Computer games: Page 207 - The Arsenal discussion forum and community: One More in the Tolly

Computer games

Qwiss

jones wrote:
I'm not a native speaker obviously but I always felt "partner" sounds way too sterile to refer to your significant other, a relationship is not exactly a law firm. Not sure what the problem is with using the actual terms wife or husband, if one associates traditional or archaic roles with them that's on them to change imo.

What if you're not married? I used it before I was married because saying "girlfriend" sounded stupid for someone I lived with, had a child with and had been with for 10+ years.

Daz

Yeah there's that too. We had lived together and had a child before we got married too, so we probably kept using partner partly out of habit.

jones

Burnwinter wrote:
I would almost always use "my partner" after getting serious about a relationship (and I use it about my girlfriend).

I'm not particularly political about it myself, because I don't have to be, but in a country that has only just legalised same sex marriages including those between trans people who may have a complicated legal status, the political content of retaining the words "wife" and "husband" together with the associated historical cis-and-hetero-normative assumptions and values is fairly obvious.

The question of how best to address that content is a bit less obvious. I know quite a few LGBT people and they would have different views on the subject.

Well usually you use the terms to refer specifically to your own husband or wife and not to address the whole world at once where indeed some might not be adequately addressed

Qs point I can relate to. Although again that's not a problem I have to deal with because both in German and Arabic you use the terms woman or man instead of wife or husband, I'm not married yet myself so this allows me to bypass the "girlfriend" term which indeed sounds silly if you're over 20

Burnwinter

Well usually you use the terms to refer specifically to your own husband or wife and not to address the whole world at once where indeed some might not be adequately addressed

Not really my point, as there's content to the way you talk and speak that goes beyond your own relationships and has a social effect.

As I said anyway, it's not cut and dried, I'm not arguing the terms "husband" and "wife" should be made obsolete. But for whatever reason—most probably because it's quite commonplace in Australia—I use "partner".

QuincyAbeyie

I too enjoy video games.

Burnwinter

Fuck you.

Mirth

😆

Qwiss

Quincy Abeyie wrote:
I too enjoy video games.

😆

Klaus

😆

Qwiss

This is how gamergate started.

Burnwinter

It's not about pointlessly trying to stop a relatively interesting conversation on a very quiet forum. It's about ethics in thread topic discipline.

Asterix

Burnwinter wrote:
Fuck you.

😆 😆

Qwiss

Burnwinter wrote:
It's not about pointlessly trying to stop a relatively interesting conversation on a very quiet forum. It's about ethics in thread topic discipline.

😃

Irishgunner

Qwiss! wrote:
jones wrote:
I'm not a native speaker obviously but I always felt "partner" sounds way too sterile to refer to your significant other, a relationship is not exactly a law firm. Not sure what the problem is with using the actual terms wife or husband, if one associates traditional or archaic roles with them that's on them to change imo.

What if you're not married? I used it before I was married because saying "girlfriend" sounded stupid for someone I lived with, had a child with and had been with for 10+ years.

That's usually how I interpret it when someone says partner. Not married, but it's a long term relationship with children/home ownership/whatever

jones

Burnwinter wrote:

Well usually you use the terms to refer specifically to your own husband or wife and not to address the whole world at once where indeed some might not be adequately addressed

Not really my point, as there's content to the way you talk and speak that goes beyond your own relationships and has a social effect.

What's the social effect of using the traditional terms? I'm not sure what kind of political content or fallout occurs when you're using it to describe your own partner.

Not having a go at you for using 'partner' by the way, I'm genuinely intrigued

Mirth

Irish gunner wrote:
Qwiss! wrote:
What if you're not married? I used it before I was married because saying "girlfriend" sounded stupid for someone I lived with, had a child with and had been with for 10+ years.

That's usually how I interpret it when someone says partner. Not married, but it's a long term relationship with children/home ownership/whatever

Yeah me too

Burnwinter

jones wrote:
What's the social effect of using the traditional terms? I'm not sure what kind of political content or fallout occurs when you're using it to describe your own partner.

Not having a go at you for using 'partner' by the way, I'm genuinely intrigued

Same reason feminists proposed calling a "chairman" a "chair", and a "fireman" a "firefighter" back in the 70s and 80s … gendered language defines normality and the horizons of the social imaginary.

I'll give you a slightly broader example, I was at the fiftieth anniversary dinner of the corporation I worked for, which was attended by five members of the Board from Holland.

Towards the end of the evening, the MC called the Board members, all men, up for a thank you for agreeing to fund the dinner … and gave each of them a commemorative plate.

Then the MC called all the "Board members' wives" up, thanked them for organising the catering and logistics, which apparently for some reason they'd actually done … and gave each of them a bunch of flowers.

That's the sort of space that doesn't really make room for people being unmarried, in unorthodox relationships, or in anything other than a traditional hetero marriage. The use of the term "Board member's wives" shows the integration of gender as a constitutive element of the institutions of home and workplace. These aren't necessarily huge things but they make the difference between people feeling included and recognised, or not.

But like I said I'm not sure I really use "partner" for this reason, it's pretty common in Australia, also I'm not married.

Qwiss

That makes sense for the occassion and for groups etc Burns but I don't think the problem you have their is how they define a) how their board members should behave and b) what a wifes place is in that.

I'm not dismissing your idea of the terms causing discomfort but I think you'd need to provide a better explanation or example. The only situation I can see a real problem in using the terms husband/wife to refer to someone independently of a situation like the one above is for people who identify in some sort of non-binary way and even then people have their own preferred pronouns etc Unless we dismiss gender entirely it makes sense to have gendered language. Its generally how the language is used that causes harm IMO.

Big Willie

Yup like Taylor in Billions season 2. The character identified as nonbinary amd preferred to be identified using gender neutral pronouns such as they, their and them. The person playing that character also identifies themselves this way in real life.

I can see why gender neutral terms would be important here. Doubt they'd ever be comfortable being called a wife or husband. They may be more comfortable with being called a partner or spouse. Can't say for sure though because I do not know anyone nonbinary.

That said my understanding of using the term partner is probably similar to that of IG.

Coombs

I like partner. It's a more accurate description of our relationship, and it feels better to say.

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