The Oxlade-Chamberlain / Joel Campbell thread: Page 10 - The Arsenal discussion forum and community: One More in the Tolly

The Oxlade-Chamberlain / Joel Campbell thread

Ray

Not writing Chambo off, I'd just prefer to see Joel being given a chance, besides Chambo has been given plenty of games last season and this, he was virtually first choice for a period, it's not like this is his first chance of having a run of games. Campbell on the other hand hasn't even been given a chance in a single PL game.

goon

jones wrote:
Campbell definitely deserves a start for me, has done better than Ox this season with not even half his minutes. We'll never know if another player can pull a Coquelin if we never give them the chance to show their worth.

Has Ox really had a chance this season? He had a very good pre-season and then was dropped the moment Sanchez came into the side, coming on as a sub and the odd start here and there since then. There's better, more established players than him who have struggled under those circumstances. Most of our starting XI seemed to need a good run of games before they got going this season.

I quite like Campbell and think he should get more mins, but he's got nowhere near the ceiling Ox has. He doesn't get as many chances because he's not as good.

jones

otfgoon wrote:
I quite like Campbell and think he should get more mins, but he's got nowhere near the ceiling Ox has. He doesn't get as many chances because he's not as good.

To be fair most would have said the same this time last year about Coquelin.

Ox is talented but so is Campbell, at the moment there's a free spot on the right wing which will be claimed by one of Ramsey or Wilshere in the future. Ox has been mostly garbage this season to be honest, if Campbell can't get a start now when do you think will he get one? Aside from that Chamberlain really does not deserve a starting berth right now, I want the guy to succeed as much as anyone here but his complete lack of effort defensively shouldn't be rewarded, especially when the alternative always leaves it all on the pitch.

yuv

Agree with otfDula here. if anything, our hope to find another Coq points in Ox direction, not Joel.

I don't deny it's a gamble: unlike other Ox supporters here, I do accept he's far from form, and though I agree the only way he could regain it is by playing regularly, I don't think of it as a certainty in any way. But if he does, and I still believe he might, find his form (someone mentioned he played a lot early last year. True. Somehow forgot to mention he was very good in that run - I'd certainly be satisfied at this point if he got back to that level) this could have an effect on the team, and perhaps on the season.

Bold Tone

I think Campbell is too anxious to avoid making a mistake, he ends up doing nothing.
He is so much better when he plays his natural game for his country and when he was on loan.
Ox is at the other end of the scale where he tries to do too much then fucks up.
He would be much better if concentrated on basics first rather than trying to take on everyone everytime.

jones

Bold Tone wrote:
I think Campbell is too anxious to avoid making a mistake, he ends up doing nothing.
He is so much better when he plays his natural game for his country and when he was on loan.
Ox is at the other end of the scale where he tries to do too much then fucks up.
He would be much better if concentrated on basics first rather than trying to take on everyone everytime.

I think this sums it up very well. In my opinion playing Campbell more (and Ox less) would rectify both issues; Campbell would get more confidence to play his natural game because he wouldn't be afraid to be dropped for a few more months and Chamberlain would get the kick up his ass he needs to sort his head out, focus on tracking back and doing the basics right.

goon

jones wrote:
otfgoon wrote:
I quite like Campbell and think he should get more mins, but he's got nowhere near the ceiling Ox has. He doesn't get as many chances because he's not as good.

To be fair most would have said the same this time last year about Coquelin.

Ox is talented but so is Campbell, at the moment there's a free spot on the right wing which will be claimed by one of Ramsey or Wilshere in the future. Ox has been mostly garbage this season to be honest, if Campbell can't get a start now when do you think will he get one? Aside from that Chamberlain really does not deserve a starting berth right now, I want the guy to succeed as much as anyone here but his complete lack of effort defensively shouldn't be rewarded, especially when the alternative always leaves it all on the pitch.

