Ricky1985 wrote:

We'll have to wait and see, but he's going to score a phenomenal amount of goals at whatever level the rest of his game enables him to play at, that is certain.

A behind the scenes look at the newly finished academy training centre at Hale End.

Looks like they've done a lot of good work there.  

Gazidis is alive after all then. Interesting to see the club have set a target of one academy player being integrated into the first team every two years. Also good to see they're making progress on the conditioning and injury prevention front at all levels of the club.

I hope that the criteria is the selection being based on merit.
I don't want to see any more prospects promoted to the senior squad to gain development via playing time.
I want that BS to stop with/without AW at the club.
Even the likes of Iwobi should have had a full season on loan in the first team at a Championship level club or above & preferably with a manager who is able to develop youth.

Why? I think Iwobi has been integrated very well into our squad and team.

As had Walcott, Ox, Wilshere, Rambo, Denilson, Song,
however each stalled in their progress once they'd become established, because AW's training methodology fails to provide balance as it almost exclusively prioritises technical development over all else.
As for Iwobi he has already shown signs of burn out via over use, as AW looks to play the same squad as often as possible in order to develop the 'intuitive style'.

Arsenal's "automatisms" are based on who you're playing with, rather than the system you're playing in. Both matter, but systems allow greater flexibility and can help account for the practical reality that you can't field the same players every week. Don't think Wenger has ever accepted this.

I think it's why the youth sides seem like there is some kind of system, while the senior side is a constant mess. Youth teams change rapidly, and systems are designed to hone skills, which demands some kind of specificity. What's nuts to me is that Wenger uses the senior side for remedial training, rather than skill reinforcement. It especially makes no sense when the system is so ill-defined. What exactly is Ox supposed to learn on our wing? Or Ramsey? The role is so loose that it doesn't really force the player to adapt and develop new skills, not to mention it's the bloody first team and not a training camp. He's doing it with Welbeck right now. It's maddening.

Hey, it worked with Pires...

flobaba wrote:

Hey, it worked with Pires...

Quite probably because of the stability in the rest of the squad and also that the players were already developed & only needed to develop the intuitive style.
Also helps that we had continuity when the players went to play internationals as well,
and even more so that the style of play was based upon pace & movement to create & exploit space,
and not about standing back to goal waiting for the pass to feet.

Did you see the off the ball movement from De Bruyne on that counter attack that led to a 2v1? Made that third man combo look so easy, and it took out the entire defence in just 3 one touch passes. Haven't seen stuff like that from Arsenal in a decade, it seems like.

We are so boring to watch. The youth team is no better. First of all, they're simply not that good because our scouting is average at best. More importantly, our coaching and player development is infected by the same malaise as the senior side. They just don't do things correctly.

The footballing world has passed us by while Wenger maintains complete control of the club and employs his outdated methods.

It's not that the football world has passed us. It's because we have regressed on: coaching defense, recruiting and retaining seniors, scouting youngsters, creating an identity. Everything basically. These much lauded managers are not doing anything that young Wenger has not done in his heyday

Claudius wrote:

It's not that the football world has passed us. It's because we have regressed on: coaching defense, recruiting and retaining seniors, scouting youngsters, creating an identity. Everything basically. These much lauded managers are not doing anything that young Wenger has not done in his heyday

http://talksport.com/football/arsenals-recent-transfer-policy-has-been-disaster-insists-gunners-legend-frank-mclintock

McLintock agrees.

“Arsenal were talking about challenging the likes of Barcelona, Real Madrid and Bayern Munich, and that why they moved to the new stadium. But if you look at the buys they are making, the best you can say is they are adequate.

“They are not players that are going to turn Arsenal around and have them right up there at the top of the league. I think the scouting system, this year especially, has been disastrous.
“If you look at Chambers, the two centre-halves, Gabriel and Mustafi, and Xhaka, they are quite good players but they are not Arsenal standard. I can’t see them getting in the top four. It doesn’t look good at the moment. That team is definitely not good enough to win a championship in the future.”

McLintock made it clear he was talking about "the last 4 buys" to be fair when it came to transfers, but his assessment of the squad is fair. This team does not have it in themselves to win the league, and I don't think Conte or Allegri or anyone else would win with these players. The main benefit of a different manager, rather, would be that they'd assemble a better team than Wenger is capable of assembling.

Klaus wrote:

McLintock made it clear he was talking about "the last 4 buys" to be fair when it came to transfers, but his assessment of the squad is fair. This team does not have it in themselves to win the league, and I don't think Conte or Allegri or anyone else would win with these players. The main benefit of a different manager, rather, would be that they'd assemble a better team than Wenger is capable of assembling.

Not so much the last 4 buys as that would include Perez & Cech, whereas he names Chambers, Gabriel, Mustafi & Xhaka, but it's still over 90m and 2 from last summer.

