You want to know what I think is the hardest thing to swallow? That he seems to show no remorse whatsoever. Instead, he points his racist little finger at everyone else.

Timothy wrote:

The biting stuff is way overblown IMO. It's just so unusual and people don't really understand it. I would much rather someone bite me on my arm than elbow me in the face, for example.

Obviously the Evra incident is much harder to forgive, but I do feel Liverpool hung him out to dry a bit. Doesn't everyone deserve a second chance, a fresh start?

Don't be so melodramatic Tim 🙂
You cannot rehabilitate a sociopath just by having them switch football clubs.
I understand that people want to downgrade Suarez's various misdemeanors in light of the possibity of us signing him, but I think you're kidding yourselves if you think he will ever change.
It's who he is. That's what you have to deal with as well as the brilliance.
I think people should accept that when arguing reasons for us to sign him.

If anything, Suarez seems a better player when he is in full cuntish flow.

y va marquer wrote:
Timothy wrote:

The biting stuff is way overblown IMO. It's just so unusual and people don't really understand it. I would much rather someone bite me on my arm than elbow me in the face, for example.

Obviously the Evra incident is much harder to forgive, but I do feel Liverpool hung him out to dry a bit. Doesn't everyone deserve a second chance, a fresh start?

Don't be so melodramatic Tim 🙂
You cannot rehabilitate a sociopath just by having them switch football clubs.
I understand that people want to downgrade Suarez's various misdemeanors in light of the possibity of us signing him, but I think you're kidding yourselves if you think he will ever change.
It's who he is. That's what you have to deal with as well as the brilliance.
I think people should accept that when arguing reasons for us to sign him.

I don't think it's a case of people downgrading anything. I bet Tim had the same views before the rumours

I've accepted the cuntishness. That's why I am happy for us to sign him.

But then, Evra incident aside, it's probably easy for me to accept his on field baggage because I am a horrible cunt when I play competitive sport, and I don't think it makes me a bad person.

The biting thing is just weird, as you say. Breaks a taboo, which I guess makes it harder to understand. But for me, it's the fact that he's done it twice which is even stranger - presumably after he did it in Holland, people sat him down and asked him what the fuck was going on inside his head. To then do it again suggests that the probability of him 'learning' from the racist incident is probably a lot lower too.

Someone just needs to tape up his mouth before the game. No racist comments, no biting and no constant whining and moaning.

Timothy wrote:

I've accepted the cuntishness. That's why I am happy for us to sign him.

But then, Evra incident aside, it's probably easy for me to accept his on field baggage because I am a horrible cunt when I play competitive sport, and I don't think it makes me a bad person.

I would have taken him if the Evra incident never happened, just like I would take Rooney. Could have even got a laugh out of his antics.

He crossed the line though, for me.

@lorddulaarsenal wrote:
y va marquer wrote:

Don't be so melodramatic Tim 🙂
You cannot rehabilitate a sociopath just by having them switch football clubs.
I understand that people want to downgrade Suarez's various misdemeanors in light of the possibity of us signing him, but I think you're kidding yourselves if you think he will ever change.
It's who he is. That's what you have to deal with as well as the brilliance.
I think people should accept that when arguing reasons for us to sign him.

I don't think it's a case of people downgrading anything. I bet Tim had the same views before the rumours

Yes it is.
I don't remember any of you defending him or being in any way as born again Christian as you're being now 🙂.
Which I guess is fine - I just wouldn't be expecting him to bounce in here and transform the team or our prospects.

I bet you'll find nobody has changed their view. Maybe they were joining in with the laughs but a lot of people just saw the headlines and thought "oh dear wot a wolly" then moved on

y va marquer wrote:
@lorddulaarsenal wrote:

I don't think it's a case of people downgrading anything. I bet Tim had the same views before the rumours

Yes it is.
I don't remember any of you defending him or being in any way as born again Christian as you're being now 🙂.
Which I guess is fine - I just wouldn't be expecting him to bounce in here and transform the team or our prospects.

I'd take Saurez here and I'd have said the same 4 months ago.

Yep cos he's a good player, albeit one who sits on the norty step every now and then

Y va: not in my case it's not. I probably got stuck in to him at the time of the Evra incident, but that aside I've never particularly had a problem with him. I've always respected players who are pretty open about the fact that they're prepared to do anything to win, as long as they're not crippling anybody (and even then I can sometimes empathise e.g Roy Keane on Haaland).

Rex wrote:

You want to know what I think is the hardest thing to swallow?
That he seems to show no remorse whatsoever.
Instead, he points his racist little finger at everyone else.

After reading both sides of the argument, i am unmoved and agree with this completely.
Add lying to biting, diving, cheating and disloyalty to complete the description of the man.
I would not want him however well he was playing and will never cheer him.
I say this because, however hard i tried, i never could fully back Sol despite him being an angel compared to most footballers and giving his all to our cause. This dick doesn't even try and pretend he isn't a mercenary so i am pretty sure where i stand with him.

