Song is very good in fairness, and we have definitely missed him.

I thought Song was great here, one of my favourite players

I liked Song and I reckon people thought he was a little cocky for his position and duties.

We don't miss him that much though. Look at our league position.

Not particularly interested in defending Song who i thought was an extremely useful squaddy based on the fact that we had invested so much time in developing him and he hardly ever broke down physically but, seriously, was scraping 4th on the last day good enough for you?
The last 6 months of worry must have taken 6 months off my life expectancy!

Captain wrote:

Do you think we have missed him this season?

I don't. He's barely squad player level for a serious team.

I was of the opinion last season that you need a player similar to Song to succeed in Premier League but I've changed my mind. Arteta's defensive game is on pair with Gilberto's for me despite him not being overly physical or particularly quick. It has even improved since Song moved, which effectively puts the idea that Song was the one who was bringing defensive stability to rest. Not that I ever agreed with it.

That's not to say Song didn't have qualities, but his main contribution last season was going forward and its importance was emphasised mainly because we had no Cazorla and no Wilshere. Can't say I've missed him one bit since the team started to settle.

Think Song is a bit underrated by us; he had one major weakness - his positioning, but added to his lack of pace makes him a very flawed midfielder(should at least have pace or good positioning).

However when used properly ie say infront of the back 4 with little area to cover(fullbacks, dropping deep to help the CBs), he can be a WALL. Just compare his performances in 2009/2010(played as a holding midfielder) with his performances in his last 2 seasons with us(as a box to box midfielder), difference is like day and night from a defensive point of view which is in itself not a surprise given his strengths and weaknesses. Song was very strong in the duels(hardly lost a 50/50), very good in the air, good passer, decent vision, good touch, was very skilful and had very good close control which enabled him to dribble through a crowded area(premium quality for a central midfielder to have).

I always thought he needed upgrading, but we shouldn't have sold him and given a free pass to our squad players into the 1st team(I have little doubt Wenger would have been starting him if he wasn't sold), but we should have added another 15m to the 15m we sold him for and gone for someone like Martinez.

Anyway, Williams - please no.

Klaus wrote:

Can't say I've missed him one bit since the team started to settle.

Since Diaby was forcibly removed from the reckoning, Ramsey has stepped up and Wilshere has been more regularly available, so Song's absence has been felt far less keenly.

It was still foolhardy to sell him given our struggles before that time last season, and we still need another reliable CM of around his level. It would be more than convenient if he was still a settled, productive Arsenal player.

It feels since we managed to qualify for the CL on the last day people have become rather complacent about that achievement. Our finish was well and truly against the odds, and we're not necessarily good enough to repeat it.

Anyway, Williams thread, sorry.

Burnwinter wrote:

It feels since we managed to qualify for the CL on the last day people have become rather complacent about that achievement. Our finish was well and truly against the odds, and we're not necessarily good enough to repeat it.

This is usually my argument when people talk about our superb defence.

I too think it was a big mistake on Wenger's part to put any faith in Diaby for what it's worth, but I thought the discussion was about whether we missed Song as a player and not just any player. There was clearly a gap to fill when the season started because we had sold a regular starter.

Klaus wrote:

This is usually my argument when people talk about our superb defence.

Indeed. If our defence performed above expectations, then the baseline expectation of this squad (before transfers) would be that we'll fail to qualify for the CL next season. We need reinforcements quite urgently.

Klaus wrote:

There was clearly a gap to fill when the season started because we had sold a regular starter.

I just look at our squad now and think we'd be sorted for the two deeper midfield positions with Arteta, Ramsey, Wilshere and Song on the books.

But of course we don't have Song and Jack will be moved forward, which actually leaves us quite short.

Plus I wouldn't be surprised if Wenger gives Diaby yet another chance - and even I'm done with that. :o

Rumours is we're after Ashley Williams

Surely someone is stupid enough to buy Diaby.

If you have ever heard Wenger talk about formations and what you need in midfield, it is easy to see why he persists with Diaby but even his patience has to wear thin at some point.

Ramsey was a disaster for the first half of the season, and didn't really provide much until the final quarter or so. Song would have been a massive bonus for us this year.

Captain wrote:

Surely someone is stupid enough to buy Diaby.

If you have ever heard Wenger talk about formations and what you need in midfield, it is easy to see why he persists with Diaby but even his patience has to wear thin at some point.

Would you happen to have a link to a particularly good interview? I haven't watched an Arsene interview in ages, but I'd be interested in hearing his views on formations and the midfield.

Irish gunner wrote:

Captain wrote:

Surely someone is stupid enough to buy Diaby.

If you have ever heard Wenger talk about formations and what you need in midfield, it is easy to see why he persists with Diaby but even his patience has to wear thin at some point.

Would you happen to have a link to a particularly good interview? I haven't watched an Arsene interview in ages, but I'd be interested in hearing his views on formations and the midfield.

These are the two videos that I was thinking of but I can't find the translated versions. They're a few years old now, so you may have seen them before.

I can remember a few points of interest but maybe one of our french speakers can provide a proper translation for better accuracy..?

asajoseph wrote:

Ramsey was a disaster for the first half of the season, and didn't really provide much until the final quarter or so. Song would have been a massive bonus for us this year.

that's because he was being played out of position. No comparison, unless you are talking about playing Song on the wings as well.

Diaby replaced Song adequately for me during the first quarter of the season where Abou was quite impressive in a few games. We missed him badly after he got injured and totally lost our shape, resulting in that bad run of games that really costed our ability for a outside chance of a title challenge.

Come to think of it, the Arteta injury that gave Ramsey a chance in central mid was such a blessing in disguise.

Ramsey was a disaster wherever he played in midfield. He didn't only play RW.

asajoseph wrote:

Ramsey was a disaster for the first half of the season, and didn't really provide much until the final quarter or so. Song would have been a massive bonus for us this year.

I 100% endorse this Asajoseph™ post. Common sense efficiently delivered.

Song was ever present and had contributed to our equally porous midfield for the best part of two years. Disaster or not, Ramsey barely played there for most of the season and, overall, the midfield was equal to any that had featured Song for a long time.

"Massive bonus" is stretching it to breaking point.

Our midfield became much weaker without Cesc due to the loss of threat and ball retention, but was even more porous once Song left. We improved that situation towards the end of the season by playing deeper, getting some sense into Ramsey and moving Cazorla to the wing.

We got walked all over in midfield a lot last season (though we did last as well). Asa's point that we would've been much more stable if we'd continued through to Christmas playing something like Arteta, Song, Cazorla/Wilshere behind Podolski, Giroud, Walcott seems spot on.

After Christmas when Arteta was injured and we had a string of shitty results with Diaby on the pitch … well speaks for itself doesn't it.

I don't think so. We controlled the middle third just as well (or poorly, if you like) as ever for most of the season and had a notable upturn once Ramsey found his way.

Maybe you guys believe that the midfield was good or even fine during the last few seasons, but to my mind it has been a constant weakness since 2010-2011 and maybe even before that.