With a top level manager I'd expect to see the team improve both as individuals and as a team as a result of having a defined tactic and training to match.
I'd also expect to see a better shape & style that would better suit the squad  so as to exploit the strengths and mitigate the weaknesses.
For example I consider the use of a wide 4231 as being counter productive when we pass to feet and want the WFs to come inside to play narrow with the FBs overlapping.  If we're going to play through the middle then set up to do so from the outset.  If you play wide then do so with pace and look to use space.   As such I do not think our shape compliments the style, and that the 3421 suits our narrow style better.  Likewise if we want to exploit our available pace in attack combined with our passing ability from the likes of Xhaka, Cazorla & Ozil, then we should be looking to stay wide to open the pitch to create space.

It brings to mind a comment by Jonkers when he took over the Academy that one of the first things he changed was the lack of vertical passing between the lines.

I think we'd all agree that there isn't enough off the ball movement, and that we don't counterattack effectively. We've been saying this for a decade.

But for all the pointless passing to feet, we're not even good at possession. As we've seen time and again, put just a little pressure on us by pressing high, and it all falls apart. Are the players learning anything in training under Wenger and the same backroom staff he's had for 15-20 yrs? I doubt it.

kamikaze wrote:

I think we'd all agree that there isn't enough off the ball movement, and that we don't counterattack effectively. We've been saying this for a decade.

But for all the pointless passing to feet, we're not even good at possession. As we've seen time and again, put just a little pressure on us by pressing high, and it all falls apart. Are the players learning anything in training under Wenger and the same backroom staff he's had for 15-20 yrs? I doubt it.

Problem is that the rondos they do for their 1 touch ball control have frakk all movement unless you're the mug in the middle chasing the ball.
Likewise because we start with a wide 4231 there is too much space between players that the opposition can flood on the press and easily cut off the passing options.
We should only be passing to feet when we are playing to keep the ball, whereas Cruyff says you should be passing half a meter in front to have your team moving forward onto the ball and to have momentum and purpose.

Half a meter is still passing to feet. It's not a literal expression.

I don't think formation is the problem, we're just not well-drilled. We don't look as sharp with the ball as we should given our reputation as an expensive attacking side. A lot of counterattacking opportunities from promising situations either go unseen, or are wasted by a bad/wrong/missing pass. And in possession, our approach play is simple and predictable.

kamikaze wrote:

Half a meter is still passing to feet. It's not a literal expression.

I don't think formation is the problem, we're just not well-drilled. We don't look as sharp with the ball as we should given our reputation as an expensive attacking side. A lot of counterattacking opportunities from promising situations either go unseen, or are wasted by a bad/wrong/missing pass. And in possession, our approach play is simple and predictable.

Perhaps so, but the main point is that the ball is played in front of the player so they are moving forward to receive it rather than being static and only moving once the ball is received.  If you are moving forward onto the pass then you are facing towards goal and can see passing options as the play is in front of you. Other players in the attack then have a cause to make runs into space ahead of the ball because they can be seen and not waste energy in making movement that the player on the ball can not see.

Ben Sheaf. Was a centre midfielder until this season, I didn't really think he had much of a chance of making it here, though many did. Lacked athleticism and was too slow on the ball, but had a very good passing range and set piece delivery. He's been moved to centreback this season and has been very impressive there. Shown an appetite for defending that I didn't really see when he was in midfield. If the new formation is here to stay then his chances of playing for the first team have increased, could be a very good back three defender.

Someone I know was speaking to the Dad of a kid in our U16s earlier today. The kid in question is very highly rated actually. Anyway, he was saying that Arsenal had given £15,000 a week to Reiss Nelson and a £500,000 signing on fee! Not surprised given that City are rumoured to be offering Jadon Sancho £30,000 a week to stave off interest from other clubs, us included, but that's still a massive sum for a 17 year old that's got it all to do.

Sign of the times I guess. But they wonder why these kids often lose motivation....

Also said the Dutch guys were a pain in the arse to deal with and that he personally had to get Steve Morrow in to sort out problems he was having with one of them and his son.

Ricky1985 wrote:

Ben Sheaf. Was a centre midfielder until this season, I didn't really think he had much of a chance of making it here, though many did. Lacked athleticism and was too slow on the ball, but had a very good passing range and set piece delivery. He's been moved to centreback this season and has been very impressive there. Shown an appetite for defending that I didn't really see when he was in midfield. If the new formation is here to stay then his chances of playing for the first team have increased, could be a very good back three defender.

Hasn't Bielik(sp) also been converted from DM to being used as a ball playing CB?

Ricky1985 wrote:

Someone I know was speaking to the Dad of a kid in our U16s earlier today. The kid in question is very highly rated actually. Anyway, he was saying that Arsenal had given £15,000 a week to Reiss Nelson and a £500,000 signing on fee! Not surprised given that City are rumoured to be offering Jadon Sancho £30,000 a week to stave off interest from other clubs, us included, but that's still a massive sum for a 17 year old that's got it all to do.

Sign of the times I guess. But they wonder why these kids often lose motivation....

Also said the Dutch guys were a pain in the arse to deal with and that he personally had to get Steve Morrow in to sort out problems he was having with one of them and his son.

Typical AW scenario to pay overs based more on the player's potential rather than their current suitability/performances.

To be fair to Arsenal they have absolutely no choice. If they don't pay him that, his agent finds 5 other clubs that will (and then some). The kids hold all the cards in this situation whilst there are clubs that will pay them this crazy money. As I said, City are having a very similar problem with one for their big talents, Jadon Sancho.