To be fair I was crying out for Wenger to give Coquelin (or Chambers) a chance while Flamini was stinking it up at the start of last season. That being said, I obviously didn't expect he'd be this good, I just wanted Flamini out of the team 😆

As yuv points out though, if either of those guys are going to surprise us, my money is definitely on Ox. It's not about who deserves it more it's about who are we going to benefit most from by giving them a chance.

yuv

I don't know if the defensive claim a supporting argument, or is it your main point, J. I kinda like it more as a main argument: Ox is absolutely shocking in his defensive approach, he's a completely irresponsibly player there, seems to not have that basic "don't fuck it up close to our goal" instinct, which is infuriating. I'm not sure if it's enough to tilt it, though.

I wonder about that assumption that while Joel needs to be encouraged Ox needs to be kicked up his ass. I'm not at all sure about it, but I tend to think Ox needs the positive Wengery elixirs more - that to find his form in general (not referring to the defensive discipline. There he just needs to be, well, disciplined).

y va marquer

Wenger's going to hand the spot to Chamberlain and Joel won't get a look in unless Alex is an unmitigated disaster there, which he won't be.

yuv

I actually think Joel will get more minutes - but it would be in more sub appearances, no more.

DiabyKungFu

Bold Tone wrote:
He is so much better when he plays his natural game for his country and when he was on loan.

He just broke a 23 game scoreless streak for Costa Rica and he had 1 goal and 0 assists in 16 starts for Villarreal last season. He's simply a shit player. People badly misjudged Chambo's level but you just need to look at his dribbling stats to see that he is at least a player with some genuine promise. Campbell is a FIFA regen who should be playing for Toulouse or somewhere like that.

jones

Stats mean fuck all, Ox has six goals in 86 league matches playing as a forward for Arsenal.

yuv wrote:
I wonder about that assumption that while Joel needs to be encouraged Ox needs to be kicked up his ass. I'm not at all sure about it, but I tend to think Ox needs the positive Wengery elixirs more - that to find his form in general (not referring to the defensive discipline. There he just needs to be, well, disciplined).

Agree on both points, Wenger's man management for attacking players is usually spot on, at the same time though Chamberlain is not going to find that defensive discipline by himself all of a sudden.

The reason I'm championing Campbell is that his career at Arsenal is in real danger. I'd like to see him get a chance for a few games at least since he didn't have one since we signed him. With Chamberlain I'm certain he'll get more than enough chances to succeed (which he eventually will).

y va marquer

yuv wrote:
I actually think Joel will get more minutes - but it would be in more sub appearances, no more.

For sure, but I think it'll be limited to just minutes in terms of PL outings.
I don't see that he has Wenger's trust.

Bold Tone

@kungfu
Only for those who watched those games on the equivalent of ceefax.
The Costa-Rican coach will not pick a shit player as his main striker in the world cup.

y va marquer

Could end up with Ox on the left and Alexis on the right?

goon

The English coach picks one for England.

jones

That's why England went out in the group stages and Costa Rica didn't.

y va marquer

Harry Kane didn't play at the WC

DiabyKungFu

jones wrote:
Stats mean fuck all, Ox has six goals in 86 league matches playing as a forward for Arsenal.

I know. That's what I meant when I said that people have badly misjudged his level. He at least has one demonstrably elite skill. What does Campbell do better than some random player from some midtable La Liga team? In what aspects of the game is he better than Bebe?

Bold Tone wrote:
@kungfu
Only for those who watched those games on the equivalent of ceefax.
The Costa-Rican coach will not pick a shit player as his main striker in the world cup.

Does Costa Rica have some bevy of great strikers that I'm unaware of?

I'm not even being hyperbolic when I say somewhere like Toulouse is his level. This guy is as pointless as it gets.

Bold Tone

Name me one country that has a bevy of great strikers?
Also saying a guy who has Campbell's record is as pointless as it gets is as just about as hyperbolic as one can get.

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