Ricky1985 wrote:
Mirth wrote:

Personally I think he (and the entire United attack) have been mismanaged this season because the way they play doesn't favour attackers. Time will tell, but I expect him to go on to be one of the best strikers in the world over the course of his career.

I think he'll stay left wing personally, suits his strengths better. He's a very good talent but I don't think he's going to do anything extraordinary in his career. He lacks something - his close control is great, not amazing but impressive, his finishing is hit and miss and he often takes too long or plays the wrong pass when he's in good positions. He might develop and improve dramatically on that, but I don't think he will ever be a 30-40 goal a season striker, which seems to be what you think he will become. A 15 goal wide man is where I think he'll be throughout his career.

I see where your coming from but what I don't see is Martial playing a left winger for his whole career. If anything that's where the flaws in his game are exposed the most!

Sicario wrote:

Ricky you don't rate Kane or Martial yet think Theo is/was a world beater 😆

Biased much?

I think Walcott's a world beater? It's not 2006 any more mate. 😆

I've wanted Walcott sold since his first big contract negotiation because he hasn't developed how I hoped he would considering the talent he had at 16.

evoh_1 wrote:
Clrnc wrote:

I don't get the Martinez criticism on the back of this match given that Everton played incredibly well in the 2nd half and should have won this match 9 out of 10 times. Everton showed real fight in the 2nd half and Martinez changes worked after a shit first half. It's not as if it's like our performance in both halves at OT.

Then don't mean about Wenger at any point as they have the same methods pretty clearly. Their team can't finish or defend its a joke. You can't be unlucky for a whole season, it's down to the quality of the prep.

This is such a shallow thought. They have the same methods clearly?

The Martinez criticism in the 2nd half of the season is valid by the Everton fans. The performances in the league has look insipid the last 2 months as they focused on the FA Cup, but in the first half of the season they are clearly extremely unlucky. You can't prepare anything if the ref keeps fucking you up. They were cheated out of the League Cup Final, the win at Stamford bridge etc.

Clarence, just look at their defending. Compare that to Spurs, who have a similar talent pool to pick from, or Leicester, who have half the talent - what Martinez is producing is clearly not good enough. It can only be luck for so long.

At least Wenger has the 'excuse' that half his teams always missing! 😆

McCarthy, Barkley and Lukaku have played all season long and Martinez still can't figure out a way to get a balanced team out there. He's not a good manager.

And look at Baines, Coleman and Jagielka - superb, solid defenders, Baines and Coleman also able to do serious damage going forward when playing under David Moyes - under Martinez they're all over the place. The shape of the team is all wrong, there are gaps everywhere, free attackers everywhere, they're outnumbered everywhere - a kid like Stones doesn't stand a chance.

What sort of plonka puts Besic - a slow, ponderous midfielder, up against a speedy dribbler like Martial? It's retarded. Put any defneder you have out there that can run before you do that.

Mirth wrote:

I see where your coming from but what I don't see is Martial playing a left winger for his whole career. If anything that's where the flaws in his game are exposed the most!

He doesn't have the frame to play centre forward in my view. Also a big pansy, not gonna go up against centreback or win anything in the air. I also think he doesn't have those striker instincts in the box. He just looks much more dangerous coming from the left where he can rely more on his dribbling to do damage as opposed to clever movement and positioning. Most importantly, I don't think he's enough of a goalscorer to play that central role. I see a 15 goal a season wide man - which is not to be sniffed at because they are hard to come by!

I'm with Mirth. Martial looks like he's going to turn into one of the best players of his entire generation to me. He's exactly what we needed. It annoys me to no end that United got him. And from Monaco no less! It's just inexplicable. Wenger might be past it as a manager but he's still as good as ever when it comes to spotting a player. Either he fell asleep at the steering wheel or he didn't think any club would pay Monaco's asking price.