Timothy wrote:

Y va: not in my case it's not. I probably got stuck in to him at the time of the Evra incident, but that aside I've never particularly had a problem with him. I've always respected players who are pretty open about the fact that they're prepared to do anything to win, as long as they're not crippling anybody (and even then I can sometimes empathise e.g Roy Keane on Haaland).

I genuinely don't think that with Suarez that it has as much to do with winning as it has to do with him being a sociopath.
I'd be happy to have more hard as nails, uncompromising, on the edge players in our ranks.
Suarez is not in that category for me.
Diving, pinching, biting - pathetic really.
Anyway I know you're dead honest and fair in your opinions and I do see where you're coming from, so I'll leave it at that.
I am really going to be bugged if we sign him though, can't stand him 🙂

y va marquer wrote:
Clrnc wrote:

How about after 10 seasons of prolific scoring and playmaking, and then retiring at our club with a testimonial?

He'd last two seasons here max.
I don't believe the rabid psycho in him can be reined in by Wenger, he'll be a regular thorn in our sides.
I really think you guys are fooling yourselves on this one.
Unfortunately I think we may sign him so I'm going to have to get used to the idea.

Forget those stuffs, seriously if he last 10 seasons here would people still hate him for being a racist? It would be a total non-issue. Thats how fickle fans are.

Timothy wrote:

Y va: not in my case it's not. I probably got stuck in to him at the time of the Evra incident, but that aside I've never particularly had a problem with him. I've always respected players who are pretty open about the fact that they're prepared to do anything to win, as long as they're not crippling anybody (and even then I can sometimes empathise e.g Roy Keane on Haaland).

So true. I particularly like players who go all out to win too.

Thats why I never disliked Gallas during his time here. I felt he gave his all everytime he is on the pitch.

y va marquer wrote:

Don't be so melodramatic Tim 🙂
You cannot rehabilitate a sociopath just by having them switch football clubs.
I understand that people want to downgrade Suarez's various misdemeanors in light of the possibity of us signing him, but I think you're kidding yourselves if you think he will ever change.

Of course people can modify their behavior, especially in different environments. We're not talking about changing him as a person deep down inside.

The only real issue for me is the racism. Personally I've become indifferent to the personalities of footballers. Unless he's part of some sort of supremacist group that goes around biting black folks in his spare time, I'm prepared to give him the benefit of the doubt that he's not a racist scumbag, but just a penis with no sense of what is socially acceptable.

He just needs to be loved. Maybe we can change him.

I'm surprised at how many of you have such belief in the power of people to change and modify their behaviour.
It's actually very rare that people do.

y va marquer wrote:

I'm surprised at how many of you have such belief in the power of people to change and modify their behaviour.
It's actually very rare that people do.

I've seen it plenty of times with my own eyes, and in far more profound ways than simply learning not to be a dick at work.

Personality is what's difficult to change.

As far as the racist comments go. It's the equivalent of someone calling me a bloody sexy honky or cracker or vanilla face

That's nothing if one of your mates calls you that, but if Evra says that then he will suffer the consequences.

Point is, there's no rhyme or reason to any of this. He's a brilliant footballer, and that's all I really care about. He's not my mate, I don't have to work alongside him.

otfgoon wrote:
y va marquer wrote:

I'm surprised at how many of you have such belief in the power of people to change and modify their behaviour.
It's actually very rare that people do.

I've seen it plenty of times with my own eyes, and in far more profound ways than simply learning not to be a dick at work.

Personality is what's difficult to change.

Caving into an unprovoked and uncontrolled compulsion to bite someone on the neck would lead to immediate dismissal in most workplaces 🙂
You've witnessed similar types of beaviour and seen the person involved change profoundly for the better?
With Suarez we're not just dealing with someone who is rude or socially inept.

Little bit disingenuous. This is football, Ivanovic is a centre back and Suarez is a centre forward, there's always some sort of provocation and an urge for retaliation.

Ivanovic did zip to provoke Suarez in that situation - that's why the incident appeared so mental.
People who can't control violent compulsions generally use the provocation line of defence.
That is one of the main reasons that it's exceptionally difficult to rehabilitate them.
It's never their fault.

He is a footballer and surely kicking Ivanovic for no reason at all would be being mad enough.
Devouring his arm is a little bit much, imo.

y va marquer wrote:

Ivanovic did zip to provoke Suarez in that situation - that's why the incident appeared so mental.

suarez went mental in that situation, but there is constant provocation between strikers and defenders throughout any match.

As I said, Suarez is a centre forward and Ivanovic a centre half, there would have been provocation and niggle all game. Goes with the territory. Ivanovic rakes his studs down Saurez's achilles and nobody bats an eyelid, leaves his elbow in when winning a header, not a big deal.

It's just the nature of the Suarez retaliation that people have trouble getting their heads around.

And they have trouble getting their heads around it because it was nuts.