Youth team development: Page 82 - The Arsenal discussion forum and community: One More in the Tolly

Youth team development

Ricky1985

😆

God, I can actually hear his stupid accent in my head when I read that sentence now!

Bennacer was terrible the other night. Not sure whether it was because he had Adelaide next to him, who's not used to playing in midfield or because he was a bit out of his depth, but he was genuinely terrible.

Bielik was majestic at the back. Anticipated everything so well, completely dominated their forwards in every challenge and was very composed and impressive on the ball. Sort of like a more mobile Mertesacker in the way that he was constantly stepping in and winning the ball. Wasn't sure about him as a centreback previously, but he was good enough the other night that I can see him in the first team there in the not too distant future. Not sure his box defending is there yet; think he still switches off and ball watches in certain situations, but he's obviously working hard because he's developing at a rate of knots. He was a colossus on the night. Quite funny how much bigger he was than everyone else on the pitch from ground level! 😆

Nelson was a slight disappointment (at least to me, he got rave reviews from bloggers and Arsenal fans elsewhere), but a lot of that was, I think, because he was playing against the best 18 year olds in the country and he slightly struggled with the quicker speed of the game and how physically strong and further developed all the City players were. That said, he was still class and for a 16 year old kid; the youngest on the pitch, his energy levels were insane and he did everything right all night, even if not everything came off. I think he'll rip teams to shreds in this competition next year, he'll be even more impressive than Willock has been this year.

Arsene has been talking about our youth prospects recently:

Hard to name exactly who the other 3 or 4 players are beyond Willock, Jeff and Nelson, but I have a pretty good idea. Not heard him as strong in his opinion of the talent we have had in the past or as sure as he is about them becoming big players for Arsenal. But it's what I have thought myself for a while now; we have a seriously impressive handful of talents coming through that could genuinely become top class players. Nelson, at 16, getting name checked by Wenger, along with Jeff and Willock who are both 18, is pretty cool too. He's the biggest talent we've got for me. Absolutely amazing how good every facet of his game is and the maturity and intelligence he plays with - Wenger must love him, he embodies everything he loves in an attacker.

mohan

Almost same talk from wenger that we heard last time. youngsters who have everything in their locker and need not learn anything else technically. And surprise surprise, nothing materializes down the lane... Same old same old.

I am going to take everything Wenger says with a pinch of salt.

I hope at least 2 of these guys make the cut.

Ricky1985

No, it's not the same actually, if you've been paying attention. 🙂

That line you're "quoting' was Wenger talking 5 years or more ago about a couple of 14 year olds we had that had "nothing to learn technically". There is no "same as last time" because he's talking very specifically about a group of 6 or 7 youngsters from 16 to 20 years old. And trust me, I have watched all of these kids over the years, a few of the ones we have now are in a different class to anything I've seen before, barring Wilshere.

mohan

I understood that, Ricky. Its not literally same... but the intent is to say these guys are super talented and will have high probability of making it. He is again talking specifically similar to the last time and its just that, this Wenger talk gets the hopes up so much as we cannot see these players (being out of london and all that) and there is no output..almost 0%. If he just makes a generic statement, its fine. but him praising so much leads to us trying to find videos of them and talking shit about them to a lot and then realizing its a 0.00001% chance they make it.

Just sick of it.

Ricky1985

I get it. Been there, seen it and done it.

Even then, we've still had Bellerin, Coquelin and now Iwobi come into the team in the past 18 months or so. There's a couple that were 'nailed on' like Gnabry that have disappointed, but with mitigating circumstances, and others that are out on loan and not setting the world alight but Wenger never spoke of them as he does Willock, Jeff et al. And neither did I!

Let's see what Wenger does with this great generation, as he calls it.

Klaus

Have you heard any more about how Zelalem's doing, Ricky? I gather that he hasn't played much during the last few months for some reason, but I don't know why.

lorddulaarsenal

I read today that he'll be part of wengs plans for the first team squad next season

I recon wengs may just add one or two external senior players then go with youth to fill the gaps

Savz

He hasn't played since early February and his form has fallen off.

Ricky1985

Klaus wrote:
Have you heard any more about how Zelalem's doing, Ricky? I gather that he hasn't played much during the last few months for some reason, but I don't know why.

I read a loan report on some Arsneal blog a week or two back written by a Rangers fan.

The gist was that Zelalem lacks personality on the pitch, that he's obviously technically skilled but passes too safe and doesn't have a good understanding of when to play more incisive; when he tries it, which isn't often enough, he doesn't try at the right times. He just hasn't been able to get in the team because of that.

And apparently Rangers have had some kid come through the ranks in a similar position that is taking his place.

I get the distinct feeling from reading lots of different things over the season that you have to temper a lot of what Rangers fans say with the fact that they're a proud club with a big fan base that doesn't particularly like training players for other clubs. So of course this kid they have is better than Zelalem or some other player that's on their books that they actually own.

