The US is a massive country. There's no reason it shouldn't be able to produce a highly competitive football team if the popularity of the sport increases just a bit.

The arguments made by that Shaughnessy character have practically conceded the point anyway. The only real argument he makes is that he didn't grow up with football so he doesn't understand it. The problem he has is that a much bigger chunk of the current generation of US kids is going to grow up with it.

In Australia we always worry about how our World Cup performances will affect the popularity of the sport, but in fact the blanket coverage of the WC inevitably seems to boost football's profile and fortunes. We had a shit team this time around but there was still huge patriotic fervour.

The A-League is in decent shape at the moment and is being covered free-to-air on SBS, and football participation is on the verge of outrunning Australian Rules, cricket and netball apparently. A decent size rectangular stadium is on the horizon in Perth (most of the big ones in AU are oval shaped for cricket and Aussie Rules).

It's a slow process but I can see it eventually (in decades) ranking up with the other football codes here as a spectator sport.

Decent article here: http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/has-the-u-s-mens-national-team-plateaued/

I'm more inclined towards the punctuated equilibrium hypothesis, for what it's worth.

Soccer surpassing baseball in the next twenty years is fantasy stuff. Soccer isn't going to surpass any major sport that has the best domestic league in the world (i.e. NFL, NBA, MLB, NHL).

Look at the picture of those sinister Iranian fans, that proves the article is correct.

Wow Flobs the conservatives/extreme right are really scared that their particular concept of their WASP hegemony will be overturned by demographics.
I don't really see why they see football as part if the Islamic/cheese eating pacifist or even ex-communist European plot to dominate the world.
Perhaps they mistrust it because of its because of its international flavour
But in that case they are obviously purposely being disingenuous of its origins and it's beloved status among many of the most despicable right wing dictatorships of the 20th century, if they were told that Generalissimo Franco was a great admirer of the game maybe they would be more kindly disposed towards it.
I for one am glad of their antipathy, because with the USA's huge wealth population and ultra modern sports science and facilities, if they ever get their act together- The rest of us may as well not even bother showing up.

This socio/political link does not exist in Australia, many right wingers and conservatives are fans of the game including business magnate Frank Lowey who was the driving force behind the establishment of the A-League.
Gone are the days when football was seen as a game for "wogs and poofta's".

Diaby KungFu wrote:

Decent article here: http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/has-the-u-s-mens-national-team-plateaued/

I'm more inclined towards the punctuated equilibrium hypothesis, for what it's worth.

Soccer surpassing baseball in the next twenty years is fantasy stuff. Soccer isn't going to surpass any major sport that has the best domestic league in the world (i.e. NFL, NBA, MLB, NHL).

Thing is though DKF, if Americans are like every other nationality then they will want to see the USA compete against other countries and this will never happen in those other sports, calling something "a world series" isn't going to help, no one in the rest of the world gives a fuck about baseball and NFL, and that goes for GAA in Ireland and AFL in Australia too.

until they can convince kids from the inner city to favour soccer over basketball, football and baseball, they won't make the next step. there's no incentive for those kids right now, college programs all slant to their big three sports. those programs are culturally/socially entrenched and extremely well funded - it will take some kind of revolutionary to come in and start prising the best young american athletes away from those sports. i'm generalising a bit here, but there's a tradition of the best footballers in the world come from working class/street footballing roots. soccer appears to be a middle class past-time in the states.

Gazza M wrote:

until they can convince kids from the inner city to favour soccer over basketball, football and baseball, they won't make the next step. there's no incentive for those kids right now, college programs all slant to their big three sports. those programs are culturally/socially entrenched and extremely well funded - it will take some kind of revolutionary to come in and start prising the best young american athletes away from those sports. i'm generalising a bit here, but there's a tradition of the best footballers in the world come from working class/street footballing roots. soccer appears to be a middle class past-time in the states.

you're giving baseball too much credit. baseball has a demographic problem in america. from a talent acquisition perspective they are lucky that it's a pretty popular sport in poor latin american countries and they are filling the void.

and colleges are geared towards the big two revenue producers: football and basketball. baseball players aren't even on full scholarships. a team of 25 has to split 11.7 scholarships.

Do you guys like baseball? I always find it a bit ironic that US columnists write about how boring football is and then praise baseball, which I find incredibly dull.

Burnwinter™ wrote:

Do you guys like baseball? I always find it a bit ironic that US columnists write about how boring football is and then praise baseball, which I find incredibly dull.

Nah. The games take forever.

Baseball and cricket are stupid, never bothered to try to understand them.

Don't mind a bit of rugger (union).

Baseball and cricket, much like fishing and sailing, are great if you appreciate their true purpose: to give you something to half pay attention to and talk about while drinking beer with your mates. Preferably done in warm climes.

Games should never take more than two hours.

Cricket's great, but you do need stuff to do while you're watching it. But there are a lot of reasons (in my opinion) why cricket is more interesting than baseball.

not bothered with any us sports apart from basketball

Meh. It's their loss.

Think a lot of you would be surprised at the interest level of playing and watching for the younger generations. There's no denying that most Americans over the age of 40 have a limited interest as they didn't grow up with the game.

But younger generations are fully in - I grew up playing competitively and that for one season my father was a coach (no one else around) is ridiculous as he had never played. That's changing now though as far more people are playing and that shift alone should drastically improve the quality of coaching in the country. Been really impressed by younger coaches that I've met lately; they're teaching a far more technical approach to the game that I was only provided by European coaches as I got older.

flobaba wrote:

Biggus wrote:

Wow Flobs the conservatives/extreme right are really scared that their particular concept of their WASP hegemony will be overturned by demographics.
I don't really see why they see football as part if the Islamic/cheese eating pacifist or even ex-communist European plot to dominate the world.
Perhaps they mistrust it because of its because of its international flavour

Yes, xenophobia plays a huge role in their lack of acceptance of football, IMO. Many people don't watch because they don't understand it, and it has a different "structure" from their traditional sports which they can't be arsed to wrap their heads around. It's just "not American". Disliking, or lacking any true interest soccer is viewed as evidence of true patriotism in some places. (I kid, I kid, but it does seem like it!)

Why does the time read upwards from 0-90 mins rather than count down the other way? *Most Americans love last minute "buzzer beater" plays. Being able to visually count down the clock increases their excitement, I guess.

And what? A whole 45 minutes of continuous play per half? What?! When do we get the beers?

They seem trivial, but the average American I've met honestly gives these as reasons why they refuse to get into soccer.

Also, those little things that have helped them over commercialize their sports - time outs, they won't get those in football, so TV isn't really crazy about it.

also abhor the idea that games can end in a 'tie' after 90 minutes, or that teams can play for ties strategically. the concept is fairly alien to them.

Americans, young Americans, are playing soccer more and more....You can see it driving through small towns here in the Northeast ...Stop the car and watch kids playing soccer instead of American football...Parents don't want their kids playing American football, too many physical dangers....Soccer will continue to grow, gradually, but it will grow..It may take some time 10-20 years before USA can be a world power....But it will come....
As for Coulter and her ilk, they are just wacko and stupid...End...
Just keep the sport relatively drug free, give help to referees, and cut down on diving...