By the way, Rashford has an Anelka vibe about him. Similar sort of game, not the same fantastic technical quality, admittedly, but moves like he did; very fast and balanced, and also has that same disinterested way about him on the pitch.

Martial is fantastic and I'm jealous.

Just to say, I'd take Martial on our left wing, or even up front, in an absolute heart beat. I just don't think he warrants the tag 'incredible' - he's just not that good.

Martial is an unbelievable talent. And no I don't think he'll end up a CF, he's a natural left sided player who will still score many goals because of his tendency to make diagonal runs and get into goal scoring positions. The new Ronaldo imo.

Martinez is the Spanish Wenger.

Ricky1985 wrote:

And look at Baines, Coleman and Jagielka - superb, solid defenders, Baines and Coleman also able to do serious damage going forward when playing under David Moyes - under Martinez they're all over the place. The shape of the team is all wrong, there are gaps everywhere, free attackers everywhere, they're outnumbered everywhere - a kid like Stones doesn't stand a chance.

What sort of plonka puts Besic - a slow, ponderous midfielder, up against a speedy dribbler like Martial? It's retarded. Put any defneder you have out there that can run before you do that.

His only other choice was Tony Hibbert who hasn't played for 18 months.

Forget about defensive organisation, when Stones made stupid individual mistakes week in week out their defence have no chance. Instead of clearing the ball, he tries a stupid dribble, get dispossessed and an opponent score. Martinez dropped him right after that but Jagielka got injured again so he has to play. Everton's defence has had a massive amount of rotation this season to be fair. Jagielka, Baines, Oviedo, Coleman has been missing for a good period of time.

Their results this season is clearly not good enough, especially at home. Like I said, the criticism of Martinez is valid. It's just strange that people picks this match where Everton defended stoutly and attacked well in the 2nd half to say, "Martinez has got to go". If anything, this match has shown Everton fans that Martinez hasn't lost his side yet.

To compare his results to Moyes is also ironic given that in his first season he has surpassed Moyes both in attacking and defensive stats. Moyes has had a couple of piss poor seasons here and there as well, they almost got relegated when they finished 17th.

I'd say Moyes is a far superior manager to Martinez personally. If you offered me one at Arsenal for next season it's not even close for which one I'd choose.

When Moyes got together a good squad at Everton, after years of building them up with some really crap players and no money at all, they were a seriously good outfit. Strong and organised defensively, fit and tough, played good football and scored lots of goals. The team Moyes had in the two years or so before he went to United would be right up there with Spurs and Leicester this season. They were just unfortunate that the League was far stronger back then and the big sides had some of the world's best players.

Ricky1985 wrote:

By the way, Rashford has an Anelka vibe about him. Similar sort of game, not the same fantastic technical quality, admittedly, but moves like he did; very fast and balanced, and also has that same disinterested way about him on the pitch.

Good comparison. Utd are set for the future upfront with him and Martial.

I'm with Ricky - Martial isn't all that. So many better youngsters out there. Kingsley Coman is thrice the player

So now that United will probably win the FA Cup and we will finish the season empty handed, do we go back to believing the cup don't mean shit?

Daz wrote:

So now that United will probably win the FA Cup and we will finish the season empty handed, do we go back to believing the cup don't mean shit?

Yes. It's a mickey mouse cup.

In all honesty it seems that many people thought that anyway - we won it twice in a row and it barely gets a mention in terms of mitigating against our other woes.

I love the FA cup.

And I have to say that Wenger for all his vilification of the competition has been spectacularly successful in it.
This seems to be a horrible killing joke.
The man knows how to win cups, he knows the style of football that will win a cup competition not only in England but in Europe- Our 2006 CL campaign proves it.

But he chooses to not play that type of football.
And he chooses not to buy players that would compliment this style.

This in my opinion is Wengers biggest insult to us and his biggest mistake.

That's probably because our other woes are so significant and long term, with no sign of ending.
You can also consider that it doesn't indicate too much if such a shit Man U team can win it.