However, Zelalem's time there has thrown up the same problems as we saw from him in the Reserves here; he just doesn't have enough drive or aggression on the pitch. Games pass him by too often and so his technical excellence doesn't result in much.

He did play for them the other night in the game where they clinched promotion back to the Scottish top flight, so I'm sure that would have been an amazing experience for him. He's also a player that needs players on his wavelength to link with and feed off, so I'm not writing him off, and I wouldn't be shocked if Wenger did bring him into the fold next season. And I wouldn't be shocked if he did well. Hopefully he will be tougher than the kid that went away in August.

Maybe Tam can tell us more if he logs on and sees this.

Klaus

Cheers Ricky. I was curious because I've read the same things about him from various places.

It's been suggested that he's got a particular problem with creating room for himself on the field, and that struck me as a bad sign for a player whose job is supposed to be to open up play for others. He seems to struggle to pull off quality passes unless he gets enough time and space on the ball. Apparently Tottenham had a young guy they loaned out to Rangers too who started getting games ahead of Zelalem despite being much more one-noted.

You never know with these kind of experiences, they could become part of the learning curve for young players sometimes, but they've also been known to make them less than what they were. Zelalem's lack of aggression and drive on the field has looked like a problem to me too, on admittedly very limited viewing.

ElGeniodeOviedo

You would think that at least some of these players (Iwobi, Jeff, Akpom, one out of Crowley/Maitland-Niles/ Willock) will be ready for squad filling roles starting next season.

Really what that should mean is that we should be trying to shift some of the older deadwood out (Theo, Ox, Campbell, Giroud/Welbeck along with the obvious FlamArtRos group) over the next year or two and giving the younger players a chance to shine.

Accordingly, we should really only be buying "ze top, top quality" as Wenger would say, and we really shouldn't be making purchases like Giroud, Podolski, Gabriel, and even Elnenny (although he's done well) into the foreseeable future. Quality rather than quantity is needed

As an aside, do any of the reserve watchers think Iwobi or Jeff could be converted into a CF? I know Iwobi has played there in the past

Rex

That sounds eerily close to Project Youth and, let me tell you, that wasn't pretty. The way I see it, you shouldn't make space for kids because it is 'their time' or whatever. They should get in only on merit. For instance, we have three senior central midfielders who all, hopefully, leave at the end of the season. We have already added Elneny, but in my view we need another top class, proper, mature player in there as well. Then, by all means, give that third open spot to Zelalem, The Jeff, or some other kid. That same logic should, IMO, be applied throughout the squad. At CB, for instance, we already have that kid in there in Chambers. Spots taken. I'm not Campbell's biggest fan, but I wouldn't want to flog him, or Ox, and just give their numbers to some kid who has shown promise at reserve level.

ElGeniodeOviedo

The difference between "Project Youth" and what I'm proposing is that those sides were mostly blooding youngsters in the first Xl (Song, Denilson, Sczc, Djorou). I'm talking about signing the likes of Higuain and Griezmann and then having the youngsters make up the majority of the squad players. This is similar to what Barca has been doing for years, obviously successfully

ElGeniodeOviedo

Also, Project Youth's failings had a lot to do with not-so-young wasters like Almunia, Silvestre, Chamakh, Vermaelen and perma-crocks we were relying on like Rosicky, Diaby and Gibbs as much as it had to do with the actual youth

Rex

Barcelona can do it because it is easier to cope with one or two inexperienced players when they get to play with Suarez, Messi, Neymar, Iniesta and the lot. We are certainly not there the way I see it.

jones

est wrote:
Ricky1985 wrote:
Willock has gone up in my estimation after watching him last night. Looked the most dangerous attacker on the pitch and he just doesn't give the ball away, you can't get it off him.

One on one, you can forget about it?

It's "one v one", he said it hundreds of times how could you get it wrong? 😆

Clrnc

El Genio de Oviedo wrote:
You would think that at least some of these players (Iwobi, Jeff, Akpom, one out of Crowley/Maitland-Niles/ Willock) will be ready for squad filling roles starting next season.

I have been reading loan reports and apparently the 2 most impressive players out on loan for us has been Toral and Wellington. Maybe they can do a squad filling role for us as 5th choice in their respective positions while we focus big money moves.

Klaus

Wasn't Mick McCarthy waxing lyrics over Maitland-Niles too? I think he might be the one closest to stepping up next year.

est

jones wrote:
est wrote:
One on one, you can forget about it?

It's "one v one", he said it hundreds of times how could you get it wrong? 😆

My apologies.

goon

Klaus wrote:
Wasn't Mick McCarthy waxing lyrics over Maitland-Niles too? I think he might be the one closest to stepping up next year.

Maitland-Niles could probably do with playing another season or six months on loan, maybe in the Premier League this time. Only turns 19 at the start of next season so he's still young.

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