I'd bet good money that Arsene Wenger really doesn't like it one bit.

And, yeah, Bielik has been training and playing as a centreback for 2 seasons now. And he's been on loan playing there since January too.

Ricky1985 wrote:

To be fair to Arsenal they have absolutely no choice. If they don't pay him that, his agent finds 5 other clubs that will (and then some). The kids hold all the cards in this situation whilst there are clubs that will pay them this crazy money. As I said, City are having a very similar problem with one for their big talents, Jadon Sancho.

I'd bet good money that Arsene Wenger really doesn't like it one bit.

And, yeah, Bielik has been training and playing as a centreback for 2 seasons now. And he's been on loan playing there since January too.

He may not like the amount but it's very much part of the club's financial and transfer strategy, as is the likely consequence of OTT wages etc.  The benefit being that you can sustain more youth prospects for the same fee and wages you'd pay for a top flight player.  The issues only come to the fore when they reach the senior squad and are still being paid above their actual performance levels.

An 11 minute hattrick for Reiss Nelson, Malen inches away from a hattrick of his own. Some good goals too.

Did anyone catch Arsenal U23 vs Man United U23 on Arsenal.com tonight? It finished 2-2 at the Emirates. Nelson and Nketiah with the goals. 2 assists for Cohen Bramall from left back, apparently he was very good going forward.

Malen missed a penalty to make it 3-1, whilst Nelson and Nketiah were withdrawn at half time because they will be playing tomorrow against Chelsea U18s - if we avoid defeat we'll win the U18 National League.

Here's the goals:

Also quite interesting that Chris Willock faced his older brother Matty Willock who was in United's midfield, whilst their younger brother Joe came on at half time.

Nketiah looks a real killer in the box doesn't he? He made that goal look so easy.

Bramall looked pretty impressive there, electric pace! How's he been doing?

U23s have hardly played recently. I watched him in the flesh a month or so back and he was very impressive. A little raw here and there in possession but astoundingly quick on the overlap. Got a good, powerful cross on him too.

Segway wrote:

Nketiah looks a real killer in the box doesn't he? He made that goal look so easy.

He is a killer, 100%. The rest of his game is starting to look better too because he's gotten noticeably quicker and stronger. When he first stepped up to the U23s he couldn't compete at all.

He's a very, very smart player in the final third generally. Like very good scorers normally are. Nothing flashy but clever.

Interesting. Lethal strikers are hard to come by these days so he might have a decent chance of making it here.

That looked to me more like a fortunate bad touch than anything. Also the defending was pretty shoddy for that second goal.

Looks like we've got some pacy youngsters, which is good. But I prefer intelligent players so I hope Ricky's evaluation is accurate.

We'll see how he does out on loan, there's plenty of players prolific at youth level who fail to be prolific at any level thereafter. I may be wrong but a lot of his goals seem to be scuffed in... I know they all count but I don't trust a goalscorer who can't get a clean strike on the ball.

Trust me, he can hit hard and clean with little back lift. Not seen him bang any in the top corner from 25 yards or anything like that but he consistently bangs it in the bottom corner with both feet.

He's not going to be Afobe or Akpom, now they really are scuffers, he genuinely does have a touch of genius about him in the box. One of those players that just seem to know the best move to make in and around goal.

Shame he doesn't have Akpom's or even Afobe's body but he still has time to develop. He could be very interesting. I do wonder what level he could get a loan at. We've got to get him a good one to give him a chance.

flobaba wrote:

That looked to me more like a fortunate bad touch than anything. Also the defending was pretty shoddy for that second goal.

Looks like we've got some pacy youngsters, which is good. But I prefer intelligent players so I hope Ricky's evaluation is accurate.

I agree it was a slightly loose touch but that's not the norm with him. He's very efficient.

Reiss Nelson is not about speed, his awareness and decision making is perhaps his best quality. You'll like him.

Joe Willock, Matty Willock and Chris Willock. Pretty cool.

Unfortunately the U18s have lost 3-1 at Chelsea today. Nketiah scored for us against his old club. Chelsea need only to beat Reading U18s on Friday to retain the National League title.

Sounds like the whole day went badly, our team bus broke down and kick off had to be delayed. No shame in losing to Chelsea - they spend a lot of money and take this level very seriously (and then never produce a single player for the first team!).

Ricky1985 wrote:

Joe Willock, Matty Willock and Chris Willock. Pretty cool.

Unfortunately the U18s have lost 3-1 at Chelsea today. Nketiah scored for us against his old club. Chelsea need only to beat Reading U18s on Friday to retain the National League title.

Sounds like the whole day went badly, our team bus broke down and kick off had to be delayed. No shame in losing to Chelsea - they spend a lot of money and take this level very seriously (and then never produce a single player for the first team!).

It's all about the money CFC raise by selling players as it's a deliberate revenue stream.

Unfortunately I know all about their practices.

Got better as the season went on. You could see his confidence growing as he started to realise he could score at higher levels.

He's got much better footwork than I credited him for. He's a good finisher but still think he scuffs his shots a little.