure of scouting with the assault on Casterly Rock. It's a bit annoying when these things have to play out as literally as scouring the castle, shouting "Where are the other Lannisters?"

The incredible diplomatic uselessness of Jon Snow. Arrives at Dragonstone with no proof of the walkers or the Night King and not even a paragraph framed in his mind about how to explain them. Then doesn't mention dragonglass and its importance for days on end.

Bran retraumatising Sansa by starting to recount the events of her wedding to her. Come on, little brother. You may be the three-eyed raven but that doesn't mean you have to be a massive douchecanoe.

Half thought all the stuff about Jon Snow's parentage would come to a head with the dragons bowing to him or something, I wonder if they're saving that one up.

I'm quite pleased by the prospect of Jorah Mormont getting back into the action. I don't like the big battles, but there's been a shortage of sword duelling lately.

Battles so far have looked like real cost saving exercises, hopefully means we'll get something big and cool looking later in the season.

goon wrote:

Yeah, there needs to be some checks and balances, I don't know if there are any limitations to her power but if not it's just far too easy.

Why would she pose as the banker? Surely she'd just go with Jamie. Someone who carries a weapon and can get very close to her.

Because there's another Jaime there? And it would be a lot more difficult to kill and replace the Lord Commander of the Kingsguard than some banker. 

Qwiss! wrote:

Battles so far have looked like real cost saving exercises, hopefully means we'll get something big and cool looking later in the season.

Apparently  £10million was spunked on one episode this season, so we should be in for something huge. 

Shady wrote:

goon wrote:

Yeah, there needs to be some checks and balances, I don't know if there are any limitations to her power but if not it's just far too easy.

Why would she pose as the banker? Surely she'd just go with Jamie. Someone who carries a weapon and can get very close to her.

Because there's another Jaime there? And it would be a lot more difficult to kill and replace the Lord Commander of the Kingsguard than some banker. 

Not if you can magically look like anyone at all.

Anyway if she's going to turn into anyone it should be the Mountain.

She'd have to kill the original mountain first. Not the easiest